Say hello to Lucy, the new shop bike.
- Thread starter Boosted Cycle Perf
- Start date
That looks nice. I’d surly hope that thing makes well north of 500hp. A stock displacement gen 1 will make 550whp.
I finally freed up some time to look over the ole girl and get her ready for some experiments. I rode it a little last weekend, and while she runs really strong, I could tell something was a bit off. So I pulled the air filter, checked the plugs, and this is what I found. Now mind you, the ad specially stated that the bike was “well maintained” I’d hate to see what the a poorly maintained bike would look like from the previous owner.
The bike has 14k on it, and I’m pretty sure the plugs and filter have been in it since the showroom floor. I’m sure it comes as no surprise that she now fires up instantly compared to a long and lazy start up.
Other things I found were low oil, no coolant in the overflow bottle, and extremely worn chain and sprockets with the wrong master link used. I noticed some burnt oil on the back of the intake valves as it appears the seals are leaking a bit. I’m hoping they’re just a little dry from sitting from so long, and may seal back up with some run time.
I by no means believed a single word the previous owner told me. I knew without a doubt I was gonna find the stuff that I did, and wasn’t surprised a bit. That’s why I paid what I did. I only really cared that it was mechanically sound enough to last a few hundred miles on a stock motor with boost. I feel it will do fine. However I’m going to push it so I see it failing sooner lol.
Now down to business. I welded in a o2 bung, installed the wideband data logger, flash harness, and did the same basic ecu flash I’ve done for many of you guys.
I was gonna cut the cats out, but if I’m gonna pull the exhaust, a turbo is going on in it’s place. So I’m going to tune it as is, stock header and slip ons on 93 pump fuel, drain the tank, and then tune it on e98 to see if it picks up any. I’m going to attempt this on the bone stock fuel system. I know it has enough injector as I made 280hp on e98 with stock injectors. But I think it might run out of fuel pump.
If that’s the case I’ve come up with a plan. Let’s say it runs out of fuel pump at 7k rpm. I’ll compare the e98 dyno graph to the 93 dyno graph. If it’s picking up noticeable HP by then I’ll convert it to the turbo fuel system and put it back on to see the final result. If there is no noticeable gains, I’ll call it a day, and go forward with the turbo.
More to come fellas!
The bike has 14k on it, and I’m pretty sure the plugs and filter have been in it since the showroom floor. I’m sure it comes as no surprise that she now fires up instantly compared to a long and lazy start up.
Other things I found were low oil, no coolant in the overflow bottle, and extremely worn chain and sprockets with the wrong master link used. I noticed some burnt oil on the back of the intake valves as it appears the seals are leaking a bit. I’m hoping they’re just a little dry from sitting from so long, and may seal back up with some run time.
I by no means believed a single word the previous owner told me. I knew without a doubt I was gonna find the stuff that I did, and wasn’t surprised a bit. That’s why I paid what I did. I only really cared that it was mechanically sound enough to last a few hundred miles on a stock motor with boost. I feel it will do fine. However I’m going to push it so I see it failing sooner lol.
Now down to business. I welded in a o2 bung, installed the wideband data logger, flash harness, and did the same basic ecu flash I’ve done for many of you guys.
I was gonna cut the cats out, but if I’m gonna pull the exhaust, a turbo is going on in it’s place. So I’m going to tune it as is, stock header and slip ons on 93 pump fuel, drain the tank, and then tune it on e98 to see if it picks up any. I’m going to attempt this on the bone stock fuel system. I know it has enough injector as I made 280hp on e98 with stock injectors. But I think it might run out of fuel pump.
If that’s the case I’ve come up with a plan. Let’s say it runs out of fuel pump at 7k rpm. I’ll compare the e98 dyno graph to the 93 dyno graph. If it’s picking up noticeable HP by then I’ll convert it to the turbo fuel system and put it back on to see the final result. If there is no noticeable gains, I’ll call it a day, and go forward with the turbo.
More to come fellas!
