Ecu unleashed

[Kildore]

Well then maybe if you need a GenII ecu to work on and an unpaid spokesman let me know

What also would be cool.. is to compare similar mods at different altitudes. I have full Brock's Short Meg, PCV, and K&N Race filter. Floriday vs. Oklahoma. Could be fun. Would be different dyno's, but would be a couple different promotional bikes to have out. Being as i do need a new tune, im up for it.

 

[sixpack577]

These are ecu bench flashes, not your bike dyno tuned.
So essentially you are getting a base fuel/ignition map and the bike's restrictions removed.
Brocks sells good power commander base maps too, but there is still room for improvement dyno tuning each individual bike.
Powerhouse obviously knows there stuff and I'm not knocking them.
It just sounds pricey, considering you can buy a power commander and load any base map, and buy the ecu editor and turn off your restrictions and still have money left over.
Or have your bike dyno'd with the ecu editor(and not have to own the ecu editor) and it still costs less.
I see the advantages of Ecu Unleashed for other bikes, but not for Busas or Gsxr's, as the ecu editor has that covered.
Frank, I'm by no means trying to step on your toes and we know you know your stuff.
I just don't see the advantage for Suzuki bikes.
I look forward to hearing what you find out, and if I'm wrong then I appollogize.

 

[Tufbusa]

Does anyone know the specific differences (If Any) between the ECU Unleashed and ECU Editor?

 

[sixpack577]

Does anyone know the specific differences (If Any) between the ECU Unleashed and ECU Editor?

From looking at ecu unleashed's site it seems that it basically does the same as ecu editor, only that it works on more bikes...and it costs more.
It seems as the ecu must be removed from the bike for ecu unleashed(ecu editor can be done on or off the bike). I also can't tell if you need a power commander or some sort of fuel management to go with ecu unleashed, where as ecu editor can adjust fuel/ignition maps too, nothing else is needed.
Hopefully Powerhouse will clear this up soon.

 

[Fearless1]

Flash-tune is doing the same service for $150.

 

[POWERHOUSE]

These are ecu bench flashes, not your bike dyno tuned.
So essentially you are getting a base fuel/ignition map and the bike's restrictions removed.
Brocks sells good power commander base maps too, but there is still room for improvement dyno tuning each individual bike.
Powerhouse obviously knows there stuff and I'm not knocking them.
It just sounds pricey, considering you can buy a power commander and load any base map, and buy the ecu editor and turn off your restrictions and still have money left over.
Or have your bike dyno'd with the ecu editor(and not have to own the ecu editor) and it still costs less.
I see the advantages of Ecu Unleashed for other bikes, but not for Busas or Gsxr's, as the ecu editor has that covered.
Frank, I'm by no means trying to step on your toes and we know you know your stuff.
I just don't see the advantage for Suzuki bikes.
I look forward to hearing what you find out, and if I'm wrong then I appollogize.

,

Sixpack - I happen to agree with you 100%, and you are correct in saying that these are ecu bench flashes. The tune files used in each flash are developed on another bike with the same mods, so there is always room for improvement in the fuel mapping area - on top of the flash. POWERHOUSE has always been able to get better fuel tunes over and above any Dynojet base map, or even any Brock map. It has nothing to do with those particular maps, but more to do with the differences between bikes. And I also agree with you that ECU Editor has the de-restriction side of Busa ecus covered - with that done, and a good powercommander tune (or even an ECU Editor tune) on the dyno, I am not so sure that ECU Unleashed will be an advantage for the Busa crowd. That remains to be seen, and we will be reporting our results with a variety of Busas and mods. I also see the advantages of ECU Unleashed on other models, and am the first to admit that tackling the Hayabusa will be a big step, because of everything that is already available. We knew this going in. We also know that as the years go on, ECUs will become more and more restrictive, as governments all over the world try to dictate what they think is best for us. The new ZX10 is an example, and being able to roll one out of the shop making 185+ rwhp because of this service was just too tempting to pass up. So, as I have said repeatedly in many other prior posts, until further notice I think the best thing out there for the Busa is de-restricting though Ecu Editor, and a really good custom dyno tune on top of that. As we get into this more, I may or may not change that position . . .

 

[Tufbusa]

I have no experience with either unit but I'd like to know the specifics. Hopefully this thread will bring out some definitive answers.

