Is the Hayabusa really top heavy?

[BentValve]

Top heavy? Is this just another myth going around...perhaps one well respected board member at some forum said this and it became fact somehow ..along with the Busa can't lean "fact"?

I cannot imagine how Suzuki could bring the weight down much further without shrinking the engine size down.

The Busa sits lower than the R1000 and alot of other sport bikes.

Hayabusa
Ground Clearance: 120mm (4.7 in.)
Overall Height: 1155mm (45.5 in.)
Overall Width: 740mm (29.1 in.)
Overall Length: 2140mm (84.3 in.)
05' R1000
Ground Clearance: 130mm (5.1 in.)
Overall Height: 1130mm (44.5 in.)
Overall Width: 710mm (28.0 in.)
Overall Length: 2030mm (80.0 in.)


Try and pick an R1000 up off the ground..it will feel top heavy too right?

 

[Mr Brown]

Seems to me like they feel top heavy in comparison to a literbike. It's not like some people seem to think, but I wouldn't describe the handling as nimble!

 

[shenoyp]

but I wouldn't describe the handling as nimble! [/QUOTE]

...try installing the rear raising links, it makes the busa... really very nimble

 

[Mr Brown]

but I wouldn't describe the handling as nimble!

...try installing the rear raising links, it makes the busa... really very nimble

[/QUOTE]
Not in comparison to any of the literbikes. Wheelbase is longer and it weighs more. I agree that what you said will make it MORE nimble, but it still wasn't designed to be a repli-racer.

 

[RandomNickname]

I think the Busa's perceived top heaviness is relative to what other people ride.

Hell go sit on a TL1000R, and then the Busa. The TL has a reigculously high CoG in comparison.

 

[pure_ego]

i think anybody thats every picked up a 'busa from it's side would agree that the weight is obviously centered very low..

it is 500 pnds (give or take) to pick up afterall.. and I ain't no brute ... but the only time ever found itself on its side it was .. "relatively" easy to get back up.. course I was freaking and probably had an adrenaline rush cuz afterall.. the busa is on it's side!!!!

haha.

 

[pure_ego]

but no.. the busa is heavy pig and won't turn at all... may as well weld the triples in a straight line only configurations.. if you need to turn it.. stop, get off, pick thefront up and reposition it and proceed.

 

[BulletTrain]

but no.. the busa is heavy pig and won't turn at all... may as well weld the triples in a straight line only configurations.. if you need to turn it.. stop, get off, pick thefront up and reposition it and proceed.

When I had my busa I preferred picking the rear up and bring it around rather than picking the front up. The grab bar was easier to get ahold of than trying to grab the forks below the upper fairing to do it.

All joking aside, in response to the original question... I have said before that the busa feels top heavy to me compared to the 10. I wasn't referring to picking the bike up. I was referring to where I feel the weight while riding and maneuvering the bike. Also, I might could have worded that better. Actually, it's not really "top heavy", as in... if it leans past 0 degrees sittin' still there's no stoppin' it from hittin' the ground. I guess what I really meant was that it feels to me like the busa has a higher center of gravity (COG). Not necessarily to a fault, but definitely something I could feel when going to the 10 from a busa. To me, the weight seems to be centered lower in the 10, making it balance and handle differently. Yeah, I know I'm a green horned rookie, but I know what I feel.

In comparison, the new '05 Gixxer also feels like the weight is higher in the chassis than it is on the 10. After sitting on and moving around on all the new bikes at the bike show, the only other bikes that seemed to carry their center of gravity as low as the 10 does was the '05 R6 and the CBR600RR. All the other bikes felt like the weight was at least a little higher in the frame. Fwiw, just from moving them around and rocking them side to side the weight difference between the busa and the new gixx was obvious in feel, but the center of gravity/balance seemed pretty similar. Also, those two bikes felt like they had the highest center of gravity out of all the bikes I messed around with at the show.

I've only got seat time on a busa, the 10, and limited time on a 6RR, but based on what I've felt riding those three very different bikes, I'd say that probably the only time the "top heavy"/COG issue is really, honestly noticeable in street riding is during low speed/parking lot maneuvers. If you're aggressive enough in some good enough twisties you could probably feel a difference in the tighter switchbacks when you're *REALLY* flicking side to side, but something tells me that the weight difference between the busa and litre bikes would make as much, if not more difference in feel when flicking at speed than COG.

Again, this is just my opinion based on my little bit of seat time on three different bikes, and from getting a feel for others at the bike show and at dealer showrooms. Don't take it for gospel. Your mileage may vary... I could be wrong... etc... Not looking to convince anybody, just throwin' out my take on the issue being discussed. That should be enough disclaimer, but somehow I'm afraid it won't be... Oh well...



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[BentValve]

Your input is appreciated. Well I came off an SV650 and I came into the Busa expecting certain characteristics. Flickability was not one I expected ...speding 2 years on the SV650 and jumping right on the Hayabusa felt very natural. Actually it was almost as if my skill from my SV650 transfered to being better skills on the Busa..if that makes any sence.

