TPS and more mapping stuff (studdering)

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OB_Tweaked

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So, I just had a Yosh duplex RS3 installed (race baffle). I would normally do all this myself, but with FI, I just took a seat. They adjusted the TPS and set the remapped the stock box at +5,+10,+5 with a Yosh box. I now have the following problems:
1) It doesn't like small throttle openings either taking off in 1st or transitioning throttle on/off in any gear. It has a pronounced hesitation or studder. Seems worse as the bike warms up.
2) It seems fat at idle. Its not crisp and blipping the throttle a couple of times will send the RPMs below 1k, then it will recover (rich on carbed bikes).
The tuner doesn't notice the problem, but I have a finely calibrated seat in my pants;-) They had said they set the TPS at 11 o'clock whatever that means? So, I checked the TPS as outlined here and it looks right (-C00). Can it be slightly off and the indicator still be right? The indicator doesn't move up until somewhere around 1750rpm. Anyhow, doing this I stumbled onto something. With the connector jumpered to check the TPS the idle problem (#2) goes away! As soon as I apply the jumper, the bike idles up a bit. I did all this with the bike at temp, on a stand, in neutral (of course). The throttle response is crisper and it never goes below idle speed (1100) when blipping. Now, what exactly does this jumpering do? Maybe a mapping default? Can I ride it like this (I'd like to see if problem #1 goes away)? HELP!
 
Tweaked(?) I have a stange feeling that I've talked to you....with you having another screen name?(doesn't matter!)

Anyway, thats a new one on Me(tps). It kinda sounds like when it goes to the dealer mode, it prepares the bike for a certain check? You know...like setting the fuel curve at a set point, reguardless of what the Map settings may be?
Or, it could be some kind of dwell?(fuel/timing)
As you can see, I don't have a clue? But one thing I do know, when it comes to the Yosh, every bike has a different liking. What works for one may not perform as well with another?
I'm not no great mechanic, but I do feel like I can dial in a set of carb's. I know thats way different from efi, but it's having the knack for knowing what rich & lean feels like?
If I only had a Dyno-Jet 200 or 250???
What really sucs is if you don't have the Yosh box at home, you can't make any adjustments!
And, I don't think anyone has really gotten serious with the pw2 yet?
I don't know of one engine builder that knows how to use one yet?
Dyno-Jet has done a good job of coming up with Maps, but thats kinda like a starting point(baseline) for where you need to get headed?
And for Me, I have to drive 4 hours just to get to the closest DJ 250.

I don't know of anyone building motors like mine that are useing the pw2.(lack of pw2 knowledge) For now thier all useing the Yosh programs.

I wonder if your valves are out of adjustment?
 
When I lived in MI, I had access to a SuperFlo dyno, gas analyzer, and complete machine shop at a place called FastBikes in Grand Rapids (honest, knowledgeable lot) -- very handy things to have around.
I spoke to Yosh this morning and they recommend +5 across the board with no changes to the slow speed. My guess is that its just fat off idle. I'll try those settings and see how she goes. I'm ruling out fuel blockage other stuff (valves) at this point since it had none of these habits prior to the first service (TPS adj, pipe, and remap). I understood the risks of fiddling with the stock setup up front, so I am willing to live with some trade-offs (but nothing drastic). If I can't get it close with the Yosh box, I'll dive in and try a PCII. I'll keep everyone posted...
 
Oh, btw....nice detailed Topic!

Are you sure you don't live around Me somewhere? You describe things just like we do around here?!?! (blipping the thottle) :)
 
*** Orig topic cross posted to General too ***
I am a OH/MI/IL transplant to WA. Most of my bike riding/racing was done during my 30 year midwest appearance, so I might have picked up a little of the lingo ;).
I never got to fiddle with the Yosh box, so I didn't understand it completely. Apparently in addition to the low/mid/high settings, there is also a slow speed (pilot) setting. The tuner was referring to this setting and not the TPS when he said "11 o'clock". My next course of action is to call Yosh and get their recommendations for my setup (just the pipe really), then have the tuner use those settings. At a minimum, I will have him go back to 0 (noon) on the slow speed and then +5 across the low/mid/high. Its a simple problem to reproduce, so I should have time to try a few mappings.
Still no one has come with a reason why the idle improves when the TPS check (dealer mode) connector is jumpered -- curious.
 
