Harleys # 1 selling point!...Made in USA
- Thread starter Lamb busa
- Start date
again with this lazy union crap....half the benifits you barely have left...vacation...pensions...health care...sick days....all union fought for and employer given (now) and as these cheap ass "greed is good" ceo's takeing every bit of benifit away from you and NEVER NEVER NEVER giving it back....people cry unions are the problem...no GREED IS THE PROBLEM. greed by CEO's. greed by POLITICIONS. greed by those who make thier money by the STOCK MARKET. american companys can NOT offer fair wages when every other country CHEATS by imposeing heavy TARIFS for importing our products but we FAIR TRADE thier stuff into our country. watch some you tube vids of chinnese factory workers and thier working conditions.....think of yourself picking cabbage in the sun....then THANK GOD YOU HAVE A SKILL THAT IS IN DEMAND AND EMPLOYERS WILL PAY A "LIVABLE WAGE" (that is a joke in itself) for. because chinnese and india made products are JUNK...you want affordable products...YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR...leave unions out of this....they are the only ones fighting for your rights to work and receive a fair wage...
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Schexy1
Registered
It's the Unions fault, it's the Liberals fault!
Get a grip, it the unfair trade policy and the need for higher profits that's at fault. How do we get higher profits? Outsourcing!!! Unions and Liberals don't support outsourcing, but guess who does.
I remember when American made didn't mean Chineese parts assembled in Canada or Mexico. Can you guess what group made that happen?
I am in no way a union supporter. Although I think Unions are responsible for many of the much needed labor and wage laws, I don't think they are 100% needed today. But to say they are the cause of jobs going overseas is untrue. Unions do cut into profits, but they don't eliminate them. Higher profits are what sends jobs overseas.
Silly me I forgot the rules.
Rule #1: It is the unions and liberals fault.
Rule #2: If someone points out a conservative's wrong doing, tell them to stop blaming Bush and see Rule #1.
Rule #3: If a liberal has a good idea that might help the American people, scare the people by calling it Socialism and see Rule #1.
Get a grip, it the unfair trade policy and the need for higher profits that's at fault. How do we get higher profits? Outsourcing!!! Unions and Liberals don't support outsourcing, but guess who does.
I remember when American made didn't mean Chineese parts assembled in Canada or Mexico. Can you guess what group made that happen?
I am in no way a union supporter. Although I think Unions are responsible for many of the much needed labor and wage laws, I don't think they are 100% needed today. But to say they are the cause of jobs going overseas is untrue. Unions do cut into profits, but they don't eliminate them. Higher profits are what sends jobs overseas.
Silly me I forgot the rules.
Rule #1: It is the unions and liberals fault.Rule #2: If someone points out a conservative's wrong doing, tell them to stop blaming Bush and see Rule #1.Rule #3: If a liberal has a good idea that might help the American people, scare the people by calling it Socialism and see Rule #1.
It's the Unions fault, it's the Liberals fault!
Get a grip, it the unfair trade policy and the need for higher profits that's at fault. How do we get higher profits? Outsourcing!!! Unions and Liberals don't support outsourcing, but guess who does.
I remember when American made didn't mean Chineese parts assembled in Canada or Mexico. Can you guess what group made that happen?
I am in no way a union supporter. Although I think Unions are responsible for many of the much needed labor and wage laws, I don't think they are 100% needed today. But to say they are the cause of jobs going overseas is untrue. Unions do cut into profits, but they don't eliminate them. Higher profits are what sends jobs overseas.
Silly me I forgot the rules.
What are you talking about? You blame conservatives for a private or investor held company outsourcing to lower its cost of doing business and raise the bottom line. What are you talking about? Stay on point please. The ignorance of blaming one group of thinkers for all of this type of problem is pointless. And wrong! If you think one group is that much different from the other, you are gonna die of a heart attack sooner than later!
