What steering damper do you recommend
- Thread starter Scott2
- Start date
IG.
Registered
There is one important point to remember why you need a damper. Headshakes are too slow for the damper to do much - no matter what brand. If you have headshakes look for the reasons why you have them.
The only real thing you need the damper for is to prevent a tankslapper. The Busa is stable as it is without any dampers.
I didn't waste the money and simply replaced the stock oil with 80W90 full syntetic.
Anyone's experience who installed a damper but never got to take advantage of it (e.g. was saved from a tankslapper) is really meaningless. It does absolutely nothing during normal riding, even aggressive one.
Oh, and I strongly advise anyone riding with the stock damper to replace oil in it with the gear oil with weight 80 - 90 range. The stock setup will not save you from a real tankslapper. You can guess how I know.
I knew about this mod before I went down, but dismissed it with this logic: the bike is super stable, why bother?
But one day, a rare combination of conditions got me into a real tankslapper... You may ride for years and never experience it. All it takes just once.
Nothing against other brands though if you feel like getting one.
<!--EDIT|IG.
Reason for Edit: None given...|1156633605 -->
The only real thing you need the damper for is to prevent a tankslapper. The Busa is stable as it is without any dampers.
I didn't waste the money and simply replaced the stock oil with 80W90 full syntetic.
Anyone's experience who installed a damper but never got to take advantage of it (e.g. was saved from a tankslapper) is really meaningless. It does absolutely nothing during normal riding, even aggressive one.
Oh, and I strongly advise anyone riding with the stock damper to replace oil in it with the gear oil with weight 80 - 90 range. The stock setup will not save you from a real tankslapper. You can guess how I know.
I knew about this mod before I went down, but dismissed it with this logic: the bike is super stable, why bother?
But one day, a rare combination of conditions got me into a real tankslapper... You may ride for years and never experience it. All it takes just once.
Nothing against other brands though if you feel like getting one.
<!--EDIT|IG.
Reason for Edit: None given...|1156633605 -->
Well the stock one is shot.
I was doing some work on the bike the other day and decided to take a look at it.
It is offering no resistance at all. It came with some used forks when i had to replace them after an accident.
I know the difference between a head shake and a tank slapper because i have experinced both.
This was a head shake leading into a tank slapper. I have ridden bike with and without dampers. I just prefer a damper is all.
I got a head shake after I was coming out of corner hard.
I was doing some work on the bike the other day and decided to take a look at it.
It is offering no resistance at all. It came with some used forks when i had to replace them after an accident.
I know the difference between a head shake and a tank slapper because i have experinced both.
This was a head shake leading into a tank slapper. I have ridden bike with and without dampers. I just prefer a damper is all.
I got a head shake after I was coming out of corner hard.
black954
Registered
I'd have to disagree. I like the stable feeling of a firm setting Ohlins steering damper. I had one on my 954RR and 900RR and absolutely loved them. Once you ride with one, you won't want to ride without it. Actually, the day I removed the damper from my 954, I had the worst tankslapper i've ever had and came too close to going down. FYI, Ohlins provides the valving in the Scotts damper. I would recommend the "ducati" style Ohlins. Just make sure you buy one of the ones in your poll. I had a Matris on my 954 at first and it wore out way fast and the brackets were cheap.
+1 on the Ohlins, it makes a WORLD of difference in the twisties 
so much more control in and out of the corners. If you don't ride that aggressively on your Busa then it's not that big of a deal about the dampener...the Busa is very stable, but like any bike if you push it to it's limits....watch out for dreaded tank slapper 
so much more control in and out of the corners. If you don't ride that aggressively on your Busa then it's not that big of a deal about the dampener...the Busa is very stable, but like any bike if you push it to it's limits....watch out for dreaded tank slapper
CB loves his new Ohlins...once he got it dialed in you should have seen the grin on his faceI bet Charlesbusa has a recommendation for ya!
--Wag--
extreemachine
Never Forgotten
I have the stock one with the 90 weight oil mod and I am happy with that. Made a difference to me.
There is much knowledge here and IG is correct...as...
"HEAD-SHAKE": is a slow and wallowy action...(sorta like the feeling ya get when traversing another boats wake at an angle in a small rowboat)...which is most times induced by the rider via "Over-Steering" inputs...where the riders inputs are so strong that the rider is actually fighting against the bikes natural and optimum lean/steer attitude which the bike is trying to dictate to the rider the limitations of the front tires contact patch which traverses in a for and aft direction which in turn affects trail..which in turn affects wheelbase length annnnnnd?....ultimately?..."TIRE PROFILE"...(hence the commonly used word "FEEDBACK" when refering to a bikes "handling feel")....AND YOU CAN RECOVER FROM A HEAD-SHAKE..if you listen to that feedback with a close ear.
where?...