Pretty much the same screen name just one is for work (forgot my password at home).
I had them make the following settings with the Yosh box: 0(noon) for slow speed and then +5 across the board for low/mid/high. The idle is much improved, but it still has the on/off bog (feels like a studder because is bogs/loads then jumps when it clears). Its worse in 1st and 2nd gear though I'd still swear its rich. Its just so hard to be sure. I'd like to try 0,+5,+5 next and I will if I get a sunny day soon to get over to the dealer. In the meantime, I've decided to get a PC2. After a bit of searching, one is on the way to arrive on Thursday. Past that, I'll have to dig in and do the screen and tb check (yuck). Again, I'll keep everyone posted either way.
:-0 Anyone got a good stock bike + Yosh Duplex Race PC2 map they want to share? I'll start with the one off the DynoJet site and go from there otherwise.
Will I have to adj the TPS again after adding the PC2 (or is that a rumor)?
 
Mr. Bond, I really just jumped into the pw2 game, so I'm pretty much a dummy about them right now.
I know a little bit, but not enough to be giving out advice!I will tell ya that you'll have a larger range to (tweak) Dial from...

If you learn it?.......Maybe we can call you the "Master"?

What do you think, James?(Bond)
 
Notice I'm at home now...
I do come from a long line of twiddlers (my gran' pappy was really more of a fiddler though) and I do have a good mech/SW background, so maybe I can figure out the enigma that is the PC2. I'm hoping that I'll find one of the existing maps that'll make me happy. I'm not too picky, but I'll do what it takes to squash the big flies in my speed ointment (did you get a mental picture of that one?). I'll let everyone know how the twiddling goes.
Right now, I've got to dash -- Mrs. Bond wants to be shaken and stirred...
 
the tps setting is correct.try 0+5+5.or you got blockage in your fuel screens which became magnified by pipe installation.i had one do it to me last year.and mine did the same after i mod.my airbox.so anything that can alter fuel demand will aggravate this.and remapping will not fix,because if it cannot flow the neccesary volume of fuel nothing will change it but fixing the flow restriction .using my dj200 and its a/f meter i found more powerr with the pc2 6 to be exact.i run stock bike map+2+1+1with gutted box and stock pipes.
 
I seem to have the same problem. i have yosh +5 +5 +5 and it studders really hard at low rpms. I have had the service bulletin done on my bike for the fuel screen. (if they did it)

It looks like from my exhaust outlet. its really dark with black stuff. I assume this means it running rich, I am going to try and go back to 0 0 +5 . I dont know where to start. *sigh*
 
Simplest solution for most of us in cases like this is to get your bike to a Dynojet Center with an exhaust gas analyzer for at least the CO2 (carbondioxide) level for clear rich/lean indication.
 
Or another dyno- or whatever center that has an exhaust sniffer.


[This message has been edited by Animal (edited 14 April 2000).]
 
Animal, I try to explain the same thing almost each time I go into this stuff.

If you want your stuff running right get to the Dyno-Jet 200 or 250.

I would have a hard time riding My bike wondering if there might be some missing hp due to not being dialed in???

I know of a situation where a guy felt like his Busa was running pretty good, I walked up twisted the thottle and knew right away that it wasn't quite right, took it to the Dyno where it ended up getting another 8hp dialed into it! This guy was happy with way it was running before, but when he came back from riding after the dial in...he about Sh*t!
Best of all was the smile he had the rest of the day!

Each time you do anything that could affect the way your bike runs, get to an experienced dyno tech, it's worth it!
 
I agree completely with the dyno tuning comments. An gas analyzer is also very important. However, finding a shop which has the equipment *and* knows how to use it can be a chore.
If you are using the Yosh box, the best combo for my config (as above) was 0+5+5 with the slow speed setting just slightly before noon (11:45 - be careful its touchy). It still didn't get rid of all the problems, but it was better.
I'm running with a PCII now and a modified map. Their map for my config was off in several places (for my bike) mostly up to and including 10% throttle. Its pretty darn good now, but I want some more saddle time and some dyno time before I bless it.
 
I fitted race cans to my 99 Hayabusa, and had the injection re-mapped with the Yosh Box. I suffered from the same problem as "Mr Tweaked" mentioned in his original posting. I went back to the tuner who thought the problem was an initial on-throttle lean-ness, and richened up the low circuit some more. Now it seems even worse, this , and the soot around the exhaust exit make me think that we've gone the wrong way with the adjustment.

I'm waiting untill I've had the fuel screens changed before messing about any more, then I may try the settings recommended by Tweaked, 0,+5,+5, with the pilot setting at 11:45.

By the way, what is the "TPS" setting ?? what does it do??

Keep us posted how you get on with the PC2. If the new Yosh settings don't work (and it stops raining long enough here in the UK long enough to try them!!)- I might try the PC2.
 
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