Tire Selection for Street and Track

[Charlesbusa]

(BA BUSA @ Aug. 07 2007,22:50)

(mopar250 @ Aug. 07 2007,22:34) I do a bunch of interstate travel and was going to go with the pilot powers, but are there different kinds? Do i need the dual compound, or are they all the DC? I was under the impression that a pilot power was just that.

They make...

Pilot Power...standard tire
Pilot Power 2CT...dual compound, more performance
Pilot Power Race...dual compound, DOT Race Tire

Michelin Website

On the PP 2cts, the center compound is exactly the same as the PP.  The 2ct's edges have a 20% softer compound for cornering.

So on the freeway you'll never touch the softer compound.  You'll be riding on the same compound as the PP.

If you're going to be doing a lot of freeway, look at the Pilot Road2 tires;
http://two-wheels.michelin.com/2w....lang=EN

 

[quipuah]

Charles should I stay with the same tire on both wheels or have a PP race in the front and the PP2ct in the rear. How much difference would this make in cornering? Thanks.

 

[xcrypto]

(Charlesbusa @ Aug. 07 2007,19:28)

(xcrypto @ Aug. 07 2007,22:23) Just curious why it is never mentioned.

I didn't mention it because it doesn't come in a 190/55 and its not a supersport/trackday type of tire.

The topic starter was specifically looking for a supersport/trackday tire and was curious about the 55 profile.  

The HPX is a version of the Pilot Sport.  The Pilot Sport doesn't provide the performance of the Pilot Power in the twisties.  The HPX version is designed specifically for high-speed, highpowered bikes like the CBR1100XX, ZX12R and Hayabusa, where it excels in stability and mileage.

Link to HPX info

Got it... To your point, the HPX is good for straightline mostly highway riding. However, if you will vary your riding, highway, twisties, track, etc., the HPX is not the best choice.

 

[WWJD]

I found the HPX too slippery for my style of riding and will never run them again. felt very planted at top speed though

 

[SpeedGeek]

<---  190/55 for max lean angle  

If you live near racers and a race track you can often times buy race or track day take offs with plenty of street life in them for CHEAP (mounted for $60 front and rear) and get 1000+ miles of pure grip.

I still want to try some Qualifiers, but I've been getting crazy good deals on Pirelli take offs.. I LOVE the Pirelli Dragon SC - they grip like glue!

 

[Charlesbusa]

(quipuah @ Aug. 08 2007,06:18) Charles should I stay with the same tire on both wheels or have a PP race in the front and the PP2ct in the rear.  How much difference would this make in cornering? Thanks.

While you can run different tires on the front and rear, it will affect your handling a bit.  Unmatching tires have different profiles and compounds.  The only time I recommend running unmatching tires is when someone has used up a rear tire and their front still has lots of life left to it.  And they aren't planning a trackday on the unmatching tires.

Since you're buying a front and rear, buy matching tires.  They're designed to work together.

Additionally, I don't recommend running race tires on the street.  They are almost always cold.  They have slow warm-up and cool down very quickly.

You can run race tires on the street(DOT race tires legally) if you remember your tires aren't hot 95% of the time.

Sport Rider Mag did a test and found sport tires to be much better for the twisties on the street than the DOT race tires.  Even they had problems getting the DOT race tires to temp and keeping them there.  On the track, they were surprised to find that sport tires were pretty much equal to race tires in slower corners.  But of course DOT race tires blew away the sport tires on the fast corners.  The fast corners generate a lot of heat.

There are many guys though that run race tires on the street.  You just have to keep in mind the warm up time.

 

[quipuah]

Thanks again

 

[SnapAttack]

Carl, if you go 190/55 I KNOW I better not meet up with you on Sunday until I get my suit...

 

[WWJD]

(Charlesbusa @ Aug. 08 2007,11:15) You can run race tires on the street(DOT race tires legally) if you remember your tires aren't hot 95% of the time.

Sport Rider Mag did a test and found sport tires to be much better for the twisties on the street than the DOT race tires. Even they had problems getting the DOT race tires to temp and keeping them there. On the track, they were surprised to find that sport tires were pretty much equal to race tires in slower corners. But of course DOT race tires blew away the sport tires on the fast corners. The fast corners generate a lot of heat.

AMEN!

 

[gtrpimp76]

(SpeedGeek @ Aug. 08 2007,07:12) Just go to a 190/55.  Several tires come in that size now including PP 2ct, Pirellis, Qualifiers etc...

You will like it!!!

+1!!

With a big bike like the busa or big power producer like the Gixx1K, you'll need at least the 190/50

I just recently bought a 190/55 PowerRace from Racers Edge Performance at my last trackday. Incredible tires. Insane turn in and copious amounts of tractions when leaned over. Oh, the lean angle?!! NUTZ!! I was almost able to drag ELBOW!! Yes, ELBOW.

The only thing with the 190/55 is that it seemed to have killed my drive off the front straight at Cali Speedway. I'm usually close to WOT off turns 18 and 19 (double apex left) and usually hit indicated 170 MPH. I only hit an indicated 159 MPH with the 190/55's. I may have to regear and go up a tooth just to compensate for the 5 mm profile difference.

 

[SpeedGeek]

(gtrpimp76 @ Aug. 08 2007,14:21)

(SpeedGeek @ Aug. 08 2007,07:12) Just go to a 190/55.  Several tires come in that size now including PP 2ct, Pirellis, Qualifiers etc...

You will like it!!!

The only thing with the 190/55 is that it seemed to have killed my drive off the front straight at Cali Speedway. I'm usually close to WOT off turns 18 and 19 (double apex left) and usually hit indicated 170 MPH. I only hit an indicated 159 MPH with the 190/55's. I may have to regear and go up a tooth just to compensate for the 5 mm profile difference.

The 190/55 is taller... so you're still probably hitting about the same ACTUAL speed.  I know it doesn't seem that much taller, but remember the circumfrance is:

circumference = PI * (radius * 2)

So if one tire is only 3 mm taller from the rim to the top of the tire that is a difference in circumference of 3 * 2 * PI, it can equate to a big difference in the circumference of the tire.

Mathematically the difference between a 190/50 x17 and a 190/55 x 17works out to this:

Circumference of 190/50 = 76.9 inches
Circumference of 190/55 = 79.25 inches

A difference of + or - 3%  which could easily equate to your differnce in top speed on the front straight.

 

[SnapAttack]

quipuah - how did the 2ct's perform in the hills this weekend?

 

[quipuah]

Just ask Dre, and Suijuris. All I have to say is that they stick like glue. I can not believe the difference it makes. I was hitting the turns over a 100mph with no problems. Just glided in.

They are just what the doctor ordered.

You will see next Sunday.