Kawi will strike back

[Nekosohana]

Hey mods. When is that 08 thread coming around?

I left the vtxoa boards because VTX owners couldn't stand that their bikes didn't get the "respect" they deserve. Meh.

Now I am seeing the same shiite here that was over there.
"The 14 is ugly."
"The 14 is a dog."
"I would never own a Cowasooki."
"Meh."
"Wah."
"Suziki sucks for not making a 2000cc Hyper Sport"

This thing hasn't touched a track yet, there are no numbers to support it. This this hasn't been released to the public to own, there are no real versions out there to be seen. I hate spoiling the party, but why does anyone care? Are there people out there with egos so fragile that the bragging rights are this important? Out of those people how many can even get to the top of the bike (as someone else mentioned earlier)?

Meh. That's it. This crap should be relegated to a "speculation" catagory, or something similar where all the 08 lovers and haters can go and play with themselves there.

Sorry, I just get a little raggy watching mature riders act like children.

 

[Big Red]

 

[1300hemibusa]

(ks-waterbug @ Jun. 29 2007,05:39) You got to be kidding me....
The Busa got spanked by the 14 in the qtr lets see....
Kawi 9.78 (approx HP 172 at rear wheel)
Busa 9.93 (approx HP 157 at rear wheel)
Diff in1/4:    .15        Diff in HP: 15


AND U think the outcome of a new Heads up race is going to be close  

Are you kidding me...... It should be murder.
Kawi 9.78 (approx HP 172 at rear wheel)
Busa

? (approx HP 179 at rear wheel, Speculation net change of 22HP)

You math is stange to say the least ..

197 for the zx14 at the crank

198 for the new busa at the crank

rear wheel avg for the zx14 169


rear wheel for the new busa 179

?

At best the busa would have a one hp over the zx14 ...Now add the fact that the busa is 485 pounds dry and the zx14 is 474 dry weight... Thats 11 pounds heavier than the zx14 ....

No clear winner here ...It will at best be up to the rider .....

 

[proud dad]

(GPW @ Jun. 29 2007,08:40)

(HotRod104 @ Jun. 29 2007,05:21) Wow, I guess I really missed all the data and info you guys are droppin.. I read the specs and all the other info released yestreday about the 08 Busa, I did'nt read anything about the handlin, Top end runs, or head to head comp between the Busa K8 and the 14. Being a Busa owner I naturally want to see the Busa on top, but really, It all comes down to the rider anyways. I have seen CBR1000's check out on 14's and Busa's. If the rider does'nt have the nads to put the power down, then the point is moot.

Best point made yet, many will cheerlead but very few have the balls to put it all on the table. So in the end, the guys winning at the track are the real people of concern if everything is about, who is faster.

I see people come in the shop all the time. Their first comment is my Busa or 14 is not fast enough. Then I will ask what the bike does at 10.5 RPM's in second gear and they do not know. Says enough for me.

From what I see on this board, more Busa owners are concerned about the 14, than 14 owners are concerned about the Busa.

Both are great bikes....when you can ride one to its max without crashing...you are at the next level.

A bike should not make you cool. I think too many people buy bikes like the Busa and 14 for the "I'm cool factor". Dropping a few pounds, living the healthy life, taking care of yourself & family and treating people with respect makes you way more cool. Just my 2cents.

105 according to the speedo

....115 at limiter

 

[Learjett]

(I_Has_A_CoRM @ Jun. 28 2007,23:24) Regain the throne? Ha! It never lost it!

Suzi just went to potty...

They must be doin' number "2" cause they're still in there!

 

[Cookie]

(DaCol. @ Jun. 28 2007,19:57) Yeah, well we got to see it first from Kawi, remember the ZX12 was built to de Throne the Busa and it was a failure at that. Although I did like it's looks better than the 14 . So we've got TWO attempts from Kawi, one a failure, one a marginal success. So I guess I want hold my breath for the number 3 attempt

You mean,,, number 4!

ZX12 was re-designed twice, then the ZX14, so that will make whatever they do next number four!

Hope they don't get rid of that George Forman grill,, THAT I like!

 

[Cookie]

(tinmann @ Jun. 29 2007,07:58) The 1999 Hayabusa GXS-R 1300. This is the bike that changed everything . Its in the Guinness Book of World Records , Its in Guggenheim's , it's in all of us . They made it look like a cheap Court Street Whore .

My God, that looks old, Tin!

 

[dadofthree]

Busa rulz in my mind and heart. I like the solid black 14's. The '08 should put the Busa back on top no questions.