 

[BulletTrain]

Your input is appreciated. Well I came off an SV650 and I came into the Busa expecting certain characteristics. Flickability was not one I expected ...speding 2 years on the SV650 and jumping right on the Hayabusa felt very natural. Actually it was almost as if my skill from my SV650 transfered to being better skills on the Busa..if that makes any sence.

Actually it makes perfect sense.

I really, REALLY wish I had started out on a smaller bike and progressed up to a busa instead of starting out on one. I honestly feel like I could do the busa better justice in the twisties now that I've had some seat time on the 10. The busa being my first sport bike, I sort of let it's weight intimidate me a little in some situations. I feel like that kept me from having the confidence to push hard enough in those situations to really learn what I've learned on the 10. That's not the buas's fault though. I now know that it was largely a mental block on my part. I know a busa will handle better than I could (can) ride, but I couldn't make myself push it past a certain point so that I could learn to ride better.

The weight and feel of the 10 gave me confidence where I needed it and allowed me to push myself past some self imposed limits I had on the busa. I can't explain why, but the 10 gives me the feeling that I can do just about anything on it that I'm brave, or stupid enough to try. At this point I'm sure that even though there are obviously differences between the busa and 10 that make them handle and feel differently, the difference in my confidence was largely influenced by issues in my head.

I had formed the previously mentioned mental block based on the weight of the busa (which I now believe had/has a LOT less to do with anything than I made it out to back then) and at the same time those who were around back then will remember that I was convinced that a smaller, lighter bike would allow me to learn more, quicker. Well, it has, but not exactly for the reasons I originally expected. I thought the weight and handling differences would be my saviors, but instead I'm coming to realize more and more that the biggest difference between Train and Diablo was likely my own confidence level. Just goes to prove that what they say is more right than we care to admit sometimes. "IT'S ALL ABOUT THE RIDER!"

At this point even though I've still got plenty more to learn about riding, I'm confident enough now with my abilities that I don't think the weight issue I had with the busa would really come into play anymore. Having gained enough confidence on the 10 to push past some of my limits and beat some of my mental demons, I think I'm to the point that I could be equally comfortable confidence wise on most any sport bike with a halfway decent suspension set-up. I think I could be equally as "SLOW" on a busa as I am the 10 at this point. (That SLOW comment was a slam on my slow arse ridin', not on the busa.

)

But back to your post... I can see where going from the 10 to a busa now would seem to make my skills seem better than they seem on the 10. I know going to the ragged edge natured 10 from the forgiving busa showed me a LOT of faults in my riding skills and rider inputs. It only makes sense that going back to the busa now with my somewhat refined skill set from getting smooth on the 10 would give me the impression that my skills actually improved going to the busa.

Anyway, sorry to get so long winded...

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[wizeguy]

Your input is appreciated.   Well I came off an SV650 and I came into the Busa expecting certain characteristics.  Flickability was not one I expected ...speding 2 years on the SV650 and jumping right on the Hayabusa felt very natural.  Actually it was almost as if my skill from my SV650 transfered to being better skills on the Busa..if that makes any sence.

I understand you man. I too came off of a SV and the busa felt just like home the first time I straddled her. I will admit it takes more effort than the SV, but not more than was expected by a bike that weighs 150lbs more.

 

[IL_BusaBoy]

I really don't find her all that top heavy. A couple of people who have sat on my bike before have asked me, "How do I keep that bike up?" These are the same ones who have either never ridden a bike, or only smaller 600s.

 

[pure_ego]

but no.. the busa is heavy pig and won't turn at all... may as well weld the triples in a straight line only configurations.. if you need to turn it.. stop, get off, pick thefront up and reposition it and proceed.

When I had my busa I preferred picking the rear up and bring it around rather than picking the front up. The grab bar was easier to get ahold of than trying to grab the forks below the upper fairing to do it.

All joking aside, in response to the original question... I have said before that the busa feels top heavy to me compared to the 10. I wasn't referring to picking the bike up. I was referring to where I feel the weight while riding and maneuvering the bike. Also, I might could have worded that better. Actually, it's not really "top heavy", as in... if it leans past 0 degrees sittin' still there's no stoppin' it from hittin' the ground. I guess what I really meant was that it feels to me like the busa has a higher center of gravity (COG). Not necessarily to a fault, but definitely something I could feel when going to the 10 from a busa. To me, the weight seems to be centered lower in the 10, making it balance and handle differently. Yeah, I know I'm a green horned rookie, but I know what I feel.

In comparison, the new '05 Gixxer also feels like the weight is higher in the chassis than it is on the 10. After sitting on and moving around on all the new bikes at the bike show, the only other bikes that seemed to carry their center of gravity as low as the 10 does was the '05 R6 and the CBR600RR. All the other bikes felt like the weight was at least a little higher in the frame. Fwiw, just from moving them around and rocking them side to side the weight difference between the busa and the new gixx was obvious in feel, but the center of gravity/balance seemed pretty similar. Also, those two bikes felt like they had the highest center of gravity out of all the bikes I messed around with at the show.