Lamb would be surprised. They would completely have to rethink there entire line of bikes for only one market. The company seems to stale and slow acting to make a bold move like that.
It's been a while, but they used to have small bikes, not just the monster cruisers. These were made by joint efforts with other companies which is how the Japanese manufacturers currently build vehicles in India
Hero Honda
I dunno, some of you need to read the article.
Ding Ding, Round One. Here we go again.
By shipping the american made parts to India, then assembling the said parts in India, they are avoiding the 80% import tax on the item. Smart move as India is the second largest growing two wheeled market behind China. The move is not to build/assemble in India and ship back to the USA. That would not work with the hard-core Harley folks.
KvHotDog4
Registered
Ok here goes 
on
I have never been in a Union but from what I hear I never want to be in one because I like to work and it sounds like the Union would make you lazy.
1. The employee doesn't have to work and if they do they are told to slow down so no one looks bad, or runs out of work.
2. You cannot be fired for anything except being late and even then you get your job back and reimbursed for lost wages
3. The owner of the company really has no say as to how the company is run or who they higher.
4. Mandatory raises that the employer can't refuse (without a lawsuit) for people who will not work.
So from all this I am thinking if I owned a business, my workers would not work and I would be forced to pay overtime to hopefully get my product out which decreases my profit, then I am forced to give raises which decreases my profit, then I am forced to raise my prices which causes less people to buy my product which decreases my profit, eventually I am asking myself why am I even in business.
And the reason behind slowing down is because they say, "you will work yourself out of a job". That is the biggest load of crap I have ever heard in my life. Use your head for once please and think about this, if you slow down less work gets done it takes longer for a product to be made which in turn causes the order to be canceled. Also, slowing down causes the employer to have to raise the price on the product because they are having to pay you more and having to keep the lights on longer for each product made, and since the price goes up you sell less and less and less until you are out of a job.
However, on the other hand if you actually work (which a Union won't do) you increase production which causes early shipments which leads to dedicated customers. Also, increased production leads to a larger profit for the company which leads to smaller prices and a company that can grow due to the larger profit. Will the big business get rich off of your work, absolutely, but that is why they opened the business if you don't like it open your own and don't be consumed by jealousy.
The Union was good and was needed but it has out lived its time and is just a money game ruled my greed. It was made to keep the employer from taking advantage of the employee, well now it has reversed and the employee is able to take advantage of the employer.
To all you die hard union people answer me this:
How is a company able to survive when production keeps going down, wages and benefits keep going up and profit margins keep getting smaller?
Oh and try to think of the company not just yourself when answering, because after all when your work shuts down your not making any money
Just my 2 cents. I am sure something has to be good about the Union, however, I have yet to hear it.
I know at 24 yrs old I don't know everything but I know I can't be the only one to figure this out.
I am a member of the AWATU until I hear anything good about a Union that doesn't lead to destruction.
A American
W Worker
A Against
T The
U Union
(just made it up nice, huh? lol)
High wages sound good but if its only for a few years you have not gained anything.
Oh and one last thing raises are earned not given. I am blown away by the amount of people who believe otherwise.
off lol
onI have never been in a Union but from what I hear I never want to be in one because I like to work and it sounds like the Union would make you lazy.
1. The employee doesn't have to work and if they do they are told to slow down so no one looks bad, or runs out of work.
2. You cannot be fired for anything except being late and even then you get your job back and reimbursed for lost wages
3. The owner of the company really has no say as to how the company is run or who they higher.
4. Mandatory raises that the employer can't refuse (without a lawsuit) for people who will not work.
So from all this I am thinking if I owned a business, my workers would not work and I would be forced to pay overtime to hopefully get my product out which decreases my profit, then I am forced to give raises which decreases my profit, then I am forced to raise my prices which causes less people to buy my product which decreases my profit, eventually I am asking myself why am I even in business.