"TANKSLAPPERS": Happen quickly with zero warning...and as opposed to "Head-Shake"?...they are violently fast in nature...and an extremely nasty situation...with a very poor "Recovery Rate"...and is most times the result of a poorly maintained/adjusted bike...namely?..."LOOSE STEERING-HEAD BEARINGS"...Now?...the best advice for recovering from a tankslapper?...is to just let go of everything...the idea being that with a dumped throttle/brake and no steering influence?..the wheels gyroscopic affect takes over..and that the bike will..stand up...slow down...and gradually recover from this harmonic phenomena...and it will..."IF"...you were quick enough to properly react to the extremely short notice given annnd....it's not too far gone...and your human instincts will know if it is "Too Far Gone"..cause if it is "Too Far Gone"...you'll have a natural reaction to "Fight It" regardless of the best knowledge and/or advice given...and i'm proud to say that i did successfully fight my way out of a tankslapper one time....with one arm....but afterwards?..i wished i didn't..cause it tore about every tendon and muscles that my right arm owned...pain for years.
Point being?...i agree with IG in that steering dampers are "Band-Aid Science"..as they hide problems annnd..."Dampen FeedBack"....to the rider of....."What The Bike Wants To DO".
L8R, Bill.
<!--EDIT|JINKSTER
Reason for Edit: None given...|1156681832 -->
"HEAD-SHAKE": is a slow and wallowy action...(sorta like the feeling ya get when traversing another boats wake at an angle in a small rowboat)...which is most times induced by the rider via "Over-Steering" inputs...where the riders inputs are so strong that the rider is actually fighting against the bikes natural and optimum lean/steer attitude which the bike is trying to dictate to the rider the limitations of the front tires contact patch which traverses in a for and aft direction which in turn affects trail..which in turn affects wheelbase length annnnnnd?....ultimately?..."TIRE PROFILE"...(hence the commonly used word "FEEDBACK" when refering to a bikes "handling feel")....AND YOU CAN RECOVER FROM A HEAD-SHAKE..if you listen to that feedback with a close ear.
where?...
"TANKSLAPPERS": Happen quickly with zero warning...and as opposed to "Head-Shake"?...they are violently fast in nature...and an extremely nasty situation...with a very poor "Recovery Rate"...and is most times the result of a poorly maintained/adjusted bike...namely?..."LOOSE STEERING-HEAD BEARINGS"...Now?...the best advice for recovering from a tankslapper?...is to just let go of everything...the idea being that with a dumped throttle/brake and no steering influence?..the wheels gyroscopic affect takes over..and that the bike will..stand up...slow down...and gradually recover from this harmonic phenomena...and it will..."IF"...you were quick enough to properly react to the extremely short notice given annnd....it's not too far gone...and your human instincts will know if it is "Too Far Gone"..cause if it is "Too Far Gone"...you'll have a natural reaction to "Fight It" regardless of the best knowledge and/or advice given...and i'm proud to say that i did successfully fight my way out of a tankslapper one time....with one arm....but afterwards?..i wished i didn't..cause it tore about every tendon and muscles that my right arm owned...pain for years.
Point being?...i agree with IG in that steering dampers are "Band-Aid Science"..as they hide problems annnd..."Dampen FeedBack"....to the rider of....."What The Bike Wants To DO".
L8R, Bill.
<!--EDIT|JINKSTER
Reason for Edit: None given...|1156681832 -->
You can get one with a top mount or OEM mount
black954
Registered
If this is true, then why do 99% of all professional, high dollar, extensive R&D, roadrace motorcycles have a fully adjustable steering damper installed? I believe the adjustable steering damper is part of a well tuned suspension. Conventional forks cannot resist every dynamic force placed on the front end of a motorcycle in varying conditions. Honda for years believed the same as you, but finally in 2004 decided it was hooey and has fitted their superbike class motorcycle (cbr1000rr) with an electronically adjusted damper. If i'm not mistaken, every sportbike manufacturer has a steering damper on at least one of their models, and is usually their flagship superbike.
Ducati - all 749/999, some Monsters
Aprilia - all Mille's/Tuono's
MV Agusta -all Tambourini's/Brutale's
Suzuki - all GSXR's
Kawisaki - all ZX10's
Honda - all CBR1000RR's
Yamaha - all R1LE/R6S
IG.
Registered
I think it's important to understand why there is a need for a damper. I assume that we all know that the forks being at an angle move the contact patch back which creates the self correcting force for the front wheel.
Aside from landing a wheelie with the front crooket, or hitting a pothole there is one daring scenario for any powerful bike which can come into play every time you get on the gas hard, even going straight but especially exiting a turn when the bike is not straight.
We may not realize, but 1) when we accelerate even straight we may hold the handlebars a little tight thus creating a small steering input. 2) When we are in turn, believe it or not, we have to have a steady steering input in the bars, otherwise the bike will start straightening out - one may argue about more or less of steering input depending on tire profiles, rider's hanging position, etc. But it is there.
Both cases do not normally cause a problem because the self correcting force of the front wheel is more than enough to compensate for it. HOWEVER, when accelerating hard and getting that front really light the self correcting force may become very small, for just a moment, and the rider's unconcious steering input forces the front wheel to turn a little too far (a few degrees - that's all it takes). When the next moment the front gets heavy again and the self correcting force reappears, the front wheel is too crooket (albeit by a few degrees) and gets thrown by this force (which is very strong because the front wheel is too crooket). There goes the first swing of the tankslapper.