 

[sixpack577]

,

Sixpack - I happen to agree with you 100%, and you are correct in saying that these are ecu bench flashes. The tune files used in each flash are developed on another bike with the same mods, so there is always room for improvement in the fuel mapping area - on top of the flash. POWERHOUSE has always been able to get better fuel tunes over and above any Dynojet base map, or even any Brock map. It has nothing to do with those particular maps, but more to do with the differences between bikes. And I also agree with you that ECU Editor has the de-restriction side of Busa ecus covered - with that done, and a good powercommander tune (or even an ECU Editor tune) on the dyno, I am not so sure that ECU Unleashed will be an advantage for the Busa crowd. That remains to be seen, and we will be reporting our results with a variety of Busas and mods. I also see the advantages of ECU Unleashed on other models, and am the first to admit that tackling the Hayabusa will be a big step, because of everything that is already available. We knew this going in. We also know that as the years go on, ECUs will become more and more restrictive, as governments all over the world try to dictate what they think is best for us. The new ZX10 is an example, and being able to roll one out of the shop making 185+ rwhp because of this service was just too tempting to pass up. So, as I have said repeatedly in many other prior posts, until further notice I think the best thing out there for the Busa is de-restricting though Ecu Editor, and a really good custom dyno tune on top of that. As we get into this more, I may or may not change that position . . .

Thank you sir, we look forward to what you come up with.
We know it'll be good!

 

[Tufbusa]

,

Sixpack - I happen to agree with you 100%, and you are correct in saying that these are ecu bench flashes. The tune files used in each flash are developed on another bike with the same mods, so there is always room for improvement in the fuel mapping area - on top of the flash. POWERHOUSE has always been able to get better fuel tunes over and above any Dynojet base map, or even any Brock map. It has nothing to do with those particular maps, but more to do with the differences between bikes. And I also agree with you that ECU Editor has the de-restriction side of Busa ecus covered - with that done, and a good powercommander tune (or even an ECU Editor tune) on the dyno, I am not so sure that ECU Unleashed will be an advantage for the Busa crowd. That remains to be seen, and we will be reporting our results with a variety of Busas and mods. I also see the advantages of ECU Unleashed on other models, and am the first to admit that tackling the Hayabusa will be a big step, because of everything that is already available. We knew this going in. We also know that as the years go on, ECUs will become more and more restrictive, as governments all over the world try to dictate what they think is best for us. The new ZX10 is an example, and being able to roll one out of the shop making 185+ rwhp because of this service was just too tempting to pass up. So, as I have said repeatedly in many other prior posts, until further notice I think the best thing out there for the Busa is de-restricting though Ecu Editor, and a really good custom dyno tune on top of that. As we get into this more, I may or may not change that position . . .

Thanks for the update Frank.

Am I reading your post correctly in that the ECU Unleashed (Stand alone unit) will acomplish the same results as the ECU Editor complimented by a Power Commander? And,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, that both units should be dyno tuned to confirm the accuracy of the mapping?

 

[_WOLFMAN_]

Looking forward to seeing Frank's comparisons and reviews. Waiting to see results before deciding which direction I want to take.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9800 using Tapatalk

 

[POWERHOUSE]

Billyt/uk asked about the early (99-01) ecus . . . the answer is no, we won't be able to flash those, only 02 and up.
What I can say is that for anyone with a completely stock busa with stock pipes and stock everything, these guys are seeing an average of 7 more rwhp with just the Ecu Unleashed flash - no powercommander or other box. I will be posting dyno for that (and a few more) early next week.

I am presently still putting together something because I was asked so many questions at once. One question I been asked actually had to do with TREs (whatsa tre?) in relation to changing the ignition timing to make the bike more responsive. I'm sure a lot of you already know that many bikes are restricted in the lower gears by retarding the ignition timing. And a tre makes the bike think it is in 5th (the optimum gear for timing) all the time. Now obviously, if you were to define "optimum" it would mean no timing retard, no top end limit, no restrictions of any kind.

If you trick the ecu into thinking the bike is in 5th gear always, then the ECU will use all of the other 5th gear maps like the fuel map, ignition, injector map, deceleration maps, etc. A factory ECU has individual maps developed for each gear (ignition, fuel, etc) and in order to tune correctly you have to consider and/or modify each parameter in each gear.

Ecu Unleashed does it a little differently. Timing retard is removed, restrictions and top end limiters in each gear, but its done while still tuning each individual gear and allowing the bike to use its designed parameter maps appropriately. No tricking, but instead fixing the issue at the source and tuning the bike properly.

So they don't just "trim" the entire box. I have a lot of other questions to answer and I will be doing just that shortly. Engine builds and turbo installs are already coming in the door so its getting busy already. TGFT

 

[Kildore]

Congrats!! I thought i was happy with my new EBC breaks and Q2's.. now im to excited to sleep! Thank you for the update and following with some answers.

