XBOX vs. PS2 vs. wait
- Thread starter thesnake
- Start date
Q for dev RandomNick: I'm not sure what part you play in the gaming industry, but can you tell me why it takes 3 years, 75 people and hundreds of thousands of dollars to make games today? It really shouldn't and doesn't have to when you look to independant publishers
as a side question, when will companys get back to focusing on making games that are a BLAST to play instead of games that do the same old thing [lack any originality] and exceed to LOOK better and better?
hundreds of thousands of dollars? Hah! I wish.
Honestly, look at the games compared to the games of the Genesis and such.
Much of the reason is that graphics technology has pushed forwards by leaps ansd bounds, and as a result, the consumers demand more. Maybe not all gamers (look at a game like Rez or Katamari Damacy and you'll see a game that is fairly minimalist in graphics but great in terms of gameplay), but certainly those that arwe driving sales.
People demand huge leaps forwards in graphics (as well as story, writing, voice acting, etc), mainly because it can be done, and if it can be done, it better be. That seems to be a prevalent mindset for people out there -- just look at reviews...games will have reviewas that say "the gameplay is fun, but the look is outdated," and then give it a horrible score.
In essence, people have become tech and graphics whores, and have chosen to forego gameplay for those things (look at Halo 2, or Doom 3 -- one trick pmies that became quite repetitive and boring, but have also become multi-million sellers), much to the chagrin of many developers.
The publishers see this, and since, for most developers, they hold the purse-strings, they have to do what the publishers say; mor often than not that is, "make it look great! above all else it has to look great!" As a result more and more money and time is spent on the graphics of a game.
(And honestly, I doubt that anyone who sees themselves as gameplay-uber alles- would pay attemntion to a game that was stick figures rather than 5,000-polygon normal-mapped characters with full physics. We've gone too far... most people are going to look at the simpler game with derision... apparently you CAN judge a book by its cover, or so they would believe.)
Also, your question about independent publishers (I assume you mean developers -- no publishers are indie by their very nature) -- because of the way budgets and such have been, as well as the market becoming more cut-throat, there are very VERY few developers that are independednt, and even fewer that are in the position to make whatever game they want to. Most indie developers, although not owned outright, operate on a project-by-project basis, and bankrolled by a publisher. if the publisher isn't appeased, then no money to the developer, and the dev closes. Publishers are more about the "safe bet" as far as game content and genre is concerned... after all, this is still a business after all is said and done, and staying profitable and solvent is the most important thing, like it or not.
The days of the true indie developer are waning, unless someone infuses a ton of cash into them with a fully hands-off policy... and that's not going to happen anytime soon.
as a side question, when will companys get back to focusing on making games that are a BLAST to play instead of games that do the same old thing [lack any originality] and exceed to LOOK better and better?[/QUOTE]
I kinda rambled about it above, but the market needs to make it clear that graphics are secondary before the publishers will allow them to be treated as secondary. right now, (nd especially with the next-gen consoles) we're getting to a point where graphics ability is starting to level out... except for more piolygons in a character, there's nothing to add to them (until the next huge hardware leap, like 3d acceleration was), and as that levelling out happens, gameplay will again be more important because that will be needed to differentiate titles from one another, but that will only make a minor difference. Honestly, any real change isn't going to happen until people start making it apparent to the industry with their wallets.
(And don't look for that to take effect anytime soon... your EAs of the world have mad cash on hand, and again, are going to go the safe way, rather than the higher risk path of innovation)
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Mr Brown
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Where did you learn how to count, genius?defender, asteroids, and tetris are still the two best games of all time
Where did you learn how to count, genius?defender, asteroids, and tetris are still the two best games of all time
Mr Brown
Registered
No, it's obvious that "when" never occurred, I asked where so I don't send my kids there........tetris was a late addition-- thanks genius. I think you wanted to ask "when" and not "where"
I'm just funnin ya, don't get upset!
good points all RandomNick. you are right the masses are brined washed into "Shiny/pretty" but as far as wallets go, I bet you they would gobble up a fresh new FUN idea reguardless of graphics potency, but the publishers are not even offering that up, unless you could Namco and Midway old skool arcade collections. If someone came up with a great fun idea [like tetris] people would open wallet - but nobody is even trying while they one up each other for the percieved market. I have been playing since the DAWN of computer gaming and I have stopped buying because there's nothing cool - just COOL LOOKING nothings.
