Gen 3 Black Widow 4-2 Downpipes

Armoni76

Registered
I wanted to share my feedback after trying the Black Widow 4-2 downpipes on my 2022 Hayabusa. Long story short : I do not recommend buying it.

Here is the whys :
  • Why the Black Widow ? Because I wanted to keep the 4-2 look of the busa, which is for me part of its DNA, and of course I was also looking a decat solution. And Yoshimura do not manufacture these anymore...
  • Why not keeping the Black Widow ? Because the sound was quite strange, it sounded weird and I felt like a big drop of torque even if the overall quality is good for the money
So I sended it back and reinstalled the original pipes.

Link for a video that might interest you (that I should have watch before), it is a comparaison between the original exhaust and the Black Widow :

Here is some pictures I took (weight is KG)

I hope that could help ;)

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I wanted to share my feedback after trying the Black Widow 4-2 downpipes on my 2022 Hayabusa. Long story short : I do not recommend buying it.

Here is the whys :
  • Why the Black Widow ? Because I wanted to keep the 4-2 look of the busa, which is for me part of its DNA, and of course I was also looking a decat solution. And Yoshimura do not manufacture these anymore...
  • Why not keeping the Black Widow ? Because the sound was quite strange, it sounded weird and I felt like a big drop of torque even if the overall quality is good for the money
So I sended it back and reinstalled the original pipes.

Link for a video that might interest you (that I should have watch before), it is a comparaison between the original exhaust and the Black Widow :

Here is some pictures I took (weight is KG)

I hope that could help ;)

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Are the diameter of the black widow pipes narrower and that’s the issue?
 
my guess would be the drop in tq has to do with the crossover location. on the stock header it’s closer to the exhaust port. the location will affect exhaust savaging and at what rpm range. good drag style exhaust systems eliminate them and move the power to the top range. however, if the exhaust isn’t tuned match the rpm range of the cams, velocity stacks, etc. the engine might not make as much power overall. this pic is a s1000rr header using a flapper to open and close the crossover pipe. the ecu can spread tq using this system.

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I have the Black Widow 4-2 headers sitting in my office waiting to go on my 2022 Busa. I also have a pair of Yoshi Carbon Fiber Slip-On Cans sitting here that will be mated to these headers. I plan on adding the pair valve block plates and a sprint P08 Filter and calling it a day. I am going to have the ECU flashed by Moore Mafia, and then if not happy doing their custom remote tune option. I really don't see how this combo is going to net me less HP or Torque but we will see. It's going to be at least a few more weeks before I have the time to dive into this project.

I have ? for Armoni76 though. After you installed these headers, what cans did you leverage and were there any other mods done to the bike. Did you have a proper tune flashed to the bike or dyno session. Your bad experience seems very circumstantial.
 
Still a work in progress but I got them on. My seat of the pants gauge says I did not loose any power, in fact I gained a lot of speed of the line and top end is just silly now. That said I did a lot of mods all at once. I went from bone stock to the following. Black Widow Headers 4-2, Dual Yosh Exhaust Cans, Pair Valve Delate with Brocks plates, Sprint P-08 Filter, and More Mafia ECU Flash. I also have the full Woolich setup and I am in the process of data logging my bike performance with the Wideband O2 sensor. Chris Moore will then be fine tuning my bike for this setup which is really the best of the best you can ask for. That said with just his base tune loaded so far its impressive.

Some other notes:

Install was fairly easy for the average hobbyist like myself. Getting the midpipe on the left side to not touch the oil pan was a real pain and and first I had a lot of exhaust leaks which are now all gone by making adjustments and using sealant to be safe. The overall quality is really nice and I'll give fitment an 8 of 10 being that left side was a real hassle to get correct, all mounting points were prefect though and my Yosh slip on bolted on without any hassles. I did remove the radiator and while at it flushed the coolant. That was really easy, not need to remove the oil coiler. I also replaced the stock header gaskets with new copper factory suzuki gaskets, I also replaced all 8 header bolts because the factory ones were slightly bent from the factory. I torqued the new ones down to 17-20 lbs, my wrench is not all the accurate. I removed the 2 O2 sensors and replaced with SS caps once the flash was installed. Once I am done data logging via the wideband ill cap that bung as well. I would also had at least 2-3 bottles of coolant on hand if draining the radiator, i used 2 full bottles and a splash from an old 3rd.

The sound the bike makes now is what I would classify and deeper and different. Its got its own characteristic that is more baritone in nature, not high pitch or ricey by any means. At full throttle it sounds pretty mean and does not drone or come off to load, I actually kind of wish the overall sound was a tad bit louder. When using the quick shifter the bike now makes this really really awesome split second back fire explosion sound that reminds me of a BMW M3 or M4, sounds really sick.

But again my overall setup is now much much quicker than stock all around. Bone stock I felt the bike was meh, somewhat fast, but no where near as quick as my GSXR 1000, at least not until you compare 80mph roll-ons to 150+ where it shines. Now my busa feels much much closer to my GSXR in terms of low speed pull. From 5500 - 8000 RPM this bike is now a beast, you can roll on the throttle and its just goes begging for more. So to those who claim they lost low end power I offer they may have had a bad tune to go with it, and or some serious exhaust leaks.

I for one am keeping mine and I am very happy with it thus far.

