45 vs 46 Tooth Rear Sprocket

[DragginBusa]

Hey everyone! I wanted to get feedback from those with the above sprockets to see what your experiences are with them in terms of overall performance (I am tinkering over the winter with my baby ). I also want to know how difficult it is to keep the front down with the 46 compared to the 45 as I want to do some track days next year (and other "spirited" rides) and being up on my rear wheel all the time is not necessarily desirable (but very fun). Just so you know my stats...I'm 6'6" and 240lbs, I ride pretty hard, and love the twisties.

We are pretty close in rider size I am 6ft7 and around 240 also. 09 with a 4-2-1 Carbon Akrapovic with the silencer removed. I am running a stock front with a 46 on the rear. Sitting on stock suspension The front will begin to rise in first at WOT around 5500-6000 RPMS it will flip if you stay in it past 9500 at WOT, shifting 2nd it will raise up around 8000 and carry it into 3rd. 3rd it will not power wheelie but if you crack it wot it will lift. Its not a bad gearing and I am thinking it will top out around 167-170 MPH on GPS with the stock limiter in 6th
I do notice the rear tire life is shortened by about 1500 miles but I do like the power wheelies

Question now...will tapping the rear brake help bring the front end down under harder acceleration? thus help preventing looping hahaha.

 

[sixpack577]

Question now...will tapping the rear brake help bring the front end down under harder acceleration? thus help preventing looping hahaha.

Slowing or stopping the rear wheel transfers the motion through the swingarm and frame, thus lowering the front of the bike if the wheel is off the ground. If the wheel is on the ground you'll never feel the force of it.
Have you ever seen a mx bike in the air over a large jump with the front end too high?
If you pay close attention you can see the rear wheel slow or stop for a moment and the bike level back out.
The rider has used the rear brake to do this, as landing hard on the back wheel only is not good.
It's the same principle.
You need to learn to ease on the rear brake to control a wheelie too(unless it's a baby power wheelie).
If you just jam the rear brake with your front tire up, it's coming down hard and fast.
That's extra wear and tear on the bike and can cause you to lose control.

 

[lankeeyankee]

Me and Bret got into a heated argument over this after he gave this advice when I installed my rear 46T, So One day I was out and went WOT in first the front end began lifting and I stayed WOT and hit the rear brake and almost looped it backwards! I didnt feel any slow down of the front end lowering.
Yes I agree in MX tapping the rear brake will cause the front end to lower while in the air and using the throttle will raise the front end, I have done this many of times while riding dirtbikes.
You can try it and those that it works for on a GENII Busa with a +3 sprocket on a stock length all power to you, I believe you but it didnt work in my case..........
BusaBret is a much better rider then all of us so thats why it works for him LOL!!!!!

 

[BusaBret]

Me and Bret got into a heated argument over this after he gave this advice when I installed my rear 46T, So One day I was out and went WOT in first the front end began lifting and I stayed WOT and hit the rear brake and almost looped it backwards! I didnt feel any slow down of the front end lowering.
Yes I agree in MX tapping the rear brake will cause the front end to lower while in the air and using the throttle will raise the front end, I have done this many of times while riding dirtbikes.
You can try it and those that it works for on a GENII Busa with a +3 sprocket on a stock length all power to you, I believe you but it didnt work in my case..........
BusaBret is a much better rider then all of us so thats why it works for him LOL!!!!!

Oh good lord!:sarcasm: here we go again



I am a average rider at best. I was shown this by a very talented track guy.

 

[lankeeyankee]

Oh good lord!:sarcasm: here we go again



I am a average rider at best. I was shown this by a very talented track guy.

I thought the same exact thing!! I can sit back now and laugh at it Maybe you can give some advice on this to him, I would be curious if it works for him..

Doesnt work Does to

 

[sixpack577]

Me and Bret got into a heated argument over this after he gave this advice when I installed my rear 46T, So One day I was out and went WOT in first the front end began lifting and I stayed WOT and hit the rear brake and almost looped it backwards! I didnt feel any slow down of the front end lowering.
Yes I agree in MX tapping the rear brake will cause the front end to lower while in the air and using the throttle will raise the front end, I have done this many of times while riding dirtbikes.
You can try it and those that it works for on a GENII Busa with a +3 sprocket on a stock length all power to you, I believe you but it didnt work in my case..........
BusaBret is a much better rider then all of us so thats why it works for him LOL!!!!!

If you stay at WOT "wide open throttle" and hit the rear brake not much of anything is going to happen.
You need to let of the gas some, as the whole purpose is to keep you from looping it anyway.
The rear brake can't overcome full throttle(or even close to it), the brake is just going to cook.
As you are well aware, the rear brake alone can barely slow the bike down on it's own with any speed.
If you are in a balanced wheelie the rear brake can be used lightly if needed, while still in the throttle. It takes some finess as you need the right amount of rear brake AND throttle to control very slow wheelies.
The rear brake can also be used to save you from looping the bike. Hit the rear brake if you pass the balance point and it most certainly will sling you forward. You need to immediately get back on the throttle after you are safe from looping the bike. This will allow you to set the front end down smoothly...or even maintain the wheelie.
Practice. I'm a former mx guy(250B), and the principle works the same street or dirt.

