Rotella T 15W40 to T6 5W-40 Syn

[Shaft]

Hey all. After my 1st service from the dealer, I dumped out their oil and have been used Rotella T 15W40 to present. I went through a 20L pail, I'm at 18,000kms now on my Gen II. Every oil change the drain plug has a very very very small film of greyish metal substance and never any chunks.

My 20K oil change I have been thinking of going to Rotella T6 5W-40 Synthetic.

2 reasons, for the lighter weight oil, better flow properties and synthetic for its cleaning properties.

What do you guys think of this?

cheers!

 

[jphilipson]

Oh no, not another oil thread.

Please be prepared for 100 replies each with a different opinion.

 

[Shaft]

I'm expecting replies, but nothing crazy. Question was quite simple.

 

[jphilipson]

I'm expecting replies, but nothing crazy. Question was quite simple.

I was just bustin' your chops

IMO, use the factory recommended oil viscosity, 10w40.

 

[mountainmotor]

You live in Nova Scotia ? If so, i'd use the 5w-40 out of those two oils in a stock Busa engine. Price is not that much more per oil change , is it ? Both are likely to shear to a mid to high 30wt anyway. I'd want the better flow during start up the 5w-40 offers under say , 70F .

BTW, a groupIII base oil like Shell's XHIV used in the 5w-40, in itself , has zero cleaning ability . That's more of an additive pack thing and more so with the solvency of a partial group V ester based formulation entered into the mix of things in conjunction with select add pack components .

 

[paul-g]

BTW, a groupIII base oil like Shell's XHIV used in the 5w-40, in itself , has zero cleaning ability . That's more of an additive pack thing and more so with the solvency of a partial group V ester based formulation entered into the mix of things in conjunction with select add pack components .

WOW oil geek just kidding

 

[mountainmotor]

Oil topics don't need to get out of hand with the olive oil tastes better type replies. Amsoil and two thumbs up with the ditto's following and the likes means nothing but wasted ink and scrolling time.

People wanting to know something should never fear starting an oil topic. There's always an answer out there . Many of these are specific to climate and availablity of an oil in the part of the world some Busa owners live in.

Like this one was -------

 

[jellyrug]

Although the specification says it meets JASO MA, I would be hesitant as it also says energy conservation and it has a wide range of application, not wet clutch specific to motorcycles. To meet some of the standards they specify in their specs, they have to remove some of the good stuff in additives.

A 5W40 is great, you may actually get a few extra horses, (Tested by John Roland on a Blackbird motor) but the challenge is that it shears more due to the wide range of viscosity. This is proportional to the quality and cost of the polymer additive they are using. Although the advertisement says shear stable, you will only know once you have it analysed after 1,000 miles or so.

I have used AGIP T4 5W40 on my Busa. (Agip is from Italy, recommended by Aprilia, use to be the factory recomendation for Ducati) This is specific for motorcycles and although they also advertise "Superior stay in grade properties" my first analysis the oil dropped to a viscosity at the low end of a SAE30 grade, after 1,200 miles.

I'm still using AGIP, but the next change I will try Silkolene 5W40.

If you don't have your oil analysed, you will never know the difference. When someone tells me his bike is smoother after changing oil, or shifts better, I always reply by saying, "After I clean my bike with Pledge, it has about 15 extra horse power and it rides much better."

 

[mountainmotor]

Although the specification says it meets JASO MA, I would be hesitant as it also says energy conservation

In a nice way, i am asking you to post something that backs up what you just said about about the 5w-40 there having the EC designation --- then we'll continue by process of elimination and i'll will walk what EC actually means the rest of the way through over a few more posts .

 

[jellyrug]

In a nice way, i am asking you to post something that backs up what you just said about about the 5w-40 there having the EC designation --- then we'll continue by process of elimination and i'll will walk what EC actually means the rest of the way through over a few more posts .

All I have, is what Shell says, I don't know what their exact formula is.

See Bullet 2 under item 3 and see the adjacent table.

Linky:

http://www-static.shell.com/static/...ts_services/lubricants/rotella/rotella_t6.pdf

 

[mountainmotor]

Never mind, didn't want to put you on the spot but viscosity plays a role in being able to apply for that EC rating on a label and actually meet it in sequence tests. So does predicitive shear for 5w-30's - still speaking viscosity related aside being friction modified.

 

[jellyrug]

Never mind, didn't want to put you on the spot but viscosity plays a role in being able to apply for that EC rating on a label and actually meet it in sequence tests. So does predicitive shear for 5w-30's - still speaking viscosity related aside being friction modified.

