Tufbusa, help

[sixpack577]

Hey Tuf, little help please sir. Can you read these tires and point me in the right direction? The bike(08 Busa) actually feels great now, it just needs some fine tuning.
Front tire is 120/70 Q2 with 36/38 psi hot.
Rear tire is Roadsmart 190/50 with 36/38 psi hot.
Front sag is 31mm, preload has 2 lines visible, set directly on 2nd line.
Front compression is 5 clicks counterclockwise from full hard
Front rebound is 4 clicks cc from full hard
7w fork oil
Rear compression is 12 clicks cc from full hard
Rear rebound is 18 clicks cc from full hard
Rear sag is 30mm
Would another 2mm to 5mm of sag front/rear improved things any? (I'm also around 195 to 197lbs in leathers)
The rear feels a little loose in high speed corners, but not enough to concern me. I actually haven't been on any roads to really push them either; as all the great curves close to home were surface treated in patches last fall. So they're now full of uneven surfaces and loose gravel, as well as washout from recent storms. The tires have less than 200 miles on them.
You can also see that the forks aren't bottoming under hard braking either, which is great(unless I do stoppies, then they do). I have the old o-rings from my fork tube caps/valve on the lower fork, as opposed to a zip tie(learned that trick from an old man)
The EBC extreme pro pads are also excellent! And before anyone complains about them again, I can only hear their typical whizzing sound at low speeds...if I pay attention to it. It's insignificant, and the incredibly improved braking is worth a sound you really can't hear(they sound the same as on other sportbikes).

 

[sixpack577]

Loading front tire pics

 

[sixpack577]

Loading front tire pics

Front edge looks a little discolored and hot, so I know something needs improved.

 

[fastblackblur]

That rear looks just about perfect.

When you say the rear is "loose" what do you mean? Is it stepping out on you?

 

[sixpack577]

That rear looks just about perfect.

When you say the rear is "loose" what do you mean? Is it stepping out on you?

No, just typical mild wobble at near and above triple digit speed. It actually feels good, but as I said I haven't yet been able to push it as hard as I like. I know that there are alot of folks better than me at reading tires. I thought it looked pretty good myself, but I thought I'de ask those more qualified.
I was more concerned with the front, it's hard to see in the pics, but it has that blueish color from excess heat around the tire's edge. The front feels excellent, very stable and smooth over bumps. It is slightly stiffer than the rear, so I don't seem to have a perfectly balanced bounce front to rear. I'm just wondering what needs tweaked, and in what direction.
It's been trial and error, ride, adjust, repeat...and it's really good now. I don't want to play with anything else now without solid direction; as in, "you need to adjust blank this much and try that"
I'm also curious as to if I have 2mm to 5mm sag too little? If that's a factor?
Thanks for your help too. I had a good talk with Tuf a few weeks ago, and he said he'd check this thread later(had to post it because I can't pm pics).
I'm grateful for any track guy's input too though!

 

[JGGUNS]

Hey SixPack, that's a Dunlop...You know the suspension would work better if you used a Shinko. Ask TufBusa if you don't believe me.

On serious note, I don't think the discoloration that you are seeing on the front is a symptom of overheating. The rear looks good to me but I am by far no expert.

 

[RussellJ]

How do you get your suspension set to your weight? I understand the springs and all but the minor adjustments? Take it to a shop?

 

[Fastfrog007]

How do you get your suspension set to your weight? I understand the springs and all but the minor adjustments? Take it to a shop?

I know there are a few books on the subject, likley some websites with some write ups on it too.

 

[isiahstites]

How do you get your suspension set to your weight? I understand the springs and all but the minor adjustments? Take it to a shop?

Once the springs are changed to a range in which the riders weight falls inbetween, your then set pre load and dampening.

I changed my springs out and set everything back to factory specs and tuned from there. It's best if you make a note book of any changes you make on any given date for reference. Also add comments about how the bike felt and any thing that may have happened. Continue to tune until you are comfortable with the set-up.

Taking it to a shop will get you a lot closer intially, but ultimately it's something you will mess with for weeks/months until you get it where you like it.........could get expensive taking it to a shop after every ride.

Unless you have a really good suspension shop I think it is unlikely for them to get it dead on first time out.

Just remember to take notes of everything so if you don't like a change you can put it back.

Scott

 

[RussellJ]

https://www.hayabusa.org/forum/maintenance-do-yourself/89876-jinkster-attacks-suspension.html

Seems like a pretty good walkthrough? Ive seen the thread but never read it before

 

[fastblackblur]

I get that blueish color on my Q2's also, i wouldn't wory about it unless you think it is wearing too quickly or your pushing the front more than you think you should be. If I were to guess I would say it looks like you like to trail brake a little bit.

As far as that loose feeling goes I bet it's just the roads.

Are you on stock springs and valving?

 

[sixpack577]

Once the springs are changed to a range in which the riders weight falls inbetween, your then set pre load and dampening.

I changed my springs out and set everything back to factory specs and tuned from there. It's best if you make a note book of any changes you make on any given date for reference. Also add comments about how the bike felt and any thing that may have happened. Continue to tune until you are comfortable with the set-up.