And the reason behind slowing down is because they say, "you will work yourself out of a job". That is the biggest load of crap I have ever heard in my life. Use your head for once please and think about this, if you slow down less work gets done it takes longer for a product to be made which in turn causes the order to be canceled. Also, slowing down causes the employer to have to raise the price on the product because they are having to pay you more and having to keep the lights on longer for each product made, and since the price goes up you sell less and less and less until you are out of a job.
However, on the other hand if you actually work (which a Union won't do) you increase production which causes early shipments which leads to dedicated customers. Also, increased production leads to a larger profit for the company which leads to smaller prices and a company that can grow due to the larger profit. Will the big business get rich off of your work, absolutely, but that is why they opened the business if you don't like it open your own and don't be consumed by jealousy.
The Union was good and was needed but it has out lived its time and is just a money game ruled my greed. It was made to keep the employer from taking advantage of the employee, well now it has reversed and the employee is able to take advantage of the employer.
To all you die hard union people answer me this:
How is a company able to survive when production keeps going down, wages and benefits keep going up and profit margins keep getting smaller?
Oh and try to think of the company not just yourself when answering, because after all when your work shuts down your not making any money
Just my 2 cents. I am sure something has to be good about the Union, however, I have yet to hear it.
I know at 24 yrs old I don't know everything but I know I can't be the only one to figure this out.
I am a member of the AWATU until I hear anything good about a Union that doesn't lead to destruction.
A American
W Worker
A Against
T The
U Union
(just made it up nice, huh? lol)
High wages sound good but if its only for a few years you have not gained anything.
Oh and one last thing raises are earned not given. I am blown away by the amount of people who believe otherwise.
off lol
Schexy1
Registered
Actually it was a joke aimed at the comments blaming unions and liberals. I think the both parties worked very hard to tank our ecoconomy.
The way I see it is, if you didn't cause the problem, you stood by and watched it happen.
Backon topic, eventually Harleys will be an import again. Hardcore Harley riders won't care where they are made or how crappy they are, because they will still feel they are superior to Japaneese bike riders.
2Wheels2Live
Registered
The hard core harley folks are dying off or getting too old to ride, thats why harleys in the trouble its in. And I agree with Lamb, I think harleys too old school and stuck in the tar to adapt to changing times, whether it be making a different kind of bike that appeals to the next generation of rider, or making something to fit another market besides huge twin cylinder air-cooled cruisers. Harley just doesn't know anything else. They'll be going the way of the dinosaurs
But hey, the dino's had a long reign as kings before they went extinct too 
2Wheels2Live
Registered
I beg to differ.....I think one union in particular helped GM out a great dealOk here goes
I have never been in a Union but from what I hear I never want to be in one because I like to work and it sounds like the Union would make you lazy.
1. The employee doesn't have to work and if they do they are told to slow down so no one looks bad, or runs out of work.
2. You cannot be fired for anything except being late and even then you get your job back and reimbursed for lost wages
3. The owner of the company really has no say as to how the company is run or who they higher.
4. Mandatory raises that the employer can't refuse (without a lawsuit) for people who will not work.
So from all this I am thinking if I owned a business, my workers would not work and I would be forced to pay overtime to hopefully get my product out which decreases my profit, then I am forced to give raises which decreases my profit, then I am forced to raise my prices which causes less people to buy my product which decreases my profit, eventually I am asking myself why am I even in business.
And the reason behind slowing down is because they say, "you will work yourself out of a job". That is the biggest load of crap I have ever heard in my life. Use your head for once please and think about this, if you slow down less work gets done it takes longer for a product to be made which in turn causes the order to be canceled. Also, slowing down causes the employer to have to raise the price on the product because they are having to pay you more and having to keep the lights on longer for each product made, and since the price goes up you sell less and less and less until you are out of a job.
