Radar detectors

I accept your concession and retain my conviction. I have owned the big names (Whistler, Passport, Escort) at various stages of my life and have been underwhelmed with anything before the V1. Rather than base all my opinions on articles, I took apart 3 of the products in question and referenced their components.
 
I accept your concession and retain my conviction.  I have owned the big names (Whistler, Passport, Escort) at various stages of my life and have been underwhelmed with anything before the V1.  Rather than base all my opinions on articles, I took apart 3 of the products in question and referenced their components.
You're completely serious......you actually took them apart???
Being that I don't know much about detectors... how do you tell by looking inside which one is the superior product.
How/where did you reference the internals???
 
fbgb,tell us in your words why you think the valentine is superior in real world application? is it the price? if it detects known radar bands at a good range then gives you warning, imo its a good detector, does the escort 8500 not do this? I like the fact it can tell the diff between a door opener and a speed measuring device, and I can use a H.A.R.D. wire system for visual warning, the valentine may have features that you treasure, could that be what you mean by superior?
 
You're completely serious......you actually took them apart???
Being that I don't know much about detectors... how do you tell by looking inside which one is the superior product.
How/where did you reference the internals???
Completely serious.  Each time I've purchased a detector, I have taken it apart and look over the PCB to see what components are used.

Referencing the internals is easy if you have a degree in what you're looking at, like any other profession, I suppose.

As for twisted, if you read real closely, they make the H.A.R.D. unit for V1 as well.  In fact, I was the one who first pointed them out.

I laugh at reviews that knock a radar detector for it's weight or the fact that it's 2 millimeter wider than another unit.  Let's get real.  I'm not carrying this thing around with me 8 hours a day like a cell phone, where size/weight DOES matter.  AT MOST, I'm putting it in a jacket pocket or locking it in a saddlebag (someday I'll have those Beetle Bags).

I also laugh when a review knocks something for not having 8-10 cheapo, hump-shaped buttons on the exterior instead of a central knob, large enough to be manipulated with a gloved hand.  Nothing is worse than trying to hit tiny, closely-croweded-together buttons when you're traveling at high speed and wearing gloves.  Think about it.  As for rechargeable vs. hard wired, I much prefer a wired solution so that I never have to wonder/worry if I have a strong enough battery charge to ensure that everything will work at optimum strength/sensitivity.  If you can't connect a positive power lead to the battery or a main power line with a simple pinch connector, um, well, shame on you... As for taking the V1 somewhere, how hard is it to pull one phone-style plug from the side?

As for the REAL reason I prefer V1, it's all about the Ka band radar, baby.  I have tested it myself with former collegues and even in my admittedly unscientific, straight-forward detection tests (including flat terrain, hilly/hidden terrain, a wide sweeping turn where the gun was hidden by trees on the inside of the turn).  I tested an older Bel (this was 2 years ago), a Whistler and a buddy's Passport against my brother's older V1.  I had never heard of them before then, and thought that Passport was so superior because it was small and trick looking (great criteria for a radar detector's value, huh?)  and it had a lot of word of mouth.

The V1 just plain beat the diodes off the other 3.  Now, granted, some may have made improvements since then (just as V1 has).  Radar guns have evolved as well by leaps and bounds, in fact to the point where radar detectors themselves are almost becoming a moot point anyway with the advent of batching, bursting and "best speed" modifications that most guns are getting along with much lower passive power signatures. Just as the military saw the value in short, high-power burst mode for it's communications vs. a long, constant signal, so too have radar guns gone the way of doing a whole lot of work in less than half a second, greatly reducing its signature and, hence, possible detection at ANY distance.  Which leads me to the last laughable criticism...

I bust out laughing when I read complaints that V1's detect too much ambient signal vs. other detectors.  Damn radar detector, why the hell is it detecting radar so well!  Gosh...

This criticism of levied most often by people who are using the detector in a ridiculous scenario in the first place: city use.  Do you know how many times a patrol unit will sit in a known "false alarm" zone (near a store that has automatic doors, etc) and do pushbutton shots (only fire the radar once target is in sight, and only a short burst long enough to get a lock, less than a half second)???  Bottom line: trusting your speeding safety to a detector in city environment is just plain stupid, but so is speeding in city zone in the first place.

