Auto help needed

[TIMMYDUCK]

I am usually a pretty resourceful guy, but we all get stuck sometimes.
I suppose I could go out and order the Chilton's manual, but thought I would ask here first.

On a 1997 Ford Taurus Staiton Wagon 3.0L
that needs help to get thru emissions
I have two ( 2) bad O2 sensors.
It is an OEM system that has 2 in front and 2 behind the cat.
The Diagnostic trouble codes are:
P0141:02 Sensor Heater Circuit Bank 1 Sensor 2
P0161:02 Sensor Heater Circuit Bank 2 Sensor 2

I have a front and a rear 02 sensor for the car already.
(They are different sensors front and back)
Problem is I don't know what set is Bank 1 or Bank 2 is and I don't know which sensor is # 2 in either case.

I have loked for a book everwhere, called Ford, gone to the library no help so far.

So if anyone knows Fords and can help me or point me in the right direction for this information I would be most grateful.

 

[nitrousjunkie]

I think both are rear,I would have to look in "trouble shooting" on a snap-on scan tool.

 

[oldbird]

hey timmy duck if you have not put the sensors on yet they are the two rear sensors bank 1 sensor 1 and bank 2 sensor 1 are the front sensors bank 1 is allways the side with #1 cylinder hope this helps

 

[TIMMYDUCK]

No, I haven't put them on yet , because if I don't do it right I will be buying another 130 buck worth of sensors.
Just need to get it done by Monday sometime.
So knowledge is money in this situation.

 

[racerV]

Well, I can see 3 problems.....FORD.....TAURUS......STATION WAGON. Take those three out and you should be ok.

 

[TIMMYDUCK]

hey timmy duck if you have not put the sensors on yet they are the two rear sensors  bank 1 sensor 1 and bank 2 sensor 1 are the front sensors bank 1 is allways the side with #1 cylinder hope this helps

So if your information is correct .
I need two ( 2) of the rear sensors.
Because as of right now I have 1 for in front and 1 for in back of the cat
It won't be a big deal exchanging the front one for a rear.
I just need to be sure I am changing the ones specified.

 

[TIMMYDUCK]

Well, I can see 3 problems.....FORD.....TAURUS......STATION WAGON.  Take those three out and you should be ok.

It's my sister's car .
Last time 2 years ago it was the cam lobe sensor that had to be changed to pass.
This is a good car really 127000 miles and doing ok.
Plus it is a lucky car.
She actually won it stuffing an entry box at the supermarket back in 1997.

 

[oldbird]

the heater circuit has its own power and ground if this car came into my shop i would check both power and ground before replacing the o2 sensors see if you can check the fuses first if you need i can send you a wiring diagram mon after work let me know

 

[TIMMYDUCK]

Will check power and grounds.
Thank you
These have never been replaced anyways and book says to do them at 90K.
I am a much better parts changer than diagnostic guy.
Diagram would be handy if 1st attemp fails.

 

[Noltez]

Bank 1 sensor 2, and Bank 2 sensor 2. Both are AFTER CAT sensors. The heater element becomming open is quite common - I get at least one a week with one of those two codes. The Taurus uses 2 cats up near the exhaust manifold, one on each bank. For each, there is a PRE and a POST 02 sensor. The Pre (Bank 1 or 2, Sensor 1) is the signal the ECM uses to trim the fuel maps. The POST (Bank 1 or 2, Sensor 2) is used to monitor Catalist efficiency, a requirement of Federal Emissions Laws both in the US and Canada. The codes you are getting will NOT affect your emissions once warmed up, but during those cruital ~5 mins during warm up, the sensors will not work. That is why the light is comming on.

Fords do have more electrical problems that the Toyotas I know, but I did work in a General shop for 7 years and never saw an O2 code that didn't trace down to the sensor itself. In a perfect world, you would hook multimeter to the power and ground wires of the 02 sensors in question, and start the engine cold. You're looking for 12-14V for the heater element. There are 3-4 wires on each sensor... you'll have to find which supply heater current and ground paths.

Good luck.



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[TIMMYDUCK]

Noltez, and everyone else.....
Thank you so much for the precise information.
Will be changing out both post cat sensors.
Hopefully it will clear the codes and pass the re-test.
In Ct they no longer stick a sniffer wand up your tailpipe.
All information is gathered thru the ECU plug in so if you have codes, they automatically fail you.

 

[chrisr]

If the cat monitors fix your problem, you will have to run the vehicle through a drive cycle to get a pass code. If you dont you will end up with a p1000. In ohio, you need a pass code in your system to pass the emmission test. Go to the library and get a pced manual and you will find in there on how to specifically perform a drive cycle to achieve a pass code. You also need at least a half tank of gas, and it should be at least 45 degrees out for the test to work...

 

[TIMMYDUCK]

If the cat monitors fix your problem, you will have to run the vehicle through a drive cycle to get a pass code.  If you dont you will end up with a p1000.  In ohio, you need a pass code in your system to pass the emmission test.  Go to the library and get a pced manual and you will find in there on how to specifically perform a drive cycle to achieve a pass code.  You also need at least a half tank of gas, and it should be at least 45 degrees out for the test to work...

I have already been to the Library, no go on the manual.
I was told that after 3 system tests come in clean ECU resets on it's own.