Rate the Gen II update

[BA BUSA]

Right Rich but now you're talking about a $19000 motorcycle and a Gen I definately would not be $6-7k inferior to the Gen II. As a matter of fact I think the Gen I would still be about 30 lbs. lighter as well.
I'm not arguing against a Gen II, I'm just suggesting a high % of people buy new models to "update" their motorcycles, which is fine BUT another equally viable alternative is keep your equipment, test it, develop it, improve it, over a few years and kind of "really get to know it" at all of its limitations. Help it evolve through experimentation and the wonderful aftermarket.........to levels not accessible to a bike that "one replaces every year".
I guess what I'm doing is kinda describing my relationship with my Busa, and selling it as a really fun way to be in this sport. I guess we all have great stories on how much fun this hobby/sport/passion of ours is. I appreciate this thread because it helped me reaffirm how good it feels to be a motorcyclist. Gen I, Gen II, whatever, just ride and enjoy. Raydog

It's not about the #'s Doyle...and by the way '09 MSRP is $13,200...so it would be $20,200

There is no question that the Gen2 is a better bike than the Gen1. Also no matter what they did in the newer version, Suzuki could not please everybody. If they did do a completely new bike for the Gen2...it would add a lot more to the price...and who pays for what YOU want in the bike? ME and everybody else that buys one, the Gen2 is a refinement of one of the best bikes ever built. I know that you are happy with your bike, and you made it YOUR'S by doing the mods that YOU wanted. If Suzuki still made the Gen1 and the Gen2...and BOTH bikes were the same price. There would STILL be someone that would buy the older version...that's just people and what they like.

Don't pay to much attention to the haterade in this thread, some people just don't get it. I know you and we BOTH have a great appreciation for the Suzuki Hayabusa...

 

[raydog]

Raydog man waitaminute....BS.

Why would hp rating be "pathetically poor and inadequate barometer"? ???

These are performance motorcycles, we always throw out the dyno numbers
and that was just another area that the Bus was king.
What would you like to use to dictate performance...1/4 mile, top speed...?

Dyno numbers aren't the total picture obviously but it does quanitify it a bit
doesn't it.

The only reason I credit the Journalist is he made my point. I'm not just making
this up...it's in print in a national magazine (that most/some of us even read).
Bikes are rapidly getting more sophistacated tech wise with traction control,
abs etc...the busa is still a ten year old design with a few new parts.

If this going to be the only update for another 10 years, they shoulda went
all out and make it not outdated the day it comes out.

You people keep talking to me (making excuses) about the price of the motorcyle,
an 8th GENERATION completely redesigned head to toe, every nut and bolt,
ALL NEW 2010 GSX-R1000 IS A $12,000 MOTORCYCLE....how did they do that ???
Gee, all of the big 4 seem to be able to do it, every 2 years.

And yet..."the King" can not get the same treatment.
It doesn't have to be a $30k duc to be redesigned properly.

Why? because it's only part of the formula so there's more information to be had to complete the thought, like gross weight of the higher hp vehicle cancels out any 8hp advantage (especially when corner speed is part of the assessment).
You're right, Busas do not get updated at any rate comparable to the GSXR 1000. I bet the costs of such a contemporization for Busas far exceed any anticipated financial gain from the buying community. It's about business choices.
We agree that it happens, what seems to be in disagreement is that I don't vilianize Suzuki for their business decisions, I know that they know we're out here and believe they do pretty good when surrounded by regulation and their need for profit. As I read your posts, it seems you have some anger? or at least dissatisfaction over some Suzuki Corporate decisions. That's fine, I support your right to feel anyway you want.....I just choose to complain less and enjoy more. Raydog

 

[raydog]

Well said Rich. Doyle

 

[Justyntym]

If they did do a completely new bike for the Gen2...it would add a lot more to the price...
Don't pay to much attention to the haterade in this thread, some people just don't get it. I know you and we BOTH have a great appreciation for the Suzuki Hayabusa...

Why do continue to spouse the bs...I've given numerous examples from all the liters that get updated and retooled every two years and cost less than
a Busa, as well as the New BMW1000 with a boatload of R&D tooling and
shiney new tech with an msrp of $13K and change...Kawasaki's new voyager
BRAND NEW BIKE and it cost less than $13k...yet for some odd arse reason ???
you still keep spouting that a redesign would drive the busa up thousands and
thousands of dollars.

By your theory, when the Zx14 came out, a complete redesign and total retooling
effort...should cost what, $16,000. The ZX14 msrps for $12K. Explain it using
the logic you continue to use (while ignoring mine) How did they redesign the
ZX12 and make it into an all new bike ZX14 and charge only $12K ???

Well, like you said...some people just don't get it.

And yes Raydog it was a business decision I understand full well and I do
have a slight anomosity towards Suzuki upper Echelon. I feel they chose to put a higher
percentage of profit in their pockets instead of putting more money into a
better bike...they sold us out for money. They could have made a better bike
and still made money (probably more money, but who knows) but they limited
it to changing parts.