However, on the other hand if you actually work (which a Union won't do) you increase production which causes early shipments which leads to dedicated customers. Also, increased production leads to a larger profit for the company which leads to smaller prices and a company that can grow due to the larger profit. Will the big business get rich off of your work, absolutely, but that is why they opened the business if you don't like it open your own and don't be consumed by jealousy.
The Union was good and was needed but it has out lived its time and is just a money game ruled my greed. It was made to keep the employer from taking advantage of the employee, well now it has reversed and the employee is able to take advantage of the employer.
To all you die hard union people answer me this:
How is a company able to survive when production keeps going down, wages and benefits keep going up and profit margins keep getting smaller?
Oh and try to think of the company not just yourself when answering, because after all when your work shuts down your not making any money
Just my 2 cents. I am sure something has to be good about the Union, however, I have yet to hear it.
I know at 24 yrs old I don't know everything but I know I can't be the only one to figure this out.
I am a member of the AWATU until I hear anything good about a Union that doesn't lead to destruction.
A American
W Worker
A Against
T The
U Union
(just made it up nice, huh? lol)
High wages sound good but if its only for a few years you have not gained anything.
Oh and one last thing raises are earned not given. I am blown away by the amount of people who believe otherwise.
And didn't hurt Ford or Chrysler too much either In fact, I'm amazed we still have 3 automakers....but I aint holding my breath
Plus with all that expensive skilled labor they make real good cars Sounds like we'll be completing the circle of life and going back to the AMF Harley glory days
back when only real (greasy) men rode harleys because they leaked so badly, broke down so often, and had such short life spans that it had to be a lifestyle (all you're free time wrenching in other words) just to keep the pos running
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afterhours
Registered
I have two words for the Union supporters....
Job Bank: specifically designed to make it too expensive for automkers to update thier factories with modern, more cost efficient, better automated systems. If an Union member was laid off due to automation, the were kept on payroll....to sit and not work.
at full pay and benefits.....way to go Unions, ensure that the company you work for cannot compete in the marketplace, because they cannot update thier factories....and if they do, then they are punished by having to pay workers not to work.
Job Bank: specifically designed to make it too expensive for automkers to update thier factories with modern, more cost efficient, better automated systems. If an Union member was laid off due to automation, the were kept on payroll....to sit and not work.
at full pay and benefits.....way to go Unions, ensure that the company you work for cannot compete in the marketplace, because they cannot update thier factories....and if they do, then they are punished by having to pay workers not to work.
jeepinocala
Registered
Ok look this really is a good thing they are just shipping parts to Idia to assemble there and sell them there the bikes are not comming back here so anotherwords we will bring some of the money we all spent on ebay back to the us
ok...lets try this again.... in response to these thoughts....we are under a contract...wich means the company offers us a agreement in wich they are willing to hire us to perform work for them...and we barter with them to try to get better than what they offer (every year they take away....never never never give more and isnt that the same thing you do when you NEGOTIATE your wages????) but i will address each point.
1. The employee doesn't have to work and if they do they are told to slow down so no one looks bad, or runs out of work.
this is called "work stoppage" it is a FIREABLE OFFENCE by the company according to our CONTRACT
2. You cannot be fired for anything except being late and even then you get your job back and reimbursed for lost wages
false read above and also we have a list of major and minor infractions we all have to sign and adhere to that are the comany rules of conduct. (yes i have seen in 5 years 3 people fired for thier conduct according to the rules...but also i have seen the company fire 45 people by threaten to close...move machines to other plants...loose thier customers because quality was not the same and then bring the work back to our plant and APPOLOGIZE for thier mistake and NEGOTIATE for us to remain at a increased wage due to our SKILLS NOT FOUND AT REDUCED WAGES OR COST.
3. The owner of the company really has no say as to how the company is run or who they higher.
in our contract the company at ALL TIMES has the right to direct the workforce and the union NEVER IS IN ANY INTERVIEW OR PART OF DECISION TO HIRE. they only join the union once they have gone through thier 60 day probationary period!!