 

[motochris]

I am really interested in this. I have not done much to my busa as far as ecu and/or fuel maps. I have had my 05 (new off showroom california model) and only added a yoshi 4-1 full exhaust(06) had the bike several states and altitudes ( including hawaii for 2 yrs) curious as to how much of a impact this would have -seems like it would be great- being it seems like I get terrible mpg and dont have quite the pick up I would like at the track days which us where the busa was most of this last summer....any thoughts?

 

[POWERHOUSE]

Sixpack577 asked about a Kawasaki 636 for a friend of his - with the EU flash on a 636, you can expect to see 4-6+ more rwhp and good gains through the mid-range torque; improved on/off throttle characteristics from the optimized throttle maps, increased rev limit (400-500 rpm), we will remove ignition retard in lower gears (better throttle response), remove top speed limiters and optimize fuel and ignition maps in each gear. And of course, we can accomodate any modifications (exhaust, cams, etc).

Tufbusa inquired about a 2007 GSXR1000 with an M4 single side slip-on and midpipe. What follows is a dyno graph from a 2008 GSXR1000 before and after the reflash. This particular bike had a slip-on exhaust, but no midpipe, so it was still a bit restricted. Obviously, you can expect an even better before and after result with a full exhaust on it. Still, you can see the improvements that the EU flash offers. Again, please keep in mind that the increase in power is only a portion of the benefits of the flash - all restrictions again removed, including the timing retard, speed limiter, etc. This is done for each gear.

 

[POWERHOUSE]

Charleslewis01 asked about his 2011 Busa with Two Bros slip-ons. The most recent 2011 flashed had slip-ons, but still had the cat. We saw +9 rwhp. Addtional hp should be expected with a full system. And the last Gen 1 flashed was bone stock - 100% with the stock exhaust - it gained 7.5 rwhp.

 

[HillbillyTom]

And the last Gen 1 flashed was bone stock - 100% with the stock exhaust - it gained 7.5 rwhp.

Liking what I'm reading more and more..

 

[VIPER]

frank how about a 2011 with hotbodies exhaust the short tips type exhaust cats still on.? No other mods....

 

[POWERHOUSE]

I have more questions to answer, and some of them brought up some really good points that would benefit from some clarification. I was asked if the Ecu Unleashed (EU) reflash would be better than a custom dyno tune. I think everyone could agree that they both serve their purpose in attaining a particular level of performance and ride-ability, and in a perfect world I would want everyone to actually do both.

By tuning the factory ECU, we gain control over every single performance and control parameter within. This includes everything from the standard ignition maps, throttle maps, top speed, rev limit, etc . . . all the way to more complex mapping parameters like dwell, injector timing phasing, and the "off throttle" maps, also known as deceleration maps or engine braking. With control over all of these and the knowledge to use them effectively, it gives us the ability to gain the full "potential" performance out of the engine, while also improving the on/off throttle characteristics, chassis stability, ride-ability, etc. And this is important: the micro processors in the factory ECU are extremely fast in communication protocol and delivering/retrieving information throughout the motorcycle and far exceed that of ANY aftermarket fuel module. So in regards to fueling - and fueling alone - it is optimum to get as close to perfect as you can with the fuel mapping within the ECU, and then use a PC to make the final little adjustments to really perfect the final AFR.

Now, if you are just relying on an aftermarket box like a Bazzazz or PC alone, you would be making huge fuel corrections with the SLOWER aftermarket fuel module. This can cause ride-ability issues, flat spots, bogs, etc. So overall the first step is the reflash so that all the performance parameters are adjusted to an optimum level and fuel mapping is very close to optimum. Then the fuel module of choice can be used to finalize the little fuel variables.

So in short, if you are only using an aftermarket fuel module, it only controls the fuel parameters and even at their best are still only able to tune to the inferior stock ECU mapping, so it is impossible to achieve anything close to max potential. And again, the internal hardware/software of a fuel module is not nearly as fast as the information delivery internally in the factory ECU. A number of top AMA race teams run Magnetti Marelli race kit ECUs - some of the best available in the world - and they still piggyback a fuel control module and make final small tuning corrections.

I am going to address "importing" PC maps into the factory ECU in my next post. You might be surprised by what I have to say about that, and just how something like that is PROPERLY accomplished . . .

Stay tuned . . .

 

[motochris]

This really sounds great. My question is can the california model restrictions be removed by EU reflash? From what I understand this model has restrictions, cannot remember off hand what exactly it is. Also how would the reflash benefit after market exhaust or would a map need to be downloaded to get maxim performance?

 

[Kildore]

I think what he is saying... that with the ECU Unleashed + a proper dyno tune is the optimum circumstance with aftermarket exhausts, filters, and basic bolt-on parts.