I've only got seat time on a busa, the 10, and limited time on a 6RR, but based on what I've felt riding those three very different bikes, I'd say that probably the only time the "top heavy"/COG issue is really, honestly noticeable in street riding is during low speed/parking lot maneuvers. If you're aggressive enough in some good enough twisties you could probably feel a difference in the tighter switchbacks when you're *REALLY* flicking side to side, but something tells me that the weight difference between the busa and litre bikes would make as much, if not more difference in feel when flicking at speed than COG.

Again, this is just my opinion based on my little bit of seat time on three different bikes, and from getting a feel for others at the bike show and at dealer showrooms. Don't take it for gospel. Your mileage may vary... I could be wrong... etc... Not looking to convince anybody, just throwin' out my take on the issue being discussed. That should be enough disclaimer, but somehow I'm afraid it won't be... Oh well...

damnit.. that explains why i'm so much slower than the other busas!!!

those basteeerds told me I was just watching how they did it backwards and that if I'd been on the other side of them I would have been able to plainly see that they picked the front end up!

I see it all now.. put it on the kickstand.. grab the handle, and drag it around.

and now I even understand the hump mod too!

 

[PaceMaster]

?? Why are we comparing liter bikes to the BUSA--- It's just wrong-- They were made for
"two different reasons" I live at 5000' with my wife on the back--full Givi Luggage setup and can do the Sweetest 6000 to 8 k rollon wheelies--only two inches off the ground---- 91 foot pounds of t. The Busa is what it is for a reason---It ain't no track bike and most of us Busa owners don't care--so there--end it.

 

[stkr00]

Once you've had to pick up a H-D Electra-Glide...everything else just doesn't feel that heavy anymore.

It's all in the leverage you use.

 

[BentValve]

I dont know what the Electra-Glide weighs but any bike that has a reverse on it is a tank ..take the Goldwing for example, I think they just thew an Accord engine in it and went from there.

 

[BulletTrain]

but no.. the busa is heavy pig and won't turn at all... may as well weld the triples in a straight line only configurations.. if you need to turn it.. stop, get off, pick thefront up and reposition it and proceed.

When I had my busa I preferred picking the rear up and bring it around rather than picking the front up. The grab bar was easier to get ahold of than trying to grab the forks below the upper fairing to do it.

damnit.. that explains why i'm so much slower than the other busas!!!

those basteeerds told me I was just watching how they did it backwards and that if I'd been on the other side of them I would have been able to plainly see that they picked the front end up!

I see it all now.. put it on the kickstand.. grab the handle, and drag it around.

and now I even understand the hump mod too!

LOL...

 

[DAB]

Once you've had to pick up a H-D Electra-Glide...everything else just doesn't feel that heavy anymore.

It's all in the leverage you use.

Yep, I've had to pick up Hardleys, even had to push-start one once (it took three of us.)

'Busa heavy? Depends on what you're comparing it to:

If you're comparing it to sports tourers, the FJR1300 weighs 600lbs I believe.

Tourers? Honda Goldwing GL1500 - 793lbs

The 'Busa wasn't intended to be the ultimate "sportsbike", it was intended to be the fastest sports tourer with predictable, smooth power delivery.

It would have been/is relatively easy to make it more powerful and lighter (check out all the customization options available to make it into an insane ride, check out some of the results on this board) but I don't think that was the original aim for the designers. They designed something that was primarily a straight-line rocket ship, which happened to do most everything else remarkably well. I think it's a great compromise and that's why I bought one.

I tried sitting on a Gixxer 1K '04 and '05 and right away I didn't like the feel of the bikes. They may be the best handling bikes in the world, but that didn't make up for the cramped position for my 6' frame, or the uncomfortable seat and lack of decent room for a passenger. I might buy one as a track bike but I definitely wouldn't own one for day-to-day riding or commuting.

Top-heavy? If you say so. Personally I think you're being intimidated by the numerous articles that say the 'Busa is an elephant and will crush you like a bug if you try to lean it. My old Gpz900r weighed 546lbs wet, and I got my knee down on that one too. Difficult to move around at slow speeds? Try doing a U-turn on a 600lb-plus XS1100 with touring luggage and a girlfriend on board on a rain-slick road.

Difficult to pick up? Actually no. Grab a handlebar grip, stick your other hand under the frame by the rear seat, bend our legs, straighten your back, push with your legs and up she comes. You don't need to be a sumo wrestler.

You guys are such weenies...

 

[manatrader]

I come from riding 600RR and the busa is much heavier and slower to turn, but not top heavy. I agree with other comments on it has a very low center of gravity and because of that its slower into a corner. The thing I'm stilling trying to get use too is the slowing the weight mass down for next corner. Trying to take weight off me and the bike to help that out.

 

[BA BUSA]

No its not. When it first came out it was very light compared to other bikes in its class. It just hasn't evolved as well as the smaller sport bikes. The weight and size of the Busa is big factor in its high speed stability.