First, I'm talking about bikes. NOT agricultural products so don't even ask. I see guys spending big money for lightweight stuff. Where are you trying to save the most, unsprung/sprung, rotating mass, engine components? Carbon fiber, titanium, beryllium (which next to weapons grade plutonium, is the most dangerous stuff to work with). What are the big weight savers? Were did you go first? How much does a pound cost? What's on your wish list?
How much does a pound cost?
- Thread starter OB_maui
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OB_KawAbuser
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#1) unsprung rotating mass - wheels / rotors
Just a question of wallet depth.
#2) Most loss for the buck - exhaust system
Ti full system not much lighter than stainless steel system.
#?) Titanium axles and fasteners - very expensive for return on investment(cheaper to loose weight elsewhere).
#100) Go on a diet yourself and probably live longer to boot. But with Y2K almost here you should bulk-up, the skinny people will starve. For those carrying extra ballast just tell your friends "you are Y2K Ready, let the skinny people starve!".
Thes dread loks mon,large Jamaicans eat well anyway.
Just a question of wallet depth.
#2) Most loss for the buck - exhaust system
Ti full system not much lighter than stainless steel system.
#?) Titanium axles and fasteners - very expensive for return on investment(cheaper to loose weight elsewhere).
#100) Go on a diet yourself and probably live longer to boot. But with Y2K almost here you should bulk-up, the skinny people will starve. For those carrying extra ballast just tell your friends "you are Y2K Ready, let the skinny people starve!".
Thes dread loks mon,large Jamaicans eat well anyway.
OB_VegasDude
Registered
you want to go after unsprung weight first. Such as rims. Its also rotating mass as well........
OB_Dirty Pete
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What I would love to see is a formal test of the effect of progressive weight reduction on acceleration and cornering. Anyone aware of one?
That might be a good incentive to get out the hacksaw, or the wallet, or both.
No hard evidence here but I don't think weight has much to do with your terminal velocity...just how long it takes you to get there.
The weight savings to be had from replacing parts with the same parts made of lighter materials are not as impressive (with the exception of a pipe) and lot more expensive than the weight savings to be had with a hacksaw.
If you don't mind altering the look of your Busa a little and making it a little tougher to ride in the rain, you can remove all your fairings, your fenders, the hump and its support structure, lighting fore and aft, instruments including tach (who needs a tach when you've got a rev limiter?), 90% of your wiring harness, rear view mirrors and windscreen, side stand, turn indicators (use hand signals) and a surprising number of useless little bits like the screwed-on steel plates on the bottoms of the footpegs...what are THEY for?
Then replace the steel gas tank with a small fiberglas one and take your drill to everything you can find that doesn't need a lot of strength.
I'd guess this would save 80 or more pounds on the Busa.
I've done this to bikes before and you CAN feel the difference on the bum dyno and of course you can read it at the drag strip.
I don't think anyone is going to get that kind of difference by spending $thousands on carbon fibre and titanium.
But that costly stuff sure LOOKS good...and that's part of the pleasure of riding, too.
That might be a good incentive to get out the hacksaw, or the wallet, or both.
No hard evidence here but I don't think weight has much to do with your terminal velocity...just how long it takes you to get there.
The weight savings to be had from replacing parts with the same parts made of lighter materials are not as impressive (with the exception of a pipe) and lot more expensive than the weight savings to be had with a hacksaw.
If you don't mind altering the look of your Busa a little and making it a little tougher to ride in the rain, you can remove all your fairings, your fenders, the hump and its support structure, lighting fore and aft, instruments including tach (who needs a tach when you've got a rev limiter?), 90% of your wiring harness, rear view mirrors and windscreen, side stand, turn indicators (use hand signals) and a surprising number of useless little bits like the screwed-on steel plates on the bottoms of the footpegs...what are THEY for?
Then replace the steel gas tank with a small fiberglas one and take your drill to everything you can find that doesn't need a lot of strength.
I'd guess this would save 80 or more pounds on the Busa.
I've done this to bikes before and you CAN feel the difference on the bum dyno and of course you can read it at the drag strip.
