Will the motorcycle industry follow?

[jellyrug]

When we look at cars, turbo has become just about standard and reliable everywhere.

Mustang puts out 310 hp with a 2.3l engine and 350lb ft of torque.
A vanilla Chevy puts out 160hp with a 1500cc motor 184lb ft torque.

With the above numbers the Busa motor is no longer exceptional by comparison, especially when one considers that the car engines will operate under a much higher load and reliability is important.

It will be interesting to see which direction motorcycles eventually follow. Smaller capacity with forced induction, perhaps hybrid, perhaps almost all focus on electrical?

Kawasaki working on hybrid motorcycle - webBikeWorld

Kawasaki has applied for a patent for a hybrid motorcycle which is like a two-wheeled version of the hybrid Toyota Prius and Chevrolet Volt.

motorbikewriter.com

 

[Bumblebee]

Turbo vehicles are everywhere but not as reliable as one would think....I know many Ford owners who've had several turbo issues...turbo diesels have been around for a long, long time and I know many owners who have had turbos blow-especially when under heavy load (not applicable for a bike I reckon).

Kawasaki is the class leader with their H2 and I figure the rest of the motorcycle companies are sitting back and seeing if their bikes last. Of course supercharging and turbo charging systems are quite a bit different.

The tech will eventually come out for a hybrid motorcycle I figure. I seen and ridden a turbo diesel motorcycle-it was impressive but heavy as heck.

 

[Bumblebee]

I found a picture of a proposed 1400 B King...I'd ride it...

 

[Bumblebee]

Even a new GSXR600RR is in the works...so who knows....maybe a 3rd gen Hayabusa could be a reality...

 

[jellyrug]

How about a blown 600 weighing 375lbs, pushing 200hp.?

 

[Bumblebee]

How about a blown 600 weighing 375lbs, pushing 200hp.?

Basically a MotoGP bike...the biggest trouble I see with these types of bikes would be the outrageous insurance premiums...

 

[JeffSyh]

Turbo vehicles are everywhere but not as reliable as one would think....I know many Ford owners who've had several turbo issues...turbo diesels have been around for a long, long time and I know many owners who have had turbos blow-especially when under heavy load (not applicable for a bike I reckon).

Kawasaki is the class leader with their H2 and I figure the rest of the motorcycle companies are sitting back and seeing if their bikes last. Of course supercharging and turbo charging systems are quite a bit different.

The tech will eventually come out for a hybrid motorcycle I figure. I seen and ridden a turbo diesel motorcycle-it was impressive but heavy as heck.

I'm my experience with turbo diesels, most failures happen from inproper maintence mostly oil starving or broken down oil. Also its extremely hard on turbos to go from screaming hot with oil flow for lube and cooling to just turning the engine off while the turbo is still red hot hahahaha. Turbos are such a simple FI and extremely reliable compared to any other FI when looked after most new turbos on HD applications last well over a million miles.

 

[Mythos]

Basically a MotoGP bike...the biggest trouble I see with these types of bikes would be the outrageous insurance premiums...

They might overlook the hp and focus on the engine displacement. We all know those small sport bikes are a lot safer than the big ones.

 

[captain]

There is a chance they might skip right to electric too. Don't forget about those hp numbers.

 

[Bumblebee]

I'm my experience with turbo diesels, most failures happen from inproper maintence mostly oil starving or broken down oil. Also its extremely hard on turbos to go from screaming hot with oil flow for lube and cooling to just turning the engine off while the turbo is still red hot hahahaha. Turbos are such a simple FI and extremely reliable compared to any other FI when looked after most new turbos on HD applications last well over a million miles.

I hear you there.

I know at least 4 guys with well maintained turbo diesel pickups who've lost turbos while pulling...not to mention a whole phone book of guys with F-150s who've replaced turbos.

Being from a military back ground, I recall the mechanics were replacing turbos quite a bit, those engines sure turn into dogs without a turbo.

I remember the turbo craze in the '80s and although the tech to control them has made leaps and bounds, the basic principle has stayed the same. Every company who made a vehicle dabbled in turbo applications...

Remember all the "rolling turd" motorcycles they turbo'd..the only decent one was the Kawasaki and that is probably because they started using fuel injection in the early '80s on their KZ1100s.

 

[JeffSyh]

I hear you there.

I know at least 4 guys with well maintained turbo diesel pickups who've lost turbos while pulling...not to mention a whole phone book of guys with F-150s who've replaced turbos.

Being from a military back ground, I recall the mechanics were replacing turbos quite a bit, those engines sure turn into dogs without a turbo.

I remember the turbo craze in the '80s and although the tech to control them has made leaps and bounds, the basic principle has stayed the same. Every company who made a vehicle dabbled in turbo applications...

Remember all the "rolling turd" motorcycles they turbo'd..the only decent one was the Kawasaki and that is probably because they started using fuel injection in the early '80s on their KZ1100s.

Ah yes the trash twin scroll turbos that the ecoboost has. I've personally done a few for friends, those are absolute garbage I'm not sure where they are made but my guess is China. I was just stating basic HD turbos, I see a high failure rate on VGT's the actuators actually seize up but most case you just replace the actuator and leave the turbo.

 

[Bumblebee]

Ah yes the trash twin scroll turbos that the ecoboost has. I've personally done a few for friends, those are absolute garbage I'm not sure where they are made but my guess is China. I was just stating basic HD turbos, I see a high failure rate on VGT's the actuators actually seize up but most case you just replace the actuator and leave the turbo.