Taking it to a shop will get you a lot closer intially, but ultimately it's something you will mess with for weeks/months until you get it where you like it.........could get expensive taking it to a shop after every ride.

Unless you have a really good suspension shop I think it is unlikely for them to get it dead on first time out.

Just remember to take notes of everything so if you don't like a change you can put it back.

Scott

+1, YOU need to be sitting on your bike in all of your gear(gear adds weight), or someone who weighs the same as you in your gear to set your sag properly.
Then you can set your rebound and compression, ballpark enough to get rid of any sloppy double bounce or slow spring return.
Then go for a ride, stop and make adjustments, ride the same curves again, repeat until you get it right...then come here for fine tuning advice

 

[sixpack577]

OH, and my sag measurements are cold. Am I right to assume that the sag will slightly increase as the fork oil heats up? And assuming so that it would be an improved or still acceptable amount? Had 30mm rear, 31mm front cold.
Didn't have any help to check it after things were hot.

 

[sixpack577]

I get that blueish color on my Q2's also, i wouldn't wory about it unless you think it is wearing too quickly or your pushing the front more than you think you should be. If I were to guess I would say it looks like you like to trail brake a little bit.

As far as that loose feeling goes I bet it's just the roads.

Are you on stock springs and valving?

Yeah, stock springs and valving, only change other than settings is the 7w oil.
The loose feeling could very well be the roads, as they are pretty rough in places, and the problem is random.
The front doesn't feel as if it's pushing either. The front feels almost perfect, it could be just slightly softer to match the rear, but I think that would cause it to dive under hard braking.
Trail braking, as in riding the rear brake into a turn? If so, not very much, but what gives it away?

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

https://www.hayabusa.org/forum/maintenance-do-yourself/89876-jinkster-attacks-suspension.html

Seems like a pretty good walkthrough? Ive seen the thread but never read it before

Russ that's a very good read and almost identical to how Blais set my bike up.
On the way down and up until I did it going over the 'lip' or transition from hgwy to overpass I would feel a thud as the bike hit the concrete overpass which has a vertical edge anywhere from a little to alot. Along with that and other bumps the bike felt rough no matter how much clicking and turning I did at home. After sitting on bike and riding and the zip tie thing and a little more tuning now the bike rolls right over the 'lips' and is smooth as can be. Before at speed it felt 'on edge' much more and gave me thoughts that at any minute we were gonna take flight or lose contact. Afterward its planted , firm and smooth as far as I wanna go. It's definitely worth it to have somebody set up your suspension for you.

 

[dk55belair]

Bunch o' threadjacking #$%^8s, none of you are tufbusa.

jk...hehehe

 

[isiahstites]

Bunch o' threadjacking #$%^8s, none of you are tufbusa.

jk...hehehe

You are right none of us......even the last poster

 

[fastblackblur]

Trail braking is just still being on the brakes when your starting your steering adjustment.

I'm sure cold oil effects the sag a little bit because I remeber Dave Moss talking about how you can effect the sag with the compression setting to bandaid having the wrong springs. The effect is minimal. The biggest thing fork oil tempature will effect is the dampening characteristics.

If you serious about throwing your bike through some corners I highly recomend gettting your forks and shock resprung/revalved then have the bike set up by a profesional. On my track bike it was the best money I've ever spent. After getting used to that it really enlightened me of the shortcommings of the suspesnion on my busa.

 

[sixpack577]

Trail braking is just still being on the brakes when your starting your steering adjustment.

I'm sure cold oil effects the sag a little bit because I remeber Dave Moss talking about how you can effect the sag with the compression setting to bandaid having the wrong springs. The effect is minimal. The biggest thing fork oil tempature will effect is the dampening characteristics.

If you serious about throwing your bike through some corners I highly recomend gettting your forks and shock resprung/revalved then have the bike set up by a profesional. On my track bike it was the best money I've ever spent. After getting used to that it really enlightened me of the shortcommings of the suspesnion on my busa.

Suspension upgrades aren't in my budget at the moment, but they will be. Stock does good enough for now, I'm just trying to get the most out of it.
There are no "professionals" available to set up my suspension with me either. I did my preload adjustments by trial and error riding...then I measured the sag to see how well I did, I think the 30/31mm was pretty good.
I have noticed being on the brakes too late into corners too. I'm rusty, as this is my first good set of tires for the warm weather this year(no knees down in the cold for me).
I've also never done a trackday, I've tried several times to but it's just yet to work out. I'll get out on VIR yet...all this just better prepares me.

 

[fastblackblur]

I don't think there is anything really wrong with being on the brakes when your starting your steering input as long as your smooth with your transition from braking to accelerating. It does put more force on your front tire but these tires wil take it. Obviously you should be careful when traction is in question i.e cold tires, dirty/dusty roads, precipitation ect.

I've been considering taking the busa out in a novice group this year to putt around with a friend of mine who wants to get into track days but I'm kind of weary my liter bike habits might get me in some hot water if I try to push the big girl a little too hard.