So cool guy's --while you were havi'n fun i had to work... AARRGG..........Glad all went well for you guy's
THNX for the pic's... hey Jimbo call me.
THNX for the pic's... hey Jimbo call me.
I'm HOOKED!!
- Thread starter ozz
- Start date
A little technical discussion:
Rob and I started out in C group and quickly learned that we belonged in either B or A (so much slower traffic in C). I found that maybe 20% of the B riders were faster than I was (Gixxers and R-1's with slicks, etc.). When Rob and I were able to break away alone (he on his Gixxer 1000 with new Dunlop Quals and me with new standard Pilot Powers), I was able to stay with his pace when riding at full effort, only twice could I have passed him but felt it would have exceeded my margin of safety AND Rob could have passed me back. When riding at 100% on one corner the rear stepped out on me about 3-4 feet and my skill and compensation saved it. Later my racer friends (who were at the track) said that the Busa's weight, a hot track surface, our pace, and the standard PP's design carcass simply melt the contact surface of the tire under those intense conditions....they suggested either 2 CT's or slicks in the future. They also suggested that for added safety and control, I exit apexes in one higher gear than I was doing...that really helped but of course, lap times suffer as a result.
All in all, wonderful fun, more in the future, and it's fun to have the "regulars" notice that you have the only Busa in over 120 motorcycles! Doyle
Rob and I started out in C group and quickly learned that we belonged in either B or A (so much slower traffic in C). I found that maybe 20% of the B riders were faster than I was (Gixxers and R-1's with slicks, etc.). When Rob and I were able to break away alone (he on his Gixxer 1000 with new Dunlop Quals and me with new standard Pilot Powers), I was able to stay with his pace when riding at full effort, only twice could I have passed him but felt it would have exceeded my margin of safety AND Rob could have passed me back. When riding at 100% on one corner the rear stepped out on me about 3-4 feet and my skill and compensation saved it. Later my racer friends (who were at the track) said that the Busa's weight, a hot track surface, our pace, and the standard PP's design carcass simply melt the contact surface of the tire under those intense conditions....they suggested either 2 CT's or slicks in the future. They also suggested that for added safety and control, I exit apexes in one higher gear than I was doing...that really helped but of course, lap times suffer as a result.
All in all, wonderful fun, more in the future, and it's fun to have the "regulars" notice that you have the only Busa in over 120 motorcycles! Doyle
AWESOME PICS GUYS AND GREAT REPORT!!
As for tires for next time, may I suggest: Michelin PRC fronts and rears. They are Power Race compounds but come in more race compounds compared to the "off the shelf" Power races. You can only order PRC's through the tire vendors at the track days or club races. Dunlop 211GP NTECS are also a way to go. And the new Bridgestone BT002 (the race compounds, not 002RS) and BT003's are some hot sh*t! Lots of racers are switching to the BT003 series. These tires are called DOT race compounds. Because they have treadcuts like a normal street tire (but way less), but they have the same compounds as race slicks. DOT race tires aren't TOO radical in terms of size or aspect ratios, so you can stick to your orignal geometry, or make some small subtle changes.
DO NOT GO SLICKS!! Unless you're ready for radical geometry/setup changes. You're gonna need some trick suspension mods that makes changing ride heights super fast (see Elka, Penske, or Ohlins Shocks, forks, and offsets). I tried Bridestone slicks (granted they were take offs) at my last track day and it seriously killed my laptimes. I also experienced lots more vibrations/front end chatter upon high speed corner entry. The extra grip also requires much more precise suspension setup.
Whatever way you go: DOT Race or Slicks, YOU HAVE TO USE TIRE WARMERS. Both types of tires (tyres) do not take well to heat cycling (# of times a tire heats and cools down) and can destroy the tires usefullness and overall grip levels. They also take forever to get up to temp, unless you're an expert club racer, even then, it requires careful throttle control the first few laps. That's why you see the race guys using warmers, prevents heat cycling. Plus, they can go 100 to 110% ballz out fast.
hope this helps. Charlesbusa and myself will be at Reno Fernley August 9 and 10. You guys should sign up. Or at the very least stop by and hang out.
Good stuff/advice gtrpimp...a major concern re: tires is I want street worthiness coexisting with track performance (as in fast sport touring with luggage)...will the tires you suggested facilitate that? (reminds me of Queen..."I want it all").
