Perfection versus facts

[kml]

So we need to define what "boiling" is. To an engineer, it's 212 F. To a chef, it's when you see bubbles forming out of the water. Obviously if there's bubbles, some of that water is 212° but I'll wager some of it's less than 212° at the same time in the same pot.


I love Engineers!!

correct water boils at 212
Bubbles will form on the bottom of the pan when the water is around 160. Any heat energy goes into raising the temperature until all of the water is at 212. There are no boiling hot spots in the water

Poaching and simmering is just a matter of degree.

Mnnnn. poached eggs... LOL

I had my 3rd class stationary engineering hat on for this post,

cheers
ken

 

[jellyrug]

correct water boils at 212
Bubbles will form on the bottom of the pan when the water is around 160. Any heat energy goes into raising the temperature until all of the water is at 212. There are no boiling hot spots in the water

Poaching and simmering is just a matter of degree.

Mnnnn. poached eggs... LOL

I had my 3rd class stationary engineering hat on for this post,

cheers
ken


View attachment 1632245View attachment 1632246View attachment 1632248

And there I was, thinking in Canada water boils at 100 instead of 212 degrees.

 

[rd99]

correct water boils at 212
Bubbles will form on the bottom of the pan when the water is around 160. Any heat energy goes into raising the temperature until all of the water is at 212. There are no boiling hot spots in the water

Poaching and simmering is just a matter of degree.

Mnnnn. poached eggs... LOL

I had my 3rd class stationary engineering hat on for this post,

cheers
ken


View attachment 1632245View attachment 1632246View attachment 1632248

dammit.......now I'm hungry

 

[Mythos]

My idea of boiling has always been the temperature at which a liquid can no longer remain a liquid and it must turn into a gas instead.

The Chipotle Chicken I'm cooking in my crock pot has liquid in it that is definitely turning into a gas. I can see the steam coming out of it and I see a bubble plop up to the surface every now and then. The liquid is not 212° though so I guess it is not boiling. Is my chipotle just in a state of accelerated evaporation? According to google, this is not so:

'To summarize, evaporation is slower, occurs only from the surface of the liquid, does not produce bubbles, and leads to cooling. Boiling is faster, can occur throughout the liquid, produces lots of bubbles, and does not result in cooling.'

So a liquid is not necessarily boiling just because you see bubbles coming out of it, you need to verify that it is doing the thing we call boiling by taking its temp with a thermometer. This all would have been a lot simpler if someone identified the exact temperature bubbles start to form and called that the boiling point. If there's bubbles, it's turning into a gas. That to me is boiling but I'm just an amateur chef.

 

[jellyrug]

My idea of boiling has always been the temperature at which a liquid can no longer remain a liquid and it must turn into a gas instead.

The Chipotle Chicken I'm cooking in my crock pot has liquid in it that is definitely turning into a gas. I can see the steam coming out of it and I see a bubble plop up to the surface every now and then. The liquid is not 212° though so I guess it is not boiling. Is my chipotle just in a state of accelerated evaporation? According to google, this is not so:

'To summarize, evaporation is slower, occurs only from the surface of the liquid, does not produce bubbles, and leads to cooling. Boiling is faster, can occur throughout the liquid, produces lots of bubbles, and does not result in cooling.'

So a liquid is not necessarily boiling just because you see bubbles coming out of it, you need to verify that it is doing the thing we call boiling by taking its temp with a thermometer. This all would have been a lot simpler if someone identified the exact temperature bubbles start to form and called that the boiling point. If there's bubbles, it's turning into a gas. That to me is boiling but I'm just an amateur chef.View attachment 1632250

That all is pretty confusing, some us can produce gas at pretty low temperatures by eating beans.


Just jokin.

Evaporation is dependent on vapor pressure, but to make things simple, as long as there is a difference between wet bulb and dry bulb temperature water will evaporate and the rate of evaporation is dependent on vapor pressure. When water evaporates and in the atmosphere the temperature drops below dew point we get condensation, it rains and the whole process repeats itself.

The human body maintains its temperature through evaporation. A hair dryer simply increases the dry bulb temperature of the air by heating it, so it evaporates the moisture in your hair fast.

Boiling water is dependent on air pressure, so at 5,000 ft above sea level water boil somewhat below 212F

In a vacuum, water will boil way below O degrees F.

 

[Mythos]

That all is pretty confusing, some us can produce gas at pretty low temperatures by eating beans.

...and you might just produce a little liquid at the same time!

The elevation where I live is 1400 feet. My chipotle chicken is bubbling very softly at 200° F assuming the thermometer is extremely accurate which it likely isn't. So the thermometer is off by a few degrees, the elevation is a little higher than sea level, it's boiling albeit very slowly. In any case, it will be done cooking in about 30 minutes so I better boil the rice. Why did it take 7 hours to cook the chicken if it's boiling? I know it would have been cooked in 30 minutes if I boiled it harder on the stove.