Where ***I*** use a detector is wide-open rural highway.  If I catch a false alarm from a 6-person-don't-blink-or-you'll-miss-it-town, so be it.  I'd much rather be safe than sorry and put up with some of false alarms.  Making units TOO discriminatory caters to city users, which, again, to me is the dumbest place to trust radar detection to begin with.

So, there, we've further qualified and fractionalized the recommendation.  ***IF*** you're a rural speeder where maximum range is the key and limited possible "false" readings are welcomed vs. being too insensitive, you absolutely cannot beat the quality of the detection circuitry in the V1.  It may not be as much of a visual fashion statement on a bike (???  what a criteria), but it will connect to the helmet device I have ordered and will do it's intended job better than the walkman-grade cheaper Hong-Kong units out there.  Not only that, it's the easiest to control with a gloved hand, especially if you purchase the remote/discretion module that I have as well.

If you think that city radar detection is more help than setting-up for disaster in urban driving, then I guess you want one of the other cheap units that have claimed higher discretion and a lot more cool, impress-your-buddies tiny buttons on them.  The choice is yours...I prefer function over form any day...
 
so the real reason you like the V1 is cuz it detects Ka period, or cuz it has a wider range than the others for that band? I have heard stories of the V1 going off on the freeway for no apparent reason, guess thats why I strayed from it that and the price, but if it picks up the Ka band sooner I may have made a mistake? I dont speed too much anyway.....
 
Speaking of the new guns............... Only PNI picked up the new Bee III POP Gun. Not even Passport, Valentine, or Bel could do it! I think you have made an error when you refer to the other brand of radar detectors as being walkman grade Hong Kong units. I called Valentine one and spoke with a representitive of the company. After several minutes of chatting I asked where they get the majority of their parts for the V1. The answer I got really isn't that surprising given the global market we live in. Who ever has the best price on component parts gets their business. This would include the Asian market! So, you see when it comes right down to the nitty gritty all companies are about the bottom line! Profitability...............
as to false alerts only the Passport 8500 can list the frequency at which its detecting. As you no this takes the guess work out since the FCC regulated what frequency they could transmit at on all three bands. No hiding here.......
False Alerts Head to Head comparison
One more Fact, in some states radar detectors are illegal. The police (you/me) can use radar detector detector's, VG2 to snoop them out and issue them a summons.... Only two Detectors are capable of hiding from the latest greatest called Spectre. Only Cobra and PNI were able to evade this new threat........ Not V1, Not Passport 8500, & Not even Bel could do it, Yet! So I say its simple to suffice that all manufactures of detectors are capable of making leaps and bounds in the industry and that any of the top manufactures are capable of making a great detector........ Price is not always a factor.
 
Great reply FBGB, bringing it down to a more functional level. Speeding in a city is a mistake that I am paying dearly for and it had nothing at all to do with a radar detector. There are far more important areas to concentrate your attention to when you are in "the city" than thinking about possible false alarms vs. speed traps. I plan on paying more attention to the "little old lady" pulling out of the grocery store insead of looking to see if there is a patrol car infront of some dam automatic door.

I agree totally that on the open road they can be invaluable. But lets keep it real. What did FBGB say, lock in 1/2 second, dam...that doesn't give very much to bring your speed down from triple digits. If it's only you and the bear on the road and he "clocks" ya, do you really think you can adjust your speed quickly enough to make a difference?

Like the saying goes, "Hello, I'm Chris and I'm a speeder" (group answers "Hello Chris") lol. The only times (and they are multiple) that I have been saved by my detector is when I catch a "bounce" signal off of another car being clocked or when the bear leaves the radar on all the time. In either senario one probably has enough time to slow down. If he has instant on capability and uses it on you (and only you) better get a laywer, no matter which detector you use or how much it cost. Chris
 
I might add that radar detectors are prolly only good for detecting radar, and no good for detecting lazer on/off etc...BUT, the problem the officer has detecting a bike is the lazer gun has to be aimed right at you which isnt easy to do, so the problem he has is that in order for him to detect you and lock on to you, you have to be visible, and if he can see you, you can see him! so keep a sharp eye out! and if you are riding on a multiple lane freeway, dont speed in the lane typically used by officers for speed detection, that makes it even harder for them cuz they have to redirect the gun and that gives you more time to slow down when you SPOT HIM, if there is light traffic and your not in the radar lane you have even a better chance of being missed. specially by radar because the signal is returned by the largest object.

one more little note, why risk speeding on straightaways? you wanna speed, speed in the corners, I,ve never seen them gunning in corners and if they are coming the other way lazer beams dont bend? and your detector will pick up radar!
 