From this moment on, it's the damping ability of the damper which may cause the slapper to subside, or to let the swings get wider and wider...
What conditions will contribute to the possibility of a tankslapper? Tense on the handlebars, rough and/or wet pavement during hard acceleration. Ideally, the damper should offer resistance for very quick movements of the handlebars, and little for the normal movement generated by the steering input. So, it's not a trivial mechanical device.
However, I personally don't mind simply putting a heavy oil in the stock damper and having a bit heavier steering input but providing a strong damping for a tankslapper-like oscillations.
The whole scenario is like a take off. You would rather have the front in the air, but not in that unstable state of barely skimming the ground.
I also realize the factors that a rider controls: the more your upper body hangs off the bike (and I don't mean sticking the knee out to only see the head on top of the tank - the head should be facing the mirror) - the less steering input is required to maintain the bike in the turn; the more relaxed the grip is (there was a good example comparing it to the way you would hold a bird in your hand) the less the steering will be affected when the front gets light.
It is a rare event and may not happen for years - well depends on how hard the riding is done, or when you are going to encounter that combination of conditions. But that's what it is.
Aside from landing a wheelie with the front crooket, or hitting a pothole there is one daring scenario for any powerful bike which can come into play every time you get on the gas hard, even going straight but especially exiting a turn when the bike is not straight.
We may not realize, but 1) when we accelerate even straight we may hold the handlebars a little tight thus creating a small steering input. 2) When we are in turn, believe it or not, we have to have a steady steering input in the bars, otherwise the bike will start straightening out - one may argue about more or less of steering input depending on tire profiles, rider's hanging position, etc. But it is there.
Both cases do not normally cause a problem because the self correcting force of the front wheel is more than enough to compensate for it. HOWEVER, when accelerating hard and getting that front really light the self correcting force may become very small, for just a moment, and the rider's unconcious steering input forces the front wheel to turn a little too far (a few degrees - that's all it takes). When the next moment the front gets heavy again and the self correcting force reappears, the front wheel is too crooket (albeit by a few degrees) and gets thrown by this force (which is very strong because the front wheel is too crooket). There goes the first swing of the tankslapper.
From this moment on, it's the damping ability of the damper which may cause the slapper to subside, or to let the swings get wider and wider...
What conditions will contribute to the possibility of a tankslapper? Tense on the handlebars, rough and/or wet pavement during hard acceleration. Ideally, the damper should offer resistance for very quick movements of the handlebars, and little for the normal movement generated by the steering input. So, it's not a trivial mechanical device.
However, I personally don't mind simply putting a heavy oil in the stock damper and having a bit heavier steering input but providing a strong damping for a tankslapper-like oscillations.
The whole scenario is like a take off. You would rather have the front in the air, but not in that unstable state of barely skimming the ground.
I also realize the factors that a rider controls: the more your upper body hangs off the bike (and I don't mean sticking the knee out to only see the head on top of the tank - the head should be facing the mirror) - the less steering input is required to maintain the bike in the turn; the more relaxed the grip is (there was a good example comparing it to the way you would hold a bird in your hand) the less the steering will be affected when the front gets light.
It is a rare event and may not happen for years - well depends on how hard the riding is done, or when you are going to encounter that combination of conditions. But that's what it is.
Uhh Don't think I don't ride hard, I can get out there and push the busa to where it starts complaining. But here we have folks saying that the DAMPER is needed on the Busa cause it's used by "All THESE BIKES"... 
Insert list of track ready track designed bikes.
Then flash back to reality and the 560LB Suzuki Hayabusa. It's LOoOoOOong, Dead Stable, and when it does start to move around it's allways been a Push either front or rear. NOT a snatch and grab afair, not Slapper territory.
I stand by my contention that the High Dollar aftermarket DAMPERS on a Busa are little more ego dressing and cool factor.
I'll go EVEN further and say if you've been experiancing headshake or slappers exiting corners, you need to worry more about your riding technique than a New Flashy Damper. 
No I'm not being funny, rebuild your OEM. And your Good to go. Hanging Ohlins componants on a busa is like running Penske or Bilstien adjustables on a Cadillac Deville, or DTC... Sure you can, but there's little point.
Insert list of track ready track designed bikes.Then flash back to reality and the 560LB Suzuki Hayabusa. It's LOoOoOOong, Dead Stable, and when it does start to move around it's allways been a Push either front or rear. NOT a snatch and grab afair, not Slapper territory.
I stand by my contention that the High Dollar aftermarket DAMPERS on a Busa are little more ego dressing and cool factor.
I'll go EVEN further and say if you've been experiancing headshake or slappers exiting corners, you need to worry more about your riding technique than a New Flashy Damper. No I'm not being funny, rebuild your OEM. And your Good to go. Hanging Ohlins componants on a busa is like running Penske or Bilstien adjustables on a Cadillac Deville, or DTC... Sure you can, but there's little point.
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