 

[Bumblebee]

This is one of my favs. Traction is equal regardless of the size of the tire contact patch. I belive that is true in a laboratory and to some degree under very controlled conditions in the real world but the bigger tire/bigger contact patch has been an important factor in developing race tires all of my life. Bigger tires do have more traction if for no other reason, because any time you have increased force applied to the tire, you have more heat between the tire and the surface it's on. A bigger tire absorbs the heat better instead of turning to liquid. It works the same for cornering a motorcycle or launching a dragster. Bigger contact patches stick better even though the tires that have big contact patches weigh a lot more than a skinny tire with a small tire. I suspect the contact patch idea gets even more complicated than the melting of the tire. It also has to do with the surface the tire is on, how smooth it is and what might be laying on top of that surface. I'll take a tire with a wide contact patch every time even though I'm not melting my tires riding out on the street. They do get hot and the rubber does get soft.

Depends on the application of the tire...almost all the military vehicles I drove had the capability to adjust tire air pressure...less air for sand and more air pressure for certain snow conditions. We'd increase tire air pressure to narrow the tires creating more down force per square inch so we could punch through snow or mud as we didn't want the vehicle to float.

The winter tires for my truck are narrower (and a different compound) than the summer tires for the same reason as above...more down pressure per square inch so the truck doesn't float on the snow.

 

[kml]

 

[Mythos]

Depends on the application of the tire...almost all the military vehicles I drove had the capability to adjust tire air pressure...less air for sand and more air pressure for certain snow conditions. We'd increase tire air pressure to narrow the tires creating more down force per square inch so we could punch through snow or mud as we didn't want the vehicle to float.

The winter tires for my truck are narrower (and a different compound) than the summer tires for the same reason as above...more down pressure per square inch so the truck doesn't float on the snow.

Well there ya go, there's more to traction than friction between the tire and the road surface. According to the laws of physics, the tires should stick just as well no matter how wide they are...assuming the tires don't melt...and the road is a clean, hard smooth surface... Absolute rules apply to absolute situations.

 

[fallenarch]

That all is pretty confusing, some us can produce gas at pretty low temperatures by eating beans.


Just jokin.

Evaporation is dependent on vapor pressure, but to make things simple, as long as there is a difference between wet bulb and dry bulb temperature water will evaporate and the rate of evaporation is dependent on vapor pressure. When water evaporates and in the atmosphere the temperature drops below dew point we get condensation, it rains and the whole process repeats itself.

The human body maintains its temperature through evaporation. A hair dryer simply increases the dry bulb temperature of the air by heating it, so it evaporates the moisture in your hair fast.

Boiling water is dependent on air pressure, so at 5,000 ft above sea level water boil somewhat below 212F

In a vacuum, water will boil way below O degrees F.

So in space water would boil at 0 degrees? If the cabin is at 65 degrees when a bottle of water is opened would it all just turn to vapor? As it boils would the water still be cold? Does the freezing point slide with the boiling point? Fascinating. Never really thought about this sort of stuff.

 

[Mythos]

Just googled. Space is like -455 F. I guess that's how a comet can be made of ice. I think it matters how deep in space we're talking too because the spacewalks that take place in orbit are not as cold as -455. Maybe -255 though. Cold enough to not boil water at 0 atmospheric pressure, I guess. Then again, there's no water out there except in a comet which is really ice and hopefully is well out of Earth's orbit. I've never heard of liquid anything in space, nor gas. Liquids and gasses seem to be for planets and stars.

 

[fallenarch]

Just googled. Space is like -455 F. I guess that's how a comet can be made of ice. I think it matters how deep in space we're talking too because the spacewalks that take place in orbit are not as cold as -455. Maybe -255 though. Cold enough to not boil water at 0 atmospheric pressure, I guess. Then again, there's no water out there except in a comet which is really ice and hopefully is well out of Earth's orbit. I've never heard of liquid anything in space, nor gas. Liquids and gasses seem to be for planets and stars.

I was thinking inside a space ship but now that I think about it that's not a vacuum.

 

[jellyrug]

So in space water would boil at 0 degrees? If the cabin is at 65 degrees when a bottle of water is opened would it all just turn to vapor? As it boils would the water still be cold? Does the freezing point slide with the boiling point? Fascinating. Never really thought about this sort of stuff.

http://www.jbind.com/pdf/Cross-Reference-of-Boiling-Temps.pdf

In a steam boiler, when it reaches operating pressure water no longer boils. So typically depending on application at say 450F if no steam is drawn the water no longer boils.