 

[raydog]

I must ask myself the question, "Does Justyntym's philisophy help me in my sport in any way?" Then I must answer, "not in the least". Again, I truly hope that the fulfillment you derive out of motorcycling far outweighs the disenchantment you express, otherwise, why go on with negativity that might compromise your enjoyment of the sport?
Raydog

 

[likeapuma]

Why do continue to spouse the bs...I've given numerous examples from all the liters that get updated and retooled every two years and cost less than
a Busa

No offense, but all you're really doing is stating the same facts over and over again, and I'm sure everyone is has already seen enough of the complaining. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, though you try to disprove everyone that doesn't see your views.

Lighten up, Suzuki is a business, they make a business decision to make money. If you don't like the Gen II, hopefully a Gen III will satisfy your hopes for advancements

Till then, ride safe and enjoy whatcha got

 

[dadofthree]

Uh huh....Rrrriiiiiiggghttt.
Drink the hommie brew kool aid, don't think about what might've or should've been
and revel in the 8 hp.

Point is, you see what you want not what is.


Heck, I got HMF highrise, etc., my bike got dyno'd at 172hp

sportrider mag
article bmw1300 vs busa II in the conclusion talked about the Busa being long
in the tooth already?

That's what happens when you just change a few parts...

Sorry brother but as stated already, but I'll repeat myself and waste more of my time for those that might be looking to buy a new Busa. I rode an '06 for 18 months and 36K miles. Loved it. Bought a Gen II in '08 and have over 6K miles on it. The Gen II is a noticebly different / better bike. Nothing wrong with the Gen I, as a matter of fact IMHO it looks better, but the Gen II is a looker too. Now if you want to say I'm drinking kool-aid go ahead.

Magazines auto and bike usually print an article based on advertising. Now who's drinking kool-aid.

One sponsor who loves doing dynos and has dealt with numerous Gen II Busa as well as Gen I Busa has from memory put the Gen I at mid 150's on RWHP and the Gen II at mid 170's. Call it 8 HP or whatever you want, it is noticeably more powerful than my '06. When I bought mine I only paid about $200 more than I did for the '06, same dealer. Obviously the dollar went in the shidder and they cost more now.

When you start insulting people you have lost the arguement friend.

If your point was " I really wish Suzuki had done more " nobody would really care. However you keep arguing that " Suzuki did little to nothing and my Gen I can take your Gen II " " And anyone thinking different is wrong "

Good luck with it.

 

[BA BUSA]

I must ask myself the question, "Does Justyntym's philisophy help me in my sport in any way?" Then I must answer, "not in the least". Again, I truly hope that the fulfillment you derive out of motorcycling far outweighs the disenchantment you express, otherwise, why go on with negativity that might compromise your enjoyment of the sport?
Raydog

He just doesn't get get it does he...

 

[Kento-Moto]

I LUV MY BUSA'S 2000, 2003, ANOTHER 2003, ANOTHER 03, A 2008, ANOTHER 2008 ... I have collectively about 100K miles on the bikes and ...

THEY ARE ALL AWESOME!

Considering everything that has been said already ... and this is MY OPINION, and I know more about MY OPINION than anyone else ... I recently sold the last 03 and am keeping the 08. NUFF SAID !

 

[BA BUSA]

I think I am gonna sell my '08 and go back to riding my 2003 Gen1 since the Gen2 is such a piece of crap

 

[The Big Red One]

I think I am gonna sell my '08 and go back to riding my 2003 Gen1 since the Gen2 is such a piece of crap

Its not a piece of crap.....its just a 10 year old warmed-over design thats only as fast as a liter, tons heavier, with wooden brakes and freaky looks.
Hmmm.........actually I guess it is a piece of crap

 

[BA BUSA]

Its not a piece of crap.....its just a 10 year old warmed-over design thats only as fast as a liter, tons heavier, with wooden brakes and freaky looks.
Hmmm.........actually I guess it is a piece of crap

+1

Why did I buy the d@mn thing in the first place, should have known better

 

[TruWrecks]

+1

Why did I buy the d@mn thing in the first place, should have known better

Sell it to my for $10.

 

[Justyntym]

I think I am gonna sell my '08 and go back to riding my 2003 Gen1 since the Gen2 is such a piece of crap

This is all quite sad really :cookoo:

I make specific claims with hard physical examples provided, and they get
ignored.