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michael parris heuberger
Registered
Hi. Who makes E98 ? Why not VP M5 ? For gas has anyone used VP C23 ?MON 120 SPEC GRAV .709 @60F. I have an Bosch 044 will that be enought fuel if I run M5? The turbo will be a garret 40/88 or a 42. It will have 20 front and a 36 or 38 rear with Robinsons OD 5th and 6th gears and a 200/55 tire. Also there low 1th gear. Full built motor parts by DME. It will max RPM 13500.That's cool
04LE
Registered
My guess is an E-fuel is cheaper than a race fuel.
Mathewrussell52
Registered
Why not go e85 on the test. Isn’t that what everyone wants to know. What benefits do you get at the pump.
M5 is pure methanol and requires a massive fuel system. I’m running M1 in my grudge bike. Running a mechanically driven fuel pump for that set up.
Drum fuel to drum fuel, ethanol fuel is still considerably cheaper. But obviously more expensive then pump fuel.
E85 from the pump is hardly ever e85. The two stations close to me range from 63-75%. I have a drum of e98, so that’s what we’re using. The gains will diminish and ethanol content goes down.
Johnnie Phatt
Registered
Let's go back a post or two. Did I read that you got 260 on e85 with a stock motor. Or was I blending previous builds you have done with what you are currently plan on doing to Lucy? if
You’re partially right. 280whp on a bone stock motor, rcc stage 1, 5 ish psi. This same bike made 230hp on 93 earlier in the morning.
Wow!
Wow!!!
That motor sounds and performs amazing . . .
must be exhilarating to open the throttle in 3rd gear at 4500rpm on a long straight road in a scenic location, with NO traffic and NO cops anywhere!
Wow!
Wow!!!
That motor sounds and performs amazing . . .
must be exhilarating to open the throttle in 3rd gear at 4500rpm on a long straight road in a scenic location, with NO traffic and NO cops anywhere!
3rd??? Brake boost it in first gear from about 30mph then let it eat. That’s when things get really exciting.
Sorry, didn’t finish answering.
The whole point for attaining Lucy is to be a test mule for the final stages R&D for some products I’ll be rolling out here very shortly. While I can’t say for what exactly yet, consider y’alls tax returns spent fellas...
The other mission is to test new technology. If you look at the performance automotive world over the last 6-8 years, it’s made huge leaps in terms of manufacturing, engineering that net more hp per dollar spent on end products. Like turbos, ecu, injectors, fuel pumps, pistons and so on.
Take a look at the turbo hayabusa world, overall everyone’s been using the same stuff, and doing it the same way for years. Not saying that’s wrong by any means, but maybe there’s a better way. That’s what I’d like to find out.
Speaking of doing the same thing for years, there’s several things that I’ve been told, and have read in regards to limits, and what not to do as I’ve come up through the ranks as a builder and tuner. And I’ve always stuck with those guidelines as the information was passed down through smart, reputable builders/tuners. But I never saw hard data to back that up. Sure their theories are sound, but show me the data.
Lucy is being equipped with a stand alone data logger to monitor just about everything you can imagine. Over the years I’ve acquired piles of parts. So I figure, what the heck, let’s push things to their limits and possibly even failure and see what we can learn.
So we’re gonna slap some lipstick on this wore out old girl, slap her on the ass, and send her out on stage to make her dance. She will get restored back to her former glory after testing is completed. But she’ll be a lot prettier, lower, and faster. Just gotta put in some hard work first.
Results are in!
Ran ole Lucy on the dyno today. Stock fuel system, stock header (with cats) and slip ons.
Baseline: 184whp 109tq (not shown on graph)
93 octane: 191whp 112tq (lighter trace)
E98: 197whp 116tq (darker trace)
Pretty decent gains over 93 for not just peak HP and tq, but for the entire rpm range.
I pulled it off the dyno, and made a few quick hits on the back roads and I can say stock ecu tune vs e98, it feels like a completely different bike. Not just wide open, but in regards to throttle response and mid range power. I actually experienced some wheel hop around 8k rpm in second gear. I feel like the bolt on extensions are not happy with the new found power and torque. Those will be gone shortly.