I might add that radar detectors are prolly only good for detecting radar, and no good for detecting lazer on/off etc...BUT, the problem the officer has detecting a bike is the lazer gun has to be aimed right at you which isnt easy to do, so the problem he has is that in order for him to detect you and lock on to you, you have to be visible, and if he can see you, you can see him! so keep a sharp eye out! and if you are riding on a multiple lane freeway, dont speed in the lane typically used by officers for speed detection, that makes it even harder for them cuz they have to redirect the gun and that gives you more time to slow down when you SPOT HIM, if there is light traffic and your not in the radar lane you have even a better chance of being missed. specially by radar because the signal is returned by the largest object.

one more little note, why risk speeding on straightaways? you wanna speed, speed in the corners, I,ve never seen them gunning in corners and if they are coming the other way lazer beams dont bend? and your detector will pick up radar!
Twisted, please don't take offense, but several things you say here are just plain bunk.

1. Radar lane? Today's guns can batch scan a whole pack, in various lanes. The days of hiding in the right lanes behind other cars or behind semis or "behind the largest object" to save you is LONG gone.

2. There is no such thing to a law enforcement officer as a "lane typically used for speed detection..." LOL

3. If you are up against a laser, you are 95% dead meat. Yes, bikes are a comparitively smaller target, but everything is relative. You're not a freakin' stealth fighter (grin)...there are still plenty of useable surfaces on you to point a laser at. BTW, the laser scans in a narrow cone, not just one little narrow focused beam like people envision (this isn't a red-dot targeting laser, har-har).

4. Corners/bends were my FAVORITE place because by the time you see me and/or catch any bouncing radar waves, it's WAY too late and your butt was MINE. As long as I was facing fairly close to 180 degrees to your path of travel to get an accurate reading, you were fair game, and a curve in the road was great, especially if the inner radius side of the road had a bunch of trees or other cover/blockage. I'd sit on the outer-radius side of the road, facing you from the other side of the road and bam...you were so toasty you might as well have butter on ya.
 
as to false alerts only the Passport 8500 can list the frequency at which its detecting. As you no this takes the guess work out since the FCC regulated what frequency they could transmit at on all three bands. No hiding here.......
False Alerts Head to Head comparison
One more Fact, in some states radar detectors are illegal. The police (you/me) can use radar detector detector's, VG2 to snoop them out and issue them a summons.... Only two Detectors are capable of hiding from the latest greatest called Spectre. Only Cobra and PNI were able to evade this new threat........ Not V1, Not Passport 8500, & Not even Bel could do it, Yet!
As for what band: if there is a unit being sold these days that does NOT identify the band(s) being detected, it's years behind the times. They ALL do this, dude, so how does this differentiate anything?
rock.gif


VG2 is old news. My Whistler from 5 years ago detected VG2 and shut down (after squaking like a chicken getting arse-raped). VG2 detection as a feature was never well-received by the market and the technology fell into history. It's not that any of those companies listed can't do it, they QUIT doing it because nobody cared enough to spend the extra $$$ for it. Let's think about why this happened? Well, evolution. Those who still chose to run with detectors said "well, if I'm gonna run with one even though my area bans them, I'd be better off trying to hide it than worrying about yet another warning/detection," so they migrated to the "discretionary remote display" models where the detector was in the grill or otherwise hidden, connected to a small remote display unit that you slyly stuck somewhere within eye-shot of you (and hopefully out of view of John Law). I use a remote display on all my vehicles, but I have no delusion of hiding them as much as I place it on the dash in a place where I don't have to move my eyes away from the dask/windshield "straight ahead" view. With the remote display, I can see the info within the edges of my straight-ahead field of vision. Anyway, with those units, yes, you still got pulled over, and often caught, but the mentality of buyers was "hmmm, if this is hidden, maybe they'll think they got the wrong guy and let me go." I'm sure it's happened now and then, but it was mostly a marketing/mentality game thing, in my opinion. Hey, that brings me to my next point...