 

[Vic_E55_2001]

(PaNDeM1C @ Jun. 28 2007,21:52) All we know is that the 08 beats the current 14... and, yes, just barely....

we know, huh... I`m just curious where you get this info from?
New bike was not even released yet.

ZX 14 engine has huge potential. War is not over.

 

[Vic_E55_2001]

(Cookie @ Jun. 29 2007,20:57) Hope they don't get rid of that George Forman grill,, THAT I like!

yeah.. Kawa always following Suzi.

Forman grills were introduced on RF900 loooong time ago.
BikePics.com

 

[ks-waterbug]

(1300hemibusa @ Jun. 29 2007,18

)

(ks-waterbug @ Jun. 29 2007,05:39) You got to be kidding me....
The Busa got spanked by the 14 in the qtr lets see....
Kawi 9.78 (approx HP 172 at rear wheel)
Busa 9.93 (approx HP 157 at rear wheel)
Diff in1/4:    .15        Diff in HP: 15


AND U think the outcome of a new Heads up race is going to be close  

Are you kidding me...... It should be murder.
Kawi 9.78 (approx HP 172 at rear wheel)
Busa

? (approx HP 179 at rear wheel, Speculation net change of 22HP)

You math is stange to say the least ..

 197 for the zx14 at the crank

 198 for the new busa at the crank

  rear wheel avg for the zx14  169


  rear wheel for the new busa 179

?

 At best  the busa would have a one hp over the zx14 ...Now add the fact that the busa is 485 pounds dry  and the zx14 is 474  dry weight... Thats 11 pounds heavier  than the zx14 ....

   No clear winner here ...It will at best be up to the rider .....

Yes hurts doesn't it....


Kawi numbers are always skewed, I guess its like the boat industry where they are allowed a 10% margin of error in determining HP figures... and again the numbers are only based on speculation... But apparently I'm not the only one suffering from an ability to crunch numbers, Cycle-world gave the figures. Did I mention they have the Kawi down by two (2) more HP then I originally listed; Thanks for the heads up! So, the final comparison numbers should be 179HP Busa, 170HP ZX14 (or should I use the figure u provided?), net diff 9HP. Now couple that with the 11lb diff and were still talking murder. Cause if memory serves correct every 10lbs is a loss of approx 1 HP...
NEW CORRECTED NET DIFF IS NOW: 8 HP diff at the rear wheel.
Something you failed to mention and should be pointed out... Aero-dynamics, The Busa murdered the Kawi in an all out shoot out. I'd say your a little more worried than you let on. WE do agree however on one thing... MOST races come down to rider ability/inability.  With that said let the waiting game begin. After all, these are just numbers, and numbers don't win at the track. Good lights, 60' times, and savvy riding can win a lot of races!
Let the games begin.... Here are the spec's I used

From the Kawi site
"SPECIFICATIONS
Engine Type: 4-Stroke, 4-Cylinder, Liquid-Cooled, DOHC, 4 Valve Cylinder Head
Displacement: 1352 cc
Bore & Stroke 84.0 x 61.0 mm
Maximum Torque: 113.5 lb-ft @ 7500rpm
Horsepower: 187 bhp @ 9500 rpm + <span style='color:darkred'>197 bhp Ram Air @ 9500 rpm</span>blah blah blah blah......"

Suzuki numbers (Cycle World speculation)
"a 12 percent bump in horsepower—going by our 2006 Hayabusa test bike—would yield a astonishing <span style='color:darkblue'>179 hp at the rear wheel!</span> A similar jump in torque would mean 110 foot-pounds. Both numbers top those churned out by our last ZX-14 Kawi (170 hp/104 ft.-lbs.)"

 

[1300hemibusa]

(ks-waterbug @ Jun. 30 2007,04:12)

(1300hemibusa @ Jun. 29 2007,18

)

(ks-waterbug @ Jun. 29 2007,05:39) You got to be kidding me....
The Busa got spanked by the 14 in the qtr lets see....
Kawi 9.78 (approx HP 172 at rear wheel)
Busa 9.93 (approx HP 157 at rear wheel)
Diff in1/4:    .15        Diff in HP: 15


AND U think the outcome of a new Heads up race is going to be close  

Are you kidding me...... It should be murder.
Kawi 9.78 (approx HP 172 at rear wheel)
Busa

? (approx HP 179 at rear wheel, Speculation net change of 22HP)

You math is stange to say the least ..

 197 for the zx14 at the crank

 198 for the new busa at the crank

  rear wheel avg for the zx14  169


  rear wheel for the new busa 179

?