I don't think anyone is going to get that kind of difference by spending $thousands on carbon fibre and titanium.
But that costly stuff sure LOOKS good...and that's part of the pleasure of riding, too.
)Dirty Pete,
You just described Rodan
Rotating stuff always gets my attention. Both acceleration and deceleration will benefit here (not to mention your sprung to unsprung). The faster you go, the harder it is to get your wheel speed up or slow down. You end up storing energy here, the flywheel effect. Multiply speed x weight. There's a lot to be said for sweat equity when you're trying to save weight. I gundrill bolts, trim them within a hair of being to short, remove all unnecessary washers, and a few necessary ones too. Shorten cables, wires, fuel lines, and yes trim your fingernails. Ti bolts or axles are a tough investment if they're to close to the center of the wheel. Cutting your discs down, I don't know how they would handle the heat.
A friend of mine just handed me one of his carbon fiber dragster hats (disc), VERY LIGHT, also 1K each. This wouldn't work for a street ridden deal. They tend to grab progressively harder, so you need to back off as they start to come in.
You just described Rodan
Rotating stuff always gets my attention. Both acceleration and deceleration will benefit here (not to mention your sprung to unsprung). The faster you go, the harder it is to get your wheel speed up or slow down. You end up storing energy here, the flywheel effect. Multiply speed x weight. There's a lot to be said for sweat equity when you're trying to save weight. I gundrill bolts, trim them within a hair of being to short, remove all unnecessary washers, and a few necessary ones too. Shorten cables, wires, fuel lines, and yes trim your fingernails. Ti bolts or axles are a tough investment if they're to close to the center of the wheel. Cutting your discs down, I don't know how they would handle the heat.
A friend of mine just handed me one of his carbon fiber dragster hats (disc), VERY LIGHT, also 1K each. This wouldn't work for a street ridden deal. They tend to grab progressively harder, so you need to back off as they start to come in.
OB_Dirty Pete
Registered
Yngve: That formula is theoretically correct and a good guideline for chopping. But it assumes perfect traction, zero rolling resistance and perfect aerodynamics.
As I see it, if you cut your weight in half you won't double your low end acceleration unless you also make serious mods to tire, suspension and centre of gravity.
You'll need 50% better traction in the early gears to realize your potential acceleration gain.
Altering suspension (extended swing arm, bars) and a bigger tire usually adds weight, and you'll need to beef up your chassis too.
So the band plays on but marches in frustrating circles.
As I see it, if you cut your weight in half you won't double your low end acceleration unless you also make serious mods to tire, suspension and centre of gravity.
You'll need 50% better traction in the early gears to realize your potential acceleration gain.
Altering suspension (extended swing arm, bars) and a bigger tire usually adds weight, and you'll need to beef up your chassis too.
So the band plays on but marches in frustrating circles.
OB_Dirty Pete
Registered
Yeah Maui rotating items are good but with some exceptions like the engine counterweight balancer and the drive chain & sprockets, they cost so much you'd have to give up sushi, hookers, gambling, drugs, booze, porn and gasoline for months.
Not an attractive scenario.
Remember the words of the broke and aging Errol Flynn who said, when asked by a reporter where all his millions had gone, "I spent most of it on women, booze and gambling. The rest of it I wasted."
[This message has been edited by Dirty Pete (edited 05 October 1999).]
Not an attractive scenario.
Remember the words of the broke and aging Errol Flynn who said, when asked by a reporter where all his millions had gone, "I spent most of it on women, booze and gambling. The rest of it I wasted."
[This message has been edited by Dirty Pete (edited 05 October 1999).]
OB_easyrider
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Correct me if I am wrong but I heard somewhere that one pound saved on rims/tires gave the same effect as 3-4 lbs elsewhere (sprung weight). Can anyone add credibility to this?
OB_KawAbuser
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Easyrider, I believe I read that 1 ounce of weight on a wheel is equal to 25 pounds at 100 miles an hour.
I think it was Dymag who claimed this when on the topic of carbon fiber wheels.
I think it was Dymag who claimed this when on the topic of carbon fiber wheels.
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