Need an opinion on PRIVATE GUN SALE..

[GsxrBots]

So I found a guy locally that was selling a pistol that I want. He is willing to trade me for a couple other guns I have. Here is my dilemma.. Wisconsin has no laws really for private party gun sales as far as paperwork. I've sold numerous guns to friends and when I do that I write up a little like bill of sale stating the serial number and their drivers license number. I've been doing this to kind of save my butt if these guns turn up somewhere they "shouldn't" be. You know what I mean? Well long story short, the guy that I'm trading is an older guy who hates the "paper trail" of guns and doesn't really want to do any paperwork (which I re-iterate is perfectly LEGAL in WI)
Should I be worried about this stuff, or am I just being weird and thinking too much. Basically Wisconsin treats private gun sales like selling a lawnmower on Craigslist. I just want to be sure I don't some day have to spend a month in court fighting to prove I sold a gun 15 years ago. Do I have a legitimate concern?

 

[Dan]

It's the same thing here but I won't sell a gun without a paper trail. It's about sleeping well at night for me....just my $0.02

 

[kaybusa]

I do repo and survailence, take someone with u have them sit in car and take pics of him and what ever he pulled up in. Easy. I do this when ever i buy a bike car or anything i could have issues with later.

 

[BlueHaya]

It's the same thing here but I won't sell a gun without a paper trail. It's about sleeping well at night for me....just my $0.02

+1

If he doesnt want a paper trial, just buy the one he has and tell him you dont want to trade the others

 

[GsxrBots]

Thanks guys.. I passed on the deal. Something is weird about it, since as soon as I mentioned just a stupid piece of paper showing his name and a serial number he was all about skipping out on the deal. No big deal I guess.

 

[MR Felt]

I make a bill of sale just like with a vehicle and I keep it forever.

 

[Ludicrous Speed]

Sounds fishy to me too.. Glad you passed!

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

Thanks guys.. I passed on the deal. Something is weird about it, since as soon as I mentioned just a stupid piece of paper showing his name and a serial number he was all about skipping out on the deal. No big deal I guess.

What are you looking for ?
I'll find it for you .

 

[raydog]

I have bought many guns from private parties.....but you have to run the serial number through National Crime Information Center to confirm "no wants" on the piece. (I am a retired cop so I just connect with an active peace officer to run it but when working I've been stopped by citizens and asked to run guns as well)
The only speedbump is if it comes back clean only because it's an "unreported stolen" firearm...then it becomes hot later. In Los Angeles people would come into the station and we would run guns for them.

 

[White-HotBusa]

Here is a firearm Bill of Sale that I use that you ca just copy and paste to a Word Document and fill in the blanks.

Bill of Sale
Transfer of Ownership

For $______ received, I, (seller’s name here), have sold to (buyer's name here)
One (1) ABC Model XYZ firearm description here, Serial # _____________
Any other accessories here

I represent that this ___________ is not stolen. I am the owner of the _______ listed above. If it can be shown now or in the future that this _______ was stolen prior to the date listed below, I will give the buyer a full refund for return of the _______ and all accessories listed above.

Sold as is.
No warranty is expressed or implied by the Seller.
Seller assumes no responsibility after transfer of ownership has taken place.
Seller assumes no responsibility of any/all aftermarket parts added to the ___________.
Seller assumes no responsibility of any/all original equipment parts on the ________.
Buyer assumes all responsibility when transfer of ownership has taken place.

Seller specifically disclaims any warranties of merchantability or of fitness for a particular purpose of this ________ and disclaims all responsibility for consequential and/or incidental damages or any other losses arising from the use of said _________.

Buyer agrees to the terms and conditions set forth and listed on this document, and acknowledges that he has received a true copy of this Bill of Sale/Transfer of Ownership and certifies that he is 21 years of age or older. Buyer acknowledges and understands that he will read the Owner’s Manual. Buyer agrees that it will be his responsibility when transfer of ownership has taken place to adjust, check, and follow all instructions as outlined in the Owner’s Manual. Buyer attests that he is able to legally buy and possess firearms.

Buyer: Name Here
Seller: Name Here

Date:_________________________

Buyer: _____________________________
Address:____________________________
Phone #: ____________________________
Seller: ______________________________
Address: ____________________________
Phone #: ____________________________

 

[superbeagle]

Now wait a minute. In Wisconsin you cannot get a Concealed Carry. But you can buy and sell like Craigslist. Wow something is wrong with this. Good idea walking away from the sale.

 

[Pardini]

If he is that concerned over a Bill of Sale I wouldn't touch it either. Sounds like he might know something you don't or needs guns that won't be traced back to him.

I have bought many guns from private parties.....but you have to run the serial number through National Crime Information Center to confirm "no wants" on the piece. (I am a retired cop so I just connect with an active peace officer to run it but when working I've been stopped by citizens and asked to run guns as well)
The only speedbump is if it comes back clean only because it's an "unreported stolen" firearm...then it becomes hot later. In Los Angeles people would come into the station and we would run guns for them.