Do you know it this oil is API certified? (EOLCS)

 

[mountainmotor]

Jelly - key there is the aterisk - Energy Conserving wasn't used in any wording in the pdf

Their words were *Compared with conventional SAE 15W-40 engine oil.

That was under this ----

• Energy saving – fuel-economy performance*

So, Energy saving is not Energy Conserving in this context of the wording in the Shell product description PDF

 

[jellyrug]

Jelly - key there is the aterisk - Energy Conserving wasn't used in any wording in the pdf

Their words were *Compared with conventional SAE 15W-40 engine oil.

That was under this ----

• Energy saving – fuel-economy performance*

So, Energy saving is not Energy Conserving in this context.

CI-4 plus designations often go with EC, show me an official API mark and I will agree, that is if they are willing to pay the fees.

Just a simple Engineer here, I trust marketing brochures as far as a Busa can fly.

 

[jellyrug]

Here is an analysis.

Provided the Moly is Molybdenum dithiocarbamate it doesn't negatively effect a clutch the way Molybdenum disulfide does. It is probably the former.

The additive pack looks a little old school, but much closer to a typical Euro 5W40

 

[mountainmotor]

CI-4 plus designations often go with EC, show me an official API mark and I will agree, that is if they are willing to pay the fees.

Just a simple Engineer here, I trust marketing brochures as far as a Busa can fly.

Quote:
"CI-4 plus designations often go with EC"

No they don't man, your just not getting this oil cert and spec thing at all. CI4 + has absolutely nothing to do with it . There were 15w-40 CI-4+ viscosities as well as 5w-40's and none carried the EC label. One last time, these oils here are < primarily designed to meet diesel burning, diesel engine needs> and beyond API certs, individual engine manufacturer test requirements has nothing to do with meeting ILSAC EC.

http://www.swri.org/4org/d08/GasTests/ilsacGF4.pdf

Also, you just trusted that Shell marketing pdf enough to reply it was an EC oil and now you try to spin it on me . I'm not going any further on this.

I'll leave it to you to spend time in figuring this out but fee's and applications and the rest above < don't have anything to do with any of this >. That simple really.

I gotta go.

 

[The Tekken]

If you don't have your oil analysed, you will never know the difference. When someone tells me his bike is smoother after changing oil, or shifts better, I always reply by saying, "After I clean my bike with Pledge, it has about 15 extra horse power and it rides much better."

What? A sensible post on an oil thread? Can this REALLY be the busa forum?

Naw!!!

 

[mountainmotor]

Here is an analysis.

The additive pack looks a little old school, but much closer to a typical Euro 5W40

I wish time permitted further but that add pack is not old school , it's the middle of a trend that removes the high metal content of the calcium and replaces some of it with newer overbased magnesium in effort to use newer dispersants and alot more to reduce sulphated ash , bore polishing and more.

Watch the trends in formulations both auto and diesel. You will notice starting TBN is lower but will hang in there longer over the interval . Mobil just switched full swing to it in that regard with more mag than calcium , TBN and such .

Next step could be sulphonates substituted for salicylates as EC/Lower Ash and low phos needs grow . It's been a long time coming .

http://www.pecj.or.jp/japanese/report/e-report/01M445e.pdf

Seriously, I got to get out of this topic. Take care

 

[jellyrug]

Quote:
"CI-4 plus designations often go with EC"

No they don't man, your just not getting this oil cert and spec thing at all. CI4 + has absolutely nothing to do with it . There were 15w-40 CI-4+ viscosities as well as 5w-40's and none carried the EC label. One last time, these oils here are < primarily designed to meet diesel burning, diesel engine needs> and beyond API certs, individual engine manufacturer test requirements has nothing to do with meeting ILSAC EC.

http://www.swri.org/4org/d08/GasTests/ilsacGF4.pdf

Also, you just trusted that Shell marketing pdf enough to reply it was an EC oil and now you try to spin it on me . I'm not going any further on this.

I'll leave it to you to spend time in figuring this out but fee's and applications and the rest above < don't have anything to do with any of this >. That simple really.

I gotta go.

It's never important for me that I must be right or correct. Mature debates are always welcome however and sometimes I learn, sometimes I don't.

I'm not an oil expert and my definition of an "Expert" is Ex = a has been and Spert = a drip under pressure.

I did however go to a school at a place which allowed me to analyse and understand most things and I am willing to share with others and learn from others.

Sorry you have to leave, as you seem to be the oil guru around here until someone challenges you,

 

[Shaft]

Wow keep em coming. both the 15W40 and the 5W40 Rotella are JASO MA. So it should be just fine in our engines. My worry is that would I experience any blow by issues or seepage going from a higher weight to a lower weight after these 20K?