 At best  the busa would have a one hp over the zx14 ...Now add the fact that the busa is 485 pounds dry  and the zx14 is 474  dry weight... Thats 11 pounds heavier  than the zx14 ....

   No clear winner here ...It will at best be up to the rider .....

Yes hurts doesn't it....


Kawi numbers are always skewed, I guess its like the boat industry where they are allowed a 10% margin of error in determining HP figures... and again the numbers are only based on speculation... But apparently I'm not the only one suffering from an ability to crunch numbers, Cycle-world gave the figures. Did I mention they have the Kawi down by two (2) more HP then I originally listed; Thanks for the heads up! So, the final comparison numbers should be 179HP Busa, 170HP ZX14 (or should I use the figure u provided?), net diff 9HP. Now couple that with the 11lb diff and were still talking murder. Cause if memory serves correct every 10lbs is a loss of approx 1 HP...
NEW CORRECTED NET DIFF IS NOW: 8 HP diff at the rear wheel.
Something you failed to mention and should be pointed out... Aero-dynamics, The Busa murdered the Kawi in an all out shoot out. I'd say your a little more worried than you let on. WE do agree however on one thing... MOST races come down to rider ability/inability.  With that said let the waiting game begin. After all, these are just numbers, and numbers don't win at the track. Good lights, 60' times, and savvy riding can win a lot of races!
Let the games begin.... Here are the spec's I used

From the Kawi site
"SPECIFICATIONS
Engine Type: 4-Stroke, 4-Cylinder, Liquid-Cooled, DOHC, 4 Valve Cylinder Head
Displacement: 1352 cc
Bore & Stroke 84.0 x 61.0 mm
Maximum Torque: 113.5 lb-ft @ 7500rpm
Horsepower: 187 bhp @ 9500 rpm + <span style='color:darkred'>197 bhp Ram Air @ 9500 rpm</span>blah blah blah blah......"

Suzuki numbers (Cycle World speculation)
"a 12 percent bump in horsepower—going by our 2006 Hayabusa test bike—would yield a astonishing <span style='color:darkblue'>179 hp at the rear wheel!</span> A similar jump in torque would mean 110 foot-pounds. Both numbers top those churned out by our last ZX-14 Kawi (170 hp/104 ft.-lbs.)"

Kawi numbers are always skewed?? Try this ... Zooky claim said 175 rw hp for the 07 Gixxer....Guess what 157 is all it has... Cycle world also uses bad numbers .. they reported the zx14 making 175 stock to the rear wheels .. we know that's crap .. 169 is the right number...We will not know the real Busa numbers till they start hitting REAL dyno's like Brocks ...

All this is just guess work , the track will tell the real story ..When a 08 busa can do what my zx14 does now i'll believe it ... Call me when a 08 busa runs 8.77 @ 154 with bolt ons ... Or runs like brocks bike with bolts on and stock wheel base 9.04 @ 155 ...

If you drag race at all you would know the faster you get the more HP it takes to go even a little bit faster... 10 HP on a 11 second bike will get you way more ET and MPH than a bike thats is running 8s ..

Aero-dynamics play allmost no role in the 1/4 as far as ET ...It will help the mph a bit but will not help ET... ET comes from the first 60 foot and 330 times ... More people run 1/4 mile than 1 mile like Maxton or TX mile.. I'm a drag racer and will never run the mile so the Aero-dynamics play no real role for me .. If top speed is your deal buy a busa, I would ....

 

[ks-waterbug]

We agree....  

 and yet disagree  

I know 1300hemibusa has had at least TWO Busa's, with that being said We can agree to disagree... Just to set the record straight I know there is no way your running those times on a stock wheel base bike.  
BUT I CONCUR YOUR TIMES ARE IN FACT IMPRESSIVE  

Looking forward to the rematch with real time data, you can bet the Bug will be watching/waiting!

Yes, I understand Torque/HP as it pertains to Drag racing... (5252)

 

[1300hemibusa]

(ks-waterbug @ Jun. 30 2007,07:31) We agree....  

 and yet disagree  

I know 1300hemibusa has had at least TWO Busa's, with that being said We can agree to disagree... Just to set the record straight I know there is no way your running those times on a stock wheel base bike.  
BUT I CONCUR YOUR TIMES ARE IN FACT IMPRESSIVE  

Looking forward to the rematch with real time data, you can bet the Bug will be watching/waiting!

Yes, I understand Torque/HP as it pertains to Drag racing... (5252)

Sorry i never meant for it to read that i ran 8.77 at stock wheel base ..Mine at stock wheel base on pump gas, stock gears and flys in place ran 9.18 @ 153... The 8.77 was at 62 1/2 inches.... Brocks 9.04 was at stock wheel base ....