My Son and Daughter In Law are both Deputies. I've asked them about running checks on guns. They say the database records every inqury and they have to justify and document each one. Big problem if they run a gun and it comes back hot and they don't have the gun and it's current possesor in custody. Damn, I thought that was going to be a little perk for me.

 

[mr8ball]

My brother in law got pulled over last night for speeding. He tell the cop he has a CCW permit and that he has his gun in the car. The cop ask for the gun ran the numbers and it came back as a stolen gun. He is booked and put in jail for it. He bought the gun from a guy he works with who's step farther owned the gun and he died last year. Now my brother in law has to go to court and try to get out of this. The guy he got the gun from and his mother is going to court with him but who knows what will come of it.

 

[raydog]

If he is that concerned over a Bill of Sale I wouldn't touch it either. Sounds like he might know something you don't or needs guns that won't be traced back to him.



My Son and Daughter In Law are both Deputies. I've asked them about running checks on guns. They say the database records every inqury and they have to justify and document each one. Big problem if they run a gun and it comes back hot and they don't have the gun and it's current possesor in custody. Damn, I thought that was going to be a little perk for me.

Exactly, I had a San Bernardino deputy friend of mine run a handgun of mine and was totally prepared to hand it over to him if it came back hot. (another friend of mine gave it to me.....he found it in the closet of his rental house that had been abandoned by his crackhead tenant....I was lucky it was "no wants NCIC"!)

 

[GsxrBots]

Thanks again guys, and sorry about your brother in law man! That's EXACTLY what I worry about!

Thanks for the offer Blanca, but the whole point of this deal was me "trading" for the gun. All of my money as of late has been dumped into my two wheeled beauty, and there isn't a spare coin for a gun right now...

For the record, I was going to trade for a Kimber CDP II Custom.. It was a beauty!!

 

[raydog]

Another interesting aspect....when I was a street cop in LA it was always fun to run a gun....sometimes the most amazing history would unfold. One time a .357 Python came back as hot from New York TEN years earlier connected to a robbery/shooting, I arrest the guy and take it all to jail and let the detectives sort it all out in the morning! (turned out the suspects brother was the bad guy and they swooped him up later. He had tried to change his identity but the Python patiently waited until a cop came by for the secrets to be revealed!

 

[pashnit]

Now wait a minute. In Wisconsin you cannot get a Concealed Carry. But you can buy and sell like Craigslist. Wow something is wrong with this. Good idea walking away from the sale.

It's culture. This is a place that when the first day of deer hunting season started, they would close the public schools in some areas.

(deer are like cattle in Wisconsin)

 

[BigBadDodge]

Colorado has the same setup. Only real trade or private sale business i've done is with close friends most of which i was with when they purchased them new. Ran into a issue of what ifs when i was looking to get rid of my AR15. Worked out pretty good as my brother wanted it and he had a nice shotgun i wanted so shotty plus cash and we both know the history of em.
I did buy a really nice colt king cobra .357 through a friend, but the owner was a thornton cop who had bought it brand new in the late 80's and it came back clean

 

[Pardini]

My brother in law got pulled over last night for speeding. He tell the cop he has a CCW permit and that he has his gun in the car. The cop ask for the gun ran the numbers and it came back as a stolen gun. He is booked and put in jail for it. He bought the gun from a guy he works with who's step farther owned the gun and he died last year. Now my brother in law has to go to court and try to get out of this. The guy he got the gun from and his mother is going to court with him but who knows what will come of it.

When I had a CCW I was allowed 3 guns on the permit. Each serial number was listed on the permit. Not legal to carry any other gun except what was listed. They ran checks on all of them. If I wanted to make a change had to drop 1 and add the other by bringing it into the PD to be checked.

Talk about serious over sight for a PD to issue a CCW on a stolen gun. That should never be allowed to happen. Someone wasn't doing their job. Should have caught that when he applied for the permit. I would absloutely never ever apply for a CCW with a gun I was not 100% certain of it's history.

Hope it works out for him.

 

[mr8ball]

When I had a CCW I was allowed 3 guns on the permit. Each serial number was listed on the permit. Not legal to carry any other gun except what was listed. They ran checks on all of them. If I wanted to make a change had to drop 1 and add the other by bringing it into the PD to be checked.

Talk about serious over sight for a PD to issue a CCW on a stolen gun. That should never be allowed to happen. Someone wasn't doing their job. Should have caught that when he applied for the permit. I would absloutely never ever apply for a CCW with a gun I was not 100% certain of it's history.

Hope it works out for him.

Here in Va we don't have to list any guns on our CCW. I think you can buy up to 5 guns a day as long as you have a CCW. I have never heard of a serial number being listed here.