You make wild claims and I ask for examples of your logic to back up
the acuzations and I get that "I (yes I) just don't get it". (no examples, because
there aren't any)

Then I get asked why I keep repeating myself

It's been asked what my philosophy has to benifit...it would benifit us all if we would
hold Suzuki's feet to the fire and let them know we're not satisified, instead of the
attitude of Thanking the Suzuki Gods for even letting us lowly creatures
purchase any product they make and thanks for any scraps they may send
our way (which by the way, the latter attitude is shared by a whopping
30%, (read minority) but we'll yuk it up anyway)

I NEVER said the Gen I was better than a Gen II nor did I say a Gen II is a POS
(they are both awesome bikes) nor does it have anything to do with the topic.
The poll is not is the Gen I or Gen II better than the other
(even though I keep reading people pointing that out, like it's significant)
the poll is, is it the Gen II enough of a performance push (bear in mind, we may
well probably not get another update for another 10 years).
but again..."I just don't get it".

I bought my bike in '06 and I've been reading since then how the liters have
been giving us a run for the money. Now in '09, with the Gen IIs...I'm still reading it
and it's followed by a plethora of excuses (and it's only going to get worse,
you got your update already). Truth is we should own the liters, we're sitting
on an extra 350cc (and Suzuki was not locked into that number), yeah we weigh more
a lot more...and who's fault is that?

I think we should demand a better bike from Suzuki for all of us instead
of just ACCEPTING but some people don't seem to want more...
"we can't take anymore we're already blinded by it's awesomeness".

I wonder if Kawi dropped a 200+hp 30lb lighter than the bus with traction control
(which is the bike Suzuki SHOULD HAVE BUILT) if the Yuksters would still be
raving about the Gen II? Wonder if it would still be as...funny.

Everybody seems to think I'm negative about the Busa, nothing could be further
from the truth. The only minor (and it is minor) issue is when Suzuki designed the
Busa they were committed to making an incredible motorcycle with a single
uncomprising vison of pure speed, no holds barred.

10 years later, the "redesign" is based on greed in the name of "business",
followed by a boatload of excuse (many of you have made)
What could have/should have been would be far above the "manna from heaven"
you currently percieve as the Gen II.

What member on this board would not want a Gen II that weighed 20-30 lbs
less with 200+hp (and traction control, option maybe)...yet, I don't get it.

 

[Felony]

This thread is crazy!

I love the gen 1, great bike, tons of options to build on.

I bought a gen 2 due to the gen 1 being so great.

I like the body on the gen2 better, I like the radial brakes, dual fan no need to do a mod, the body work fitting better, better gauge cluster , and a shift light hello! lol

My biggest complaint , gen 2 is killing gen1 prices and in the aftermarkit world gen 2 is higher in price.

It wll take time but the gen 2 will take over, its like comparing 92 1100 gsxr to the 93 1100 water pumper, it took time but the water ruled.

on a bike that has everything, that is retarded fast what more do you want on it? turbo? single sided swingarm? lazer beams?

look a a harley, 16k half the performance, 70s style, banana seat....those are the people that should be complaining

 

[Justyntym]

I guess I expect more (outa life) than 8 hp for a ten year update.

So I guess if they come out with a completely redesigned Gen III
in a couple years, you wont be buying...it'll be to much?

 

[fastblackblur]

It would be neat to get some engineering perspective on these issues. What exactly would have to be done to meet your expectations and still be a reliable motorcycle and meet all noise/enviromental standards.

 

[Justyntym]

well ya know...since you asked.

To be fair I always gave the Gen II a 15hp bump by my seat o'pants dyno meter
I also remember reading that the new engine does have lighter pistions, valvles
etc. so it spools up faster than a Gen I, hence it feels like more power.
All of which makes sense between the Dyno charts and my pants...

Now...In talking to Chris Jones of Jones performance, who tuned my bike
(AND HE BROUGHT IT UP BTW)
asked what I thought of the Gen II update. Since he was tuning my bike I
answered cautiously...He responded that for street riders, the Gen II was...
(not trying to p'o' anyone) not quite worth the money (I wont elaberate)

But...here's my point...he said if your going to drag race, all the internals are
there and it is REAL EASY to open her up and let the Gen II breath and pop
200+hp...easily. I'm thinking he might of even said 220hp...but it was about
6 months ago and I can't be sure.

He did offer to add a cam (plus a few other things) to mine and I'd get around
190+hp without to much rework.

So...the potential is there (I believe) don't know about the reliability though...

http://www.shinkotireusa.com/newslist.php

John Fernandez, in his first outing for the WPS/Shinko Tire/Jones Performance Team, took top honors in the Super Street class, beating none other than drag racing legend Ricky Gadson in Finals. Fernandez used stock Shinko 003 Stealth radial tires on the way to his epic victory.

 

[Justyntym]

What dictated motor size though was they didn't want a wider case,
then they can use the same case and more importantly the same frame,
(read $$$ in pocket) so they made the stroke longer instead....whoopee.

 

[turbobusa2000]

I guess I expect more (outa life) than 8 hp for a ten year update.

So I guess if they come out with a completely redesigned Gen III
in a couple years, you wont be buying...it'll be to much?

Did you buy the GEN II, if you did then how can you complain. If not, why do you care.