I hope the new Busa is faster than that , Brock will be testing one as soon as he can get his hands on one ... If brocks goes 2 tenth fast than the zx14 i may have to get one.... 2 tenth faster i could go 8.57 on a stock motored bike !!!!!

 

[Blue-GSX]

win the 08 zx14 come out will the new Busa be faster

 

[Over_Easy]

(Kanati @ Jun. 28 2007,20:28) You guys are talking like zook and kaw dont' know exactly what the other is doing...  Baloney.  They both got together and said "let's start this little one-upmanship war again."  Kaw's answer was to make a killer motor and state "ok, but we're not going to make a new motor every 2-5 years...  Lets do this right."  So...  

1.  Kaw makes a kickass motor and chops it's balls off by choking it senseless with tiny throttle bodies and teeny little pipes.  Oh and lets throw in secondary butterflies that dont' even open up until 7000rpm.  How about a mild cam too while we're at it.  But we'll tune it juuuuuust high enough to beat the busa.

2.  Zook goes "ok.  We've already got a motor we know will go out to 1600cc, but we don't want to blow our wad all at once and ruin the little game..."  So they stroke it 2mm and tweak what they already had.

3.  Kaw publicly goes "oh gee willikers!  You have beat us.  We shall answer back!"  They drop in some 46mm throttle bodies, rework the headers, maybe take those flies out...  Bam.  1340 busa beater.  

4.  Wash.  Rinse.  Repeat for the next 15-20 years while milking the public for every last dime they got.

From a marketing standpoint it's genius.  From a consumer standpoint.  @#$^#$&%#$^&$%  

 

Exactly the point I made on another thread. give these two (KAW and ZUK) more credit...they "ain't" stupid.

 

[tinmann840]

There is alway another variable here . Joe Smuck , tried of buying a new bike every 2 year that only has small improvements decides to sit on what he's got and the new superbike from the land of the rising sun sits on showroom floors till the tires rot off.

 

[tinmann840]

(1300hemibusa @ Jun. 30 2007,06:56)

Kawi numbers are always skewed?? Try this ... Zooky claim said 175 rw hp for the 07 Gixxer....Guess what 157 is all it has... Cycle world also uses bad numbers .. they reported the zx14 making 175 stock to the rear wheels .. we know that's crap .. 169 is the right number...We will not know the real Busa numbers till they start hitting REAL dyno's like Brocks ...

All this is just guess work , the track will tell the real story ..When a 08 busa can do what my zx14 does now i'll believe it ... Call me when a 08 busa runs 8.77 @ 154 with bolt ons ... Or runs like brocks bike with bolts on and stock wheel base 9.04 @ 155 ...

If you drag race at all you would know the faster you get the more HP it takes to go even a little bit faster... 10 HP on a 11 second bike will get you way more ET and MPH than a bike thats is running 8s ..

Aero-dynamics play allmost no role in the 1/4 as far as ET ...It will help the mph a bit but will not help ET... ET comes from the first 60 foot and 330 times ... More people run 1/4 mile than 1 mile like Maxton or TX mile.. I'm a drag racer and will never run the mile so the Aero-dynamics play no real role for me .. If top speed is your deal buy a busa, I would ....

thank you Hemibusa , its good to hear it from someone that walks the walk .

 

[Got-Busa?]

(ks-waterbug @ Jun. 30 2007,04:12)

Here are the spec's I used

From the Kawi site
"SPECIFICATIONS
Engine Type: 4-Stroke, 4-Cylinder, Liquid-Cooled, DOHC, 4 Valve Cylinder Head
Displacement: 1352 cc
Bore & Stroke 84.0 x 61.0 mm
Maximum Torque: 113.5 lb-ft @ 7500rpm
Horsepower: 187 bhp @ 9500 rpm + <span style='color:darkred'>197 bhp Ram Air @ 9500 rpm</span>blah blah blah blah......"

Suzuki numbers (Cycle World speculation)
"a 12 percent bump in horsepower—going by our 2006 Hayabusa test bike—would yield a astonishing <span style='color:darkblue'>179 hp at the rear wheel!</span> A similar jump in torque would mean 110 foot-pounds. Both numbers top those churned out by our last ZX-14 Kawi (170 hp/104 ft.-lbs.)"

Anyone ever think that the BUSA may be rated at 198HP WITHOUT the ram-air. Maybe it's 220 with the Ram-Air factored in....

 

[tinmann840]

Trench warfare .Only inches gained . Zuk made it easy for Kaw to retaliate next year .