Surprisingly, it didn’t run out of fuel pump, as well as injector duty cycle never got higher then 65%. So I could see this fuel being beneficial on a 1396, or maybe 1441 with a little bit of compression or mild cams.
This was also a down and dirty quick tune. Took 3 pulls to get the 93 octane tune dialed in. Starting from scratch, it took 6 pulls to get the e98 to safe level. Two of those pulls were playing with timing.
Also worth mentioning, while yes it has slip ons, it might as well have stock mufflers on it because of the stock header with cats. That’s your biggest restriction. Had I removed the cats, or had an aftermarket header on it I could easily see this same set up making at least 210hp. The stock cats cause a lot of back pressure, so after adding one degree of timing it picked up 8hp peak, then only 1hp afterwards. So I set it back to one degree advance.
So final thoughts: the popular go to fuel for motorcycles is VP MR12, which comes in at $152 per 5 gallon pail. VP X98 is $48 per 5 gallon pail. I saw a 3% increase in hp, while MR12 claims up to a 5% increase in HP. Is 3hp worth an extra $100? That’s up to you. I’d be willing to bet you could pick up that extra 3hp or more stepping down to VP X85 as it has a slightly lower octane rating then the X98.
Interesting findings, but now it’s time for some boost. More to come after the weekend!
Ran ole Lucy on the dyno today. Stock fuel system, stock header (with cats) and slip ons.
Baseline: 184whp 109tq (not shown on graph)
93 octane: 191whp 112tq (lighter trace)
E98: 197whp 116tq (darker trace)
Pretty decent gains over 93 for not just peak HP and tq, but for the entire rpm range.
I pulled it off the dyno, and made a few quick hits on the back roads and I can say stock ecu tune vs e98, it feels like a completely different bike. Not just wide open, but in regards to throttle response and mid range power. I actually experienced some wheel hop around 8k rpm in second gear. I feel like the bolt on extensions are not happy with the new found power and torque. Those will be gone shortly.
Surprisingly, it didn’t run out of fuel pump, as well as injector duty cycle never got higher then 65%. So I could see this fuel being beneficial on a 1396, or maybe 1441 with a little bit of compression or mild cams.
This was also a down and dirty quick tune. Took 3 pulls to get the 93 octane tune dialed in. Starting from scratch, it took 6 pulls to get the e98 to safe level. Two of those pulls were playing with timing.
Also worth mentioning, while yes it has slip ons, it might as well have stock mufflers on it because of the stock header with cats. That’s your biggest restriction. Had I removed the cats, or had an aftermarket header on it I could easily see this same set up making at least 210hp. The stock cats cause a lot of back pressure, so after adding one degree of timing it picked up 8hp peak, then only 1hp afterwards. So I set it back to one degree advance.
So final thoughts: the popular go to fuel for motorcycles is VP MR12, which comes in at $152 per 5 gallon pail. VP X98 is $48 per 5 gallon pail. I saw a 3% increase in hp, while MR12 claims up to a 5% increase in HP. Is 3hp worth an extra $100? That’s up to you. I’d be willing to bet you could pick up that extra 3hp or more stepping down to VP X85 as it has a slightly lower octane rating then the X98.
Interesting findings, but now it’s time for some boost. More to come after the weekend!
busakiller
Registered
That looks like a solid gain in my book.
Nastee
Registered
Cops you think a cop is even going to pull out to chase if that MONSTER is ripping it up. Not a chance!Wow!
Wow!!!
That motor sounds and performs amazing . . .
must be exhilarating to open the throttle in 3rd gear at 4500rpm on a long straight road in a scenic location, with NO traffic and NO cops anywhere!
Johnnie Phatt
Registered
Excuse my lack of knowledge. Is E 98 made of 98% ethanol and 2% gasoline? And sold by the drum? Or can buy it at a pump at a gas STN? Up here all we have is "may contain up to 10% ethanol". Usually in regular and medium. Some premiums are pure gas at 93 octane which is what I use. Thank you for any clarification you can provide
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