As I pointed out in previous posts, ***ALL*** radar detection units are, to a degree, mental false-comfort devices much more than they are true and practical protection. I only trust mine to warn me to the general conditions, I don't sit there and analyze a lot of the info that any detector would spit out at me, UNLESS I'm on the Busa doing Warp 8. For my car and Yukon, no, but then I don't go about 70 hardly ever anyway. The only place where they can help you any at all is out on the open road, and only then if someone is getting clocked ahead of you or you're lucky enough to encounter a department with older technology and/or running it on 100% vs. batching.

In fact, if anything, the old theory goes that they more someone feels protected/safe, the riskier their behaviour as a result. Ergo, if I believe in my magic black box, I drive wilder than I would without it because I believe that it will save me. Unfortunately, with the strides in radar technology being made and with the MASSIVE influx of money from the insurance industry (giving new guns to police departments, investing big $$$ in the radar gun companies for R&D and/or adopting declassified military techniques/technologies as they become available), John Law is quickly turning the tide compared to the 70's and 80's when "fuzzbusters" were viable, even practical devices. In 2003, they are truly about as useful as trying to paint your bike the color of the sky along the horizon. It might help you 10-15% of the time to avoid detection, but most of the time, it won't...at least not in time to do anything to prevent getting nailed, and thereby "Selective Enforcement" has done it's job again. The theory behind Selective Enforcement says that if I'm out there pulling people over enough that I'm seen, but never consistently in the same place or time, people will eventually realize that they'll never really know where or when I'll be, I am much more likely to force people to behave more often because they know that I'm out there, they just never never know *when* or *where* they'll get nailed, kinda like a tourist in Jurassic Park when they realize that the power has gone out and that the velociraptors are on the prowl... You know the hunters are out there, hence you're always on edge wondering if they're gonna get you and you're very very cautious as a result...
 
The only point I'm trying to make to all who read this post "any (key word) of the top four radar detectors, Bel, Passport/Escort, PNI, & Valentine 1 should be more than adequate.......... you cannot base your choice merely on the cost of the unit! Since this is a motorcycle forum I'll try and put it in another perspective. Some good ole boys call the Hayabusa (and similar bikes) Rice burners.... Plastic Rockets or toy bikes just to name a few. These motorcycles generally cost less than a 1/3 of their American counterparts like Harley, Bigdog, or WestCoast Chopper. Just because they are made from plastic, imported parts, & the likes doesn't make them technologically inferior to their counterparts! I would say in some instances they are supreme. Which is exactly the point I'm trying to make with the Hong Kong walkman grade detectors........Technologies change daily..... FBGB is correct when he says not to rely on your detector for absolute protection. After all, as I've said before your detector is only as good as your reaction time.
In answer to your response As for what band: if there is a unit being sold these days that does NOT identify the band(s) being detected, it's years behind the times.  They ALL do this, dude, so how does this differentiate anything?[/QUOTE] it has been sometime since you've seen a Passport 8500 or you'd know that todays unit displays the Frequency in addition to the band. And since we know the FCC has defined those bands/frequencies it would be nearly impossible to hide by a door opener/alarm, etc which generally transmit at around (K band 24.142 GHz) to cloak the police radar gun. Some of the older style doors and alarms all transmit in the X band range at varying frequencies. For those of you who aren't familar with police radar bands they are as follows, X band 10.525 GHz, K band 24.150 GHz, & the only band with mutiple frequencies KA band 33.4 - 36 GHz. I would like to thank FBGB and the others who posted with their comments/ops on this subject. I think it helped bring up alot of good information not only about detectors but how they are or should be used.........
 
Geez, good info ....and what odds do you think you have for attempting to talk your way out of a ticket with Former-Bear?
 
Zero.  The more argumentative you are, the more tools I pull out of my proverbial toolbox and pile on the citations.

If a stop is for something in my gray zone of discretion, I usually know within the first 3 seconds of an interaction if I'm going to let them off with a warning, barring any proven extenuating circumstances and assuming they come back clean on license/plates, etc.