My last 2 games I bought were: Monkey Ball 2, Kirby's Air Ride and Pinball Hall Of Fame for their unique offering and I was not disappointed. Will anybody go "Wow, look at the graphics of Monkey Ball!" no, but when I show them how to play it is FUN! [sigh] I really am not stuck in yesteryear, but not much is blowing my skirt up lately game wise. Sure it is all looking more realistic - but - it's a GAME! I want some unrealism sometimes [TrackMania]
Can you tell us what systems or projects you have or are working on? Just curious. Oh and sorry for the pirates... kinda goes with this territory I guess. I do not believe the impact is that great. Most pirates collect stuff and never do anything with it. ALL the people I know that steal games, go out and buy them if they like them, to support good product, or stop playing them after an hour never to bother with it again.
Can you tell us what systems or projects you have or are working on? Just curious. Oh and sorry for the pirates... kinda goes with this territory I guess. I do not believe the impact is that great. Most pirates collect stuff and never do anything with it. ALL the people I know that steal games, go out and buy them if they like them, to support good product, or stop playing them after an hour never to bother with it again.
Can you tell us what systems or projects you have or are working on? Just curious. [/QUOTE]
XBox, PS2 and PC right now (concurrent development), moving on to next-gen after this project wraps up in a couple of months.
Oh and sorry for the pirates... kinda goes with this territory I guess. I do not believe the impact is that great. Most pirates collect stuff and never do anything with it. [/QUOTE]
It's greater than you would think, but the real hurt get put on developers (and publishers even) in the used game market. That's pure profit for the retailers who sell used game, not a dime goes to the people who made them. Publishers are looking at it, and how to alleviate that issue, but for now it's a hurt.
but the publishers are not even offering that up[/QUOTE]
On occasion some of them do, but mostly, you're right -- it is style over substance. Which is the unfortunate but logical end when dealing with a company calling the shots who eventually has to answer to stockholders... most of which don't understand the concept of innovation, or greater risk/greater reward.
XBox, PS2 and PC right now (concurrent development), moving on to next-gen after this project wraps up in a couple of months.
Oh and sorry for the pirates... kinda goes with this territory I guess. I do not believe the impact is that great. Most pirates collect stuff and never do anything with it. [/QUOTE]
It's greater than you would think, but the real hurt get put on developers (and publishers even) in the used game market. That's pure profit for the retailers who sell used game, not a dime goes to the people who made them. Publishers are looking at it, and how to alleviate that issue, but for now it's a hurt.
but the publishers are not even offering that up[/QUOTE]
On occasion some of them do, but mostly, you're right -- it is style over substance. Which is the unfortunate but logical end when dealing with a company calling the shots who eventually has to answer to stockholders... most of which don't understand the concept of innovation, or greater risk/greater reward.
BusaAdmirer
Registered
PS2
nobody cought MY miscouint! HA! "last TWO game..." 
um.. ok... I'd recommend Xbox for it's online-ness and game selection. I STILL choose GameCube for the games only IT has. Anyway.... I'll be getting an XBOX360 FI they dont screw up PERFECT DARK: ZERO. If it's JUST ANOTHER SHOOTER with the bestest graphics yet, ferget it. If it is a blast to play and has an involving story [like the last one] sign me up!
I quit buying PC games - I download demos and play them until the next cool demo comes out. I get more variety that way, and only have enough time to devote to good demos
um.. ok... I'd recommend Xbox for it's online-ness and game selection. I STILL choose GameCube for the games only IT has. Anyway.... I'll be getting an XBOX360 FI they dont screw up PERFECT DARK: ZERO. If it's JUST ANOTHER SHOOTER with the bestest graphics yet, ferget it. If it is a blast to play and has an involving story [like the last one] sign me up!
I quit buying PC games - I download demos and play them until the next cool demo comes out. I get more variety that way, and only have enough time to devote to good demos
busa_boy_69
Registered
PS2 all the way. Screw the freaking x-box. PS2 has a crap load of better games and that company hooks it's players up and makes everything backwardsly compatible. Being someone who was screwed over by sega many many times I.E. the Sega CD and 32x I have mad respect for a company that does that
ps2 no complaints
PS2 and SOCOM Navy Seals!
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