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Still a work in progress but I got them on. My seat of the pants gauge says I did not loose any power, in fact I gained a lot of speed of the line and top end is just silly now. That said I did a lot of mods all at once. I went from bone stock to the following. Black Widow Headers 4-2, Dual Yosh Exhaust Cans, Pair Valve Delate with Brocks plates, Sprint P-08 Filter, and More Mafia ECU Flash. I also have the full Woolich setup and I am in the process of data logging my bike performance with the Wideband O2 sensor. Chris Moore will then be fine tuning my bike for this setup which is really the best of the best you can ask for. That said with just his base tune loaded so far its impressive.

Some other notes:

Install was fairly easy for the average hobbyist like myself. Getting the midpipe on the left side to not touch the oil pan was a real pain and and first I had a lot of exhaust leaks which are now all gone by making adjustments and using sealant to be safe. The overall quality is really nice and I'll give fitment an 8 of 10 being that left side was a real hassle to get correct, all mounting points were prefect though and my Yosh slip on bolted on without any hassles. I did remove the radiator and while at it flushed the coolant. That was really easy, not need to remove the oil coiler. I also replaced the stock header gaskets with new copper factory suzuki gaskets, I also replaced all 8 header bolts because the factory ones were slightly bent from the factory. I torqued the new ones down to 17-20 lbs, my wrench is not all the accurate. I removed the 2 O2 sensors and replaced with SS caps once the flash was installed. Once I am done data logging via the wideband ill cap that bung as well. I would also had at least 2-3 bottles of coolant on hand if draining the radiator, i used 2 full bottles and a splash from an old 3rd.

The sound the bike makes now is what I would classify and deeper and different. Its got its own characteristic that is more baritone in nature, not high pitch or ricey by any means. At full throttle it sounds pretty mean and does not drone or come off to load, I actually kind of wish the overall sound was a tad bit louder. When using the quick shifter the bike now makes this really really awesome split second back fire explosion sound that reminds me of a BMW M3 or M4, sounds really sick.

But again my overall setup is now much much quicker than stock all around. Bone stock I felt the bike was meh, somewhat fast, but no where near as quick as my GSXR 1000, at least not until you compare 80mph roll-ons to 150+ where it shines. Now my busa feels much much closer to my GSXR in terms of low speed pull. From 5500 - 8000 RPM this bike is now a beast, you can roll on the throttle and its just goes begging for more. So to those who claim they lost low end power I offer they may have had a bad tune to go with it, and or some serious exhaust leaks.

I for one am keeping mine and I am very happy with it thus far.

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Glad you like it ! Decat always looks good !
 
I bought them from the link below. They are a gen 3 specific slip on kit. I simply wanted a full dual exhaust with dual carbon fiber cans, and this is currently the only way to pull it off when mating with the black widow headers, no thanks to Brocks Performance, don't even get me started with them.

 
I have to fall on my sword here and post an update.

After having some time to ride and mess with these headers I too ultimately decided to remove them.

The sound at full throttle sounded pretty good, and I miss the quick shift bang, but at low rpm and idle the sound just started to feel off and weird, similar to what others described as just off. I also had a hard time getting the fitment obsoletely perfect. The issue I had is that in order to get the right side of the header mid pipes to not touch the oil pan I had to torque everything down a little out of natural alignment. Maybe its just me but I couldn't get the fitment perfect and I felt like I was developing exhaust leaks all over. I used sealant etc but it really didnt help here. Even after tuning I did start to feel like under certain circumstances the low end power was starting to lack and that cruising around in a higher gear was more sluggish than should be. For now I have reverted back to the stock headers and the bike is running better. I'm probably going to embark on an adventure to gut my stock headers and weld in an X pipe. I just want a perfect full dual exhaust setup, is this so much to ask for.

I swear, Brock is on my list of people that royally piss me off. He has a dual full exhaust that almost fits the gen 3 perfect, yet he refuses to make the 1 minor change needed to product an out of the box full dual exhaust. He should lose his man card to be honest, just so upset with Brock over this, i've been calling and talking to those guys for nearly 2 years and still its been a hard no. You cant give money away in the country any more, what a joke.
 
Interesting experience. I had the 4>2 on my Gen 2 with Yoshi cans.
It actually went well on the dyno. Much better than the Delkovic 4>1 setup.
But thanks for your feedback
Hi I’m after buying a set to use with my yoshi cans
Can you give me more info ? Did you Jane a dyno tune and ecu flash ? Thanks for your help
 
i think we should all start calling/emailing brock and ask his majesty to tweak the 2 collector pipes of his Gen3 kit so they pass under the oil pan just fine. realistically we want at least a centimeter of clearance, generally.. exhaust pipes CAN move around due to vibration and whatnot, i don't want to get the black widow headers only to have it rubbing/smacking one side of the belly from time to time. i refuse to ever have janky poop like that on my vehicles and i'm not about to start now.

my current plan is when i have black widows in hand i'd take them to a good shop that i know and have them cut them up a little and rework them for clearance.

but we shouldn't have to do such things to begin with.

side note/edit; not sure the youtube vid in the OP is entirely relevant, as thats not a gen3. the gen3 engine is tuned noticeably differently, probly to deal with power loss caused by euro5 blahblah. if they cant make more power, they can at least move it around so that it feels better and thats apparently what they did, with the gen3 bikes.

also, the only fair way to judge this or any header/exhaust combo is if it really is correctly and ideally tuned, and has anyone (at least on this forum) even gotten that far? one or two guys are running whatever exhaust along with a tune but its an off the shelf tune.. ok great, anything else?

im not sure we're practicing proper and correct science here. happy to do so myself by putting all this together then throwing a canned tune on it, probly from 2WDW and THEN taking it to a local shop and tweaked further, on the dyno. but first must come headers that fkn fit correctly =P
 
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