Regarding suspension, I too have full on Race Tech and paid Gary (Catalyst Reaction) to dial it in....it blew me away when...as stout as I thought it was, he preloaded it way more, added compression and let go of alot of rebound...best $20 bucks I ever spent! Rob did his too, and loved it.
Re: Aug 9 and 10, if I'm in town(still setting up family vacation), you bet we'll be there. Doyle
Regarding suspension, I too have full on Race Tech and paid Gary (Catalyst Reaction) to dial it in....it blew me away when...as stout as I thought it was, he preloaded it way more, added compression and let go of alot of rebound...best $20 bucks I ever spent! Rob did his too, and loved it.
Re: Aug 9 and 10, if I'm in town(still setting up family vacation), you bet we'll be there. Doyle
if this was your FIRST trackday, ALWAYS REMEMBER: It is NEVER A RACE!!! It's a place to better your skills. Passing is cool, but you shouldn't worry about trying it unless the guy in front is a real dog. my 2 cents
After you get skills, pass some classes, get your race license and enter ACTUAL races... THEN it's a race.
After you get skills, pass some classes, get your race license and enter ACTUAL races... THEN it's a race.
The fact is, I refer to passing simply as a baseline for comparison of my Busa's adjustments. I'm not sure what you mean about your description of passing, I've riden over 30 track days over a 25 year period and the only way to get around a slower rider is a pass. I'm 61 years old and it's unlikly I'll start roadracing anytime soon, but I will go to track days with my friends, ride hard, and adhere to the understood safety culture of the racetrack, including safe passes. Raydog
Thanks Jim!Glad you guys had a GREAT time! I'm almost afraid to ask.........how'd you like the hurricane force winds yesterday? Welcome to Nevada! ARGH!
Our Nevada Sports Bike club group ride up Monitor Pass (approx 60 miles southwest of the track) greeted us with gusts that dang near pushed us off the road that afternoon!
I really liked the part about freeing up your mind with all the variables that we get in canyon riding and just concentrating on technique and not worrying about all problems that can occur on the street so much fun just to concentrate on the riding at hand and not that ticket waiting for me around the corner
dont pass it up Mr. Bogus it is the best fun that can be had on two wheels not to mention the great folks you meet at the track as well just a great bunch and Thankyou again Doyle for such a nice time at the trackwow, that looks like a blast.... I am so ready for my first "track day"(saving for fresh set of rubber)
I'm somewhat surprised to not see the lights taped over.
Anyway, great report, great pix, great to know there's another track-ho in the crowd.
Glad you had a good time...track days totally open a new angle on an already multi-faceted sport.
Awesome!! Trackdays rule!!
Everyone should join me and gtrpimp76 on 8-9&10(Sat&Sun), it'll be the FULL 4 mile course!
The thread is over in the trackday forum
https://www.hayabusa.org/forums/?act=ST;f=67;t=94545
Tires
Its a never ending issue.
If you got PPs greasy because they overheated the PP2cts will not help. PP2cts simply have a softer compound on the edge which will actually overheat even faster than a standard PP.
Slicks are not always a good choice beacuse their geometry is much different from street tires and they're illegal on the street. Plus they don't handle heat cycling well.
DOT race tires are the possible solution. Closer geometry to street tires than slicks and they can handle way more heat than street tires. But they generally run $100 more than street tires and have poor warmup. They also will heat cycle faster than street tires.
The other solution is to slow down when you overheat your tires. If its just the rear getting greasy, a little less acceleration on the side of the tire will help keep the edges cooler.
Everyone should join me and gtrpimp76 on 8-9&10(Sat&Sun), it'll be the FULL 4 mile course!
The thread is over in the trackday forum
https://www.hayabusa.org/forums/?act=ST;f=67;t=94545
Tires
If you got PPs greasy because they overheated the PP2cts will not help. PP2cts simply have a softer compound on the edge which will actually overheat even faster than a standard PP.
Slicks are not always a good choice beacuse their geometry is much different from street tires and they're illegal on the street. Plus they don't handle heat cycling well.
DOT race tires are the possible solution. Closer geometry to street tires than slicks and they can handle way more heat than street tires. But they generally run $100 more than street tires and have poor warmup. They also will heat cycle faster than street tires.
The other solution is to slow down when you overheat your tires. If its just the rear getting greasy, a little less acceleration on the side of the tire will help keep the edges cooler.
Thanks Vman its true you just want more! i swear every time i went out for my session it seemed like it was way shorter than the other two groups 20 minute session
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