4. Mandatory raises that the employer can't refuse (without a lawsuit) for people who will not work.
every 3 years we enter a contract negotiations in wich the company and the union NEGOTIATE wages and benifits. if we cannot agree on what the COMPANY offers us as a fair increase in wages and ALWAYS A LOSS OF BENIFITS. we have the right to strike but only after the company REFUSES TO NO LONGER NEGOTIATE WITH US. the company has the RIGHT to lock the door at ANYTIME and not let us work. ultimately like when they tried to close our shop 3 years ago...we said "go right ahead" and we negotiated closeing compensation....they moved machines...cut workers...took pensions....then in the end....whoops we made a mistake...please stay!! (we continued to work for 2 years under NO WAGE INCREASE WHILE THEY "CLOSED" under the old contract) once they said they were going to stay open...they OFFERED a wage increase for us to stay...TOOK our pension and replaced it with a 401k. we agreed to it to stay open...now they are hireing and we are seing more and more work...and the company is posting more and more profits....unions are NOT what you were brainwashed into knowing about...work for one and you find out HOW LITTLE RIGHTS you have....and you also find out HOW GREEDY CORPORATIONS ARE that are makeing HUGE PROFITS and pay LARGE BONUS'S AND SALARYS TO CEO'S THAT IS MORE THAN OUR YEAR WAGES FOR THE ENTIRE SHOP and you cry we are the problem!!!!!
1. The employee doesn't have to work and if they do they are told to slow down so no one looks bad, or runs out of work.
this is called "work stoppage" it is a FIREABLE OFFENCE by the company according to our CONTRACT
2. You cannot be fired for anything except being late and even then you get your job back and reimbursed for lost wages
false read above and also we have a list of major and minor infractions we all have to sign and adhere to that are the comany rules of conduct. (yes i have seen in 5 years 3 people fired for thier conduct according to the rules...but also i have seen the company fire 45 people by threaten to close...move machines to other plants...loose thier customers because quality was not the same and then bring the work back to our plant and APPOLOGIZE for thier mistake and NEGOTIATE for us to remain at a increased wage due to our SKILLS NOT FOUND AT REDUCED WAGES OR COST.
3. The owner of the company really has no say as to how the company is run or who they higher.
in our contract the company at ALL TIMES has the right to direct the workforce and the union NEVER IS IN ANY INTERVIEW OR PART OF DECISION TO HIRE. they only join the union once they have gone through thier 60 day probationary period!!
4. Mandatory raises that the employer can't refuse (without a lawsuit) for people who will not work.
every 3 years we enter a contract negotiations in wich the company and the union NEGOTIATE wages and benifits. if we cannot agree on what the COMPANY offers us as a fair increase in wages and ALWAYS A LOSS OF BENIFITS. we have the right to strike but only after the company REFUSES TO NO LONGER NEGOTIATE WITH US. the company has the RIGHT to lock the door at ANYTIME and not let us work. ultimately like when they tried to close our shop 3 years ago...we said "go right ahead" and we negotiated closeing compensation....they moved machines...cut workers...took pensions....then in the end....whoops we made a mistake...please stay!! (we continued to work for 2 years under NO WAGE INCREASE WHILE THEY "CLOSED" under the old contract) once they said they were going to stay open...they OFFERED a wage increase for us to stay...TOOK our pension and replaced it with a 401k. we agreed to it to stay open...now they are hireing and we are seing more and more work...and the company is posting more and more profits....unions are NOT what you were brainwashed into knowing about...work for one and you find out HOW LITTLE RIGHTS you have....and you also find out HOW GREEDY CORPORATIONS ARE that are makeing HUGE PROFITS and pay LARGE BONUS'S AND SALARYS TO CEO'S THAT IS MORE THAN OUR YEAR WAGES FOR THE ENTIRE SHOP and you cry we are the problem!!!!!
This is so true and as such you all can get used to your country going down the drain.
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