It's going to be interesting to see where the motorcycle industry goes....hybrid, turbo, supercharged?? One never knows, Kawasaki is having good success with their bike although I've read it doesn't like to be altered or maxed out.

If I were a betting man, I'd say smaller displacement turbos will be the way ahead...making a 750 turbo which puts out the power of a current 1000 would be pretty easy I reckon.

 

[JeffSyh]

It's going to be interesting to see where the motorcycle industry goes....hybrid, turbo, supercharged?? One never knows, Kawasaki is having good success with their bike although I've read it doesn't like to be altered or maxed out.

If I were a betting man, I'd say smaller displacement turbos will be the way ahead...making a 750 turbo which puts out the power of a current 1000 would be pretty easy I reckon.

Look where sleds are heading with factory turbos, a turbo sled is million times better than a n/a sled due to being able to ram more air in the higher elevation you go. Skidoo has a factory turbo that maintains the same hp at the base of the mountain all the way to the very top.

 

[rubbersidedown]

Harley Davidson is known for being American made. We can all agree they have a big following. True American (and Canadian) Harley enthusiasts HATE the Livewire. When I test rode one a while back for shitz and giggles the "Harley crowd" walked right past it...ignoring it...showing utter disgust.
The old Beemer crowd (BMW) they don't buy the thing their dealerships sell,I rode that one too.

In my opinion...the hardcore motorcycle enthusiasts (be it Zook,Kaw,HD,Duc,whatever) of the world are not ready to accept electric bikes. That's leaves turbo/supercharged bikes for this decade anyway,that's my thinking.
The cons out weigh the pros if you ask me. The Livewire goes this fast,for this amount of money. Take that same amount of cash and buy a Busa and a Kawi...and have change left over. A lot of change.
Ask yourself this...do you actually think hard core motorcyclists really give a fug about the envioroment? I could get around town quite easily on a little 50CC scooter. Get 120 MPG. Is that what I ride,you know,to save the planet...
NO,I ride a gas guzzling turbo charged monster...

...and I love it. I want a huge mutha effin turbo thats so powerful that when I pull up beside electric scooter people the intake sucks them in,chews them up and spits their whiney enviro asses to the curb...

Rubb.

 

[ottafish]

Here's where as I see it the issue with electric vehicles

Motorbike: We will often do 6-8+ hour days in riding season, 500-700+ kms a day. Sometimes overnight runs. We'll pull into a servo, fuel up, stretch a little, maybe grab a water, and off we go again. Rarely would we stop anywhere near long enough to recharge a battery pack. Sometimes it can be 200kms between fuel places.

The same arguments apply for cars: We have diesel cars & 4wd's that will do 1000+kms on a tank. And I've done that many times going between capitals in different states.

Big, sparse countries are going to struggle for electric vehicles as remote charging stations can't exist where there's no infrastructure to get the power from.

If only they had all got together at the beginning and thought of a battery swap station for all makes. You pay your $1000 per year fee. That gives you unlimited slide out-slide in battery swaps. battery is running low, pull into the swap bay, battery pack slides out, fully charged slides in, away you go. All done in 10 minutes. Every brand shares the exact same battery pack.

I think for the foreseeable future, we will have 2 types of bikes, both petrol. The lower powered, sport/commuting/touring type and the highly strung liter bikes for the balls n all type. (cruiser & trail bikes excluded) Commuting is a different story.
I don't see turbo or s/c of bikes being a thing for mass production.

 

[Bumblebee]

Look where sleds are heading with factory turbos, a turbo sled is million times better than a n/a sled due to being able to ram more air in the higher elevation you go. Skidoo has a factory turbo that maintains the same hp at the base of the mountain all the way to the very top.

....and many of those sleds are smaller displacement and 4 stroke replacing the big bore 2 strokes

 

[Bumblebee]

Here's where as I see it the issue with electric vehicles

Motorbike: We will often do 6-8+ hour days in riding season, 500-700+ kms a day. Sometimes overnight runs. We'll pull into a servo, fuel up, stretch a little, maybe grab a water, and off we go again. Rarely would we stop anywhere near long enough to recharge a battery pack. Sometimes it can be 200kms between fuel places.

The same arguments apply for cars: We have diesel cars & 4wd's that will do 1000+kms on a tank. And I've done that many times going between capitals in different states.

Big, sparse countries are going to struggle for electric vehicles as remote charging stations can't exist where there's no infrastructure to get the power from.

If only they had all got together at the beginning and thought of a battery swap station for all makes. You pay your $1000 per year fee. That gives you unlimited slide out-slide in battery swaps. battery is running low, pull into the swap bay, battery pack slides out, fully charged slides in, away you go. All done in 10 minutes. Every brand shares the exact same battery pack.

I think for the foreseeable future, we will have 2 types of bikes, both petrol. The lower powered, sport/commuting/touring type and the highly strung liter bikes for the balls n all type. (cruiser & trail bikes excluded) Commuting is a different story.
I don't see turbo or s/c of bikes being a thing for mass production.

Makes perfect sense to me. I would think even a battery swap would be ineffective after so many swaps. Once those Li batteries are toast, they are toast...

 

[goon]

I found a picture of a proposed 1400 B King...I'd ride it...

View attachment 1628139

So would I but happily exchange the underseat exhaust system for a realistic seat height/bike width combination