I enjoyed college students the most because they're fresh out of counter-culture gatherings and crammed full of fresh furvor for the Constitution, the Bill of Rights and instantly presume they know all aspects of state traffic code and procedure.  The more they chose to argue, the more I chose to educate them by pointing out other infractions that they or their vehicle were guilty of and writing them for that as well, informing them that if they'd like to keep going, I had plenty of time.

For those who just said "yes, I knew, I have no excuse" I usually asked them a few questions to make sure they were okay and/or if there was any good reason they were in such a hurry.  If they weren't being jerks and just owned up to the infraction and it wasn't too big a number over and they didn't have any other recent points, etc, I usually let them go with a warning.

Oh, and finally, for want of a nickel the dollar was lost. If you think that you're super-human quick enough that discriminating the frequency further than X/K/Ka will somehow save you, then again, you're using it in the city and, well, enough has been pointed out and agreed to on that issue to point out the folly and the uselessness of the functionality.
 
I have a Solo S2 on my Busa and a Valentine 1 in my truck. I think they both detect well however the only advantage to the Valentine over the S2 is it's directional ability. The S2 does have superior lazer technology and is upgradable for free. The Valentine 1 charges you $198.00 and just sends you a new one.
 
I might add that radar detectors are prolly only good for detecting radar, and no good for detecting lazer on/off etc...BUT, the problem the officer has detecting a bike is the lazer gun has to be aimed right at you which isnt easy to do, so the problem he has is that in order for him to detect you and lock on to you, you have to be visible, and if he can see you, you can see him! so keep a sharp eye out! and if you are riding on a multiple lane freeway, dont speed in the lane typically used by officers for speed detection, that makes it even harder for them cuz they have to redirect the gun and that gives you more time to slow down when you SPOT HIM, if there is light traffic and your not in the radar lane you have even a better chance of being missed. specially by radar because the signal is returned by the largest object.

one more little note, why risk speeding on straightaways? you wanna speed, speed in the corners, I,ve never seen them gunning in corners and if they are coming the other way lazer beams dont bend? and your detector will pick up radar!
Twisted, please don't take offense, but several things you say here are just plain bunk.

1.  Radar lane?  Today's guns can batch scan a whole pack, in various lanes.  The days of hiding in the right lanes behind other cars or behind semis or "behind the largest object" to save you is LONG gone.

2.  There is no such thing to a law enforcement officer as a "lane typically used for speed detection..."  LOL

3.  If you are up against a laser, you are 95% dead meat.  Yes, bikes are a comparitively smaller target, but everything is relative.  You're not a freakin' stealth fighter (grin)...there are still plenty of useable surfaces on you to point a laser at.  BTW, the laser scans in a narrow cone, not just one little narrow focused beam like people envision (this isn't a red-dot targeting laser, har-har).

4.  Corners/bends were my FAVORITE place because by the time you see me and/or catch any bouncing radar waves, it's WAY too late and your butt was MINE.  As long as I was facing fairly close to 180 degrees to your path of travel to get an accurate reading, you were fair game, and a curve in the road was great, especially if the inner radius side of the road had a bunch of trees or other cover/blockage.  I'd sit on the outer-radius side of the road, facing you from the other side of the road and bam...you were so toasty you might as well have butter on ya.
<span style='color:blue'>so how does this "batch scan" determine which object(s) it is measuring? lets say you have four lanes with a car in each lane all going 4 different speeds, if the gun is not lane specific, how can it determine which cars are traveling at which speeds? if there are two cars hidden behind a semi and all three vehicles are speeding, how do you determine the speed of the two hidden vehicles behind the semi? and what if they happen to switch lanes before they appear? PLEASE ANSWER.

seems to me if you are in a corner traveling with your radar on I should pick you up before you pick me up, you may pick me up with bending lazer perhaps? and if you on/off me, well, if I am not looking deep into the corners I deserve a citation. and I should pick you up if you are stationary using radar. I would say stationary on/off lazer in corners or straights would be your best bet. I will stick to my comment however, I have never seen any law enforcement organazations trying to measure speed in corners, around here its ALWAYS in the straights in the FAST lane which is the left lane, sheesh maybe there doing it wrong? if so, shush, they dont need any help</span>
 
Back
Top