Suspension woe's ?

[maristuff]

Lately ,especially on fast curves,  I am getting the feeling that the front of the bike wants to take off and fly away. Even though I get my body weight well forward,the front end still seems light and I have  difficulty maintaining my desired trajectory.  The more throttle I give it wider I run.   Aparently this phenominon is referred to as Squat and Push but is it a rear suspension problem or a front suspension problem. The tires are about 70% used up and I weigh about 175 lbs.
Has anyone had this happen and if so how did you fix it?
Thanks
Big M

 

[BulletTrain]

Good move posting this here instead of in the 1/4 mile forum. See my reply there, though. Too much to retype...

 

[FinallyGotaBusa]

Check this link it will tell you everything you need to know about suspension.

http://www.uponone.com/view_howtos.php?id=6

 

[FinallyGotaBusa]

sorry at the end it has a Q&A should help ya out

-Eric

 

[BulletTrain]

Check this link it will tell you everything you need to know about suspension.

http://www.uponone.com/view_howtos.php?id=6

Good link but it doesn't matter how you set the front end up if you unload it with the throttle in the turns... Sounds to me like he's unweighting the front too much if he's on it too hard in the turns. If the tire is just skimmin' the ground (little to no contact patch) and he's rollin' hard on the gas he's bound to push the front end wide no matter how he sets the suspension, right?

Don't get me wrong, I ain't no expert. Far from it in fact. This is just how I understand this kinda thing after readin' TOTW II and tryin' out the theories I learned from it.

 

[FinallyGotaBusa]

This is what I got from the site.....does this help or am I just being a post whore??


Your Bike Under steers Or Feels Vague
Symptoms: When exiting a turn you start to get back on the throttle and the front tends to slid or wash out. On slightly uneven or bumpy roads the front tire feedback goes away and the returns for a second just to go away again. The steering may also feel a bit heavy.
Solution: Reduce front fork preload. The front tire is not moving down fast enough and the ride height is probably to high up front. Reducing preload will lower the front and let the forks expand

 

[BulletTrain]

I'd think that yer on the right track, but I'd also think that you'd have to have yer throttle control right *AND* have the symptoms described to nail it down to a suspension problem. If yer front/rear weight ratio is far enough off I think it'd skew yer observations to a degree. Again, though, What do I know? I'm still learnin'... I'm enjoyin' the conversation and the topic, though.

 

[FinallyGotaBusa]

I'd think that yer on the right track, but I'd also think that you'd have to have yer throttle control right *AND* have the symptoms described to nail it down to a suspension problem. If yer front/rear weight ratio is far enough off I think it'd skew yer observations to a degree. Again, though, What do I know? I'm still learnin'... I'm enjoyin' the conversation and the topic, though.  

Im still learnin too, suspension is not really my gig (never adjusted mine) but sounds about the same too me.

-Eric

 

[maristuff]

Eric, I just read that article you recomended and it puts things into prespective and I recomend it to anyone reading this Forum. Based on what I read I think my rear suspension is mushy and when I give it throttle it squats thereby lifting the front end. I cannot exclude the possibility of bad technique but in the mean time first things first. Its a trip to the mechanic to check the rear spring preload and or height. I'll keep you posted.

Big M

 

[FinallyGotaBusa]

Glad that I could help.

-Eric

 

[†WÃ￾§†ëD]

dood... its the nature of the beast, have your suspension re-worked or install some aftermarket equipment...

 

[k5fan]

sure or you could just stay off the throttle...yeah i know that wouldnt be right.

 

[Big O]

How many lines are you showing on the preload on the front forks?

I weigh the same and had the same problem until I reduced the preload on the front and softened the rebound and compression a little too.  I also softened the rear a little too and it seemed to work.  I made the adjustments a little at a time until I got to where it felt good for me.

I just checked my settings:
On the front, I have 6 lines showing on the preload.
Rebound on the top of the fork is 4 clicks out from all the way in.
Compression at the bottom of the fork is 6 clicks out
On the rear, I have about 1/2 an inch of threads showing above the spring
Compression, the upper screw is 6 clicks out
Rebound at the bottom of the shock is 11 clicks out from all the way in.

I'm NOT saying that you should set your bike up like mine, just that this is working for me.  The bike settles down in the curves and I can feel the suspension working up and down instead of the bike bouncing up and down.  You might want to set it up a little stiffer and then go from there.  Make small adjustments and fine tune it until it feels good for you.

To my surprise, my setting were DIFFERENT on each side on the front.   I need to check them once in a while to make sure they stay the same.

 

[BulletTrain]

Eric, I just read that article you recomended and it puts things into prespective and I recomend it to anyone reading this Forum. Based on what I read I think my rear suspension is mushy and when I give it throttle it squats thereby lifting the front end. I cannot exclude the possibility of bad technique but in the mean time first things first. Its a trip to the mechanic to check the rear spring preload and or height.  I'll keep you posted.

Big M

FWIW, I thought mine was really squatting, too until I rode behind someone who was under throttle and saw that it really isn't squatting at all. The torque pushes down on the swing arm. You feel big time weight transfer but the rear should be coming up, not going down. Ground clearance increases under throttle according to everything I've read.

Your suspension may be off but I still think you're unloading the front tire with too much throttle, causing most of yer problem with yer right wrist.

 

[NCBusa2001]

My .02, I've seen this complaint before. Try to use "Maintainence throttle" on exit instead of letting it rip. See if just using a little throttle makes any difference, then work up on the acceleration curve until you get comfortable.

I agree with Bullet about the rear end. It does RISE under throttle and not fall. If there are any doubts...what does the rear end do when your stopped, have the front breaks applied and start to let out the clutch...It goes up doesn't it. Same applies whether your stopped or going 120 when you nail it. Ride safe. Chris

 

[Revlis]

Tires and Tire pressure should be checked as well. If they are needing replaced or if they are under-inflated it could have a serious effect on handling. Also, if your tires aren't up to task all the suspension fiddling will be fruitless. Trust me, I just learned this first hand..

 

[SHODA]

Ferm up the rear a notch it may be set a touch lite for your acceleration out of corners and compressing,a trick for riding wheelies easier.Weight transfers to the rear if your a bit softer there, resulting in squat and push.Just a thought.

 

[maristuff]

Revlis and SHODA are rite on. Problem solved.Took bike to my mechanic. He rode it and confirmed the steering problem (rear shock too mushy) but he also said that my tires were shot. Even though I still had 1-2 mm deep rain grooves on the central contact patch. They were shot.
Solution:
1. raised rear end about 1 inch by adjusting the pre load  on  the rear shock
2. left front end pretty much as it was (factory settings)
3. Put on a new set of Pirelli Diablo's
      Then I threw the man a twenty and fired that mug up.
I was hardly out of the parking lot before I realized thet I was on a new motorcycle.The difference in handling was absolutly incredible.
Took a few spins around the lake to break in the tires. The bike flicks twice as fast and in curves it is rite on track.
 So in summing up for those who have similar complaints about handling:
1.  check your tires. if your not sure have a pro check them.
bad tires are dangerous. I never would have started this forum if I hadn't scared the poop out of myself on some shakey riding over the past few weeks.
2. check your rear suspension. An easy way to check it is to have a friend hold the bike straight (off the kick stand) then you try to lift the back of the bike up. You shoudn't be able to lift it. If it budges then adjust the preload. Your handling will improve.
Big M  

 

[SHODA]

Glad all is well,have fun a be safe.