 

[lankeeyankee]

If you stay at WOT "wide open throttle" and hit the rear brake not much of anything is going to happen.
You need to let of the gas some, as the whole purpose is to keep you from looping it anyway.
The rear brake can't overcome full throttle(or even close to it), the brake is just going to cook.
As you are well aware, the rear brake alone can barely slow the bike down on it's own with any speed.
If you are in a balanced wheelie the rear brake can be used lightly if needed, while still in the throttle. It takes some finess as you need the right amount of rear brake AND throttle to control very slow wheelies.
The rear brake can also be used to save you from looping the bike. Hit the rear brake if you pass the balance point and it most certainly will sling you forward. You need to immediately get back on the throttle after you are safe from looping the bike. This will allow you to set the front end down smoothly...or even maintain the wheelie.
Practice. I'm a former mx guy(250B), and the principle works the same street or dirt.

I fully agree with this statement. Maybe I took Brets advice as it will work when at WOT. Yes applying the rear brake and working the throttle will control the APEX point of a wheelie. Key is working the throttle with the rear brake. I was saying I cant go WOT in first up to redline nor second with a brand new tire and on pavement. I think I was talking about on the dragstrip where it was prepped with VHT, no way was it going to be WOT 1st or 2nd it was throttle control from flipping.

 

[BusaBret]

I thought the same exact thing!! I can sit back now and laugh at it Maybe you can give some advice on this to him, I would be curious if it works for him..

Doesnt work Does to

Oh hale no!! I am not giving any more advice on this subject.

I am gonna ride up yours and Skydivr's way one day so I can learn a thing or three lease:

 

[Tyron]

Tyron, that being said does your front come up at all (well easier than stock) or does it pretty much act like the stock in terms of how it comes up, just quicker acceleration, etc...?

Sorry for late reply...
Absolutley without doubt lifts it easier!!!

 

[SCBQQSTN]

See I don't understand this, I am a big guy like a lot of you 6'9 240 lbs, I have a stock geared 09 and it wheelies in first around 7500 rpm. I want to keep going in 1st without having to short shift to 2nd. What do I do??

I want to keep the stock wheel base, is putting a +1 on front -2 on the rear the only solution to avoid power wheelies in 1st?

 

[sixpack577]

See I don't understand this, I am a big guy like a lot of you 6'9 240 lbs, I have a stock geared 09 and it wheelies in first around 7500 rpm. I want to keep going in 1st without having to short shift to 2nd. What do I do??

I want to keep the stock wheel base, is putting a +1 on front -2 on the rear the only solution to avoid power wheelies in 1st?

+1 -2 will be a dramtic difference. You should be able to get enough of your body weight and size forward to keep the front down. If you are dragracing, 19/41 gearing is going to ruin your times. If you're not, then you can try it, but I'de go with 18/41 first. The extra wheelbase that gives(around an inch) will help you also.

Woohoo, 5k posts

 

[DragginBusa]

I def plan on keeping stock wheelbase...going to be fun!!!

 

[lankeeyankee]

See I don't understand this, I am a big guy like a lot of you 6'9 240 lbs, I have a stock geared 09 and it wheelies in first around 7500 rpm. I want to keep going in 1st without having to short shift to 2nd. What do I do??

I want to keep the stock wheel base, is putting a +1 on front -2 on the rear the only solution to avoid power wheelies in 1st?

This works for me on the street,,,, If you want to go WOT in first all the way up to redline then into 2nd try to take off in B mode once you get to around 9500 switch back to A mode. This works for me, but it does take some finger cordination. With the 46T it will still life in B mode under power but higher up around 9K RPMS rather then 5.5K RPMS
I dont know about your GENII with a full system exhaust but there is no way my front is staying down at WOT in 1st gear and not lifting in 2ND even with a 2Ton Tessy sitting backwards on my gas tank making goo goo eyes at me
ON a prepped dragstrip its even worse when the tire grips better...

NOTE: This is on a stock wheelbase and no straps tieing down the front end.

 

[lankeeyankee]

Oh hale no!! I am not giving any more advice on this subject.

I am gonna ride up yours and Skydivr's way one day so I can learn a thing or three lease:

Come on and get reconized Oh Wheelie Brake Master If your talking about learning to Sky Dive then Skydvr is the one to take advice from I know he has many jumps under his belt with years of expeirence. I just ride in the back of the pack to watch the brake lights go on and off.

 

[BusaBret]

Come on and get reconized Oh Wheelie Brake Master If your talking about learning to Sky Dive then Skydvr is the one to take advice from I know he has many jumps under his belt with years of expeirence. I just ride in the back of the pack to watch the brake lights go on and off.

It works for me. But I am not +3 geared. Stock gearing and stock length.

 

[lankeeyankee]

With the 46 your top end will be 172mph hits factory 6th limiter (GPS'D today. I am running a 190/50/17 rear)
If you can handle not being able to do 185+ then you will love the 46.

 

[methyman]

Wheelie Monster!!!

 

[DragginBusa]

Wheelie Monster!!!

Seriously

 

[lankeeyankee]

Seriously

WOT Throttle Short shifting, its even worse on prepped drag strip. I will admit the air was good that day, in the low 50's with moisture droplets in the air. She was feeling sassy!
I guess thats why some strap the front end down or extend the swingarm.

 

[DragginBusa]

Seems like impossible to keep front down with a 46T...