After America, There is noplace to go...

I am not saying there are not any facts in the article but it is also not a true representation of events. She implies that Austria willingly became National Socialist but that is not really true. Hitler and the German Gov. Forced them to accept it through the threat of military action. So you see there is only partial truth to what she says in that case. Once you start to dismantle her opinion you find that it is no more accurite than much or the other right wing crap that is out there. Just becasue she was there means nothing. Palin lives in Alaska but still can't figure out how much energy they produce.

Your version of history is based on what? What you read? What you were taught? What the victors wrote in the history books? That's a fairly pompous, though close minded, stance to take.

Can you back up your statement and opinion with any other "eye-witness" accounts?

I would think a person who lived through this, whether right or wrong, has a very distinct perception of what it was to be a youth, a citizen, and a person in that location at that time. Therefore, I don't think one should completely discard what is shared based purely on an outsider's perspective written after the fact. Two "people" can have a different account of events based on how they relate to those events without anyone being incorrect.
 
I like Peanut Butter and Jelly sandwiches..
But only grape.....with smooth PB......


Hi guys......:welcome:


Not draggin me into another political convo....



1 point. Hitler was an incredible and mesmerizing speaker. He single handedly brought Germany out of great depression after WWI and made it a world power in less than 15yrs.
A few great things he did are still there but cuz of his insane ways they are not highlighted. One of the things he created was a Natl Hgwy systm now known as the Autobahn.
Also was the brain behind the idea of the 'peoples car' or Volkwagon.
One of the first to have a press sec as well propaganda minister. He had Joseph Goebbels, Leni Riefenstahl and numeorus others who were masters at public speeches and production.
Hitler with their help was so motivating that he moved normal folks and convinced them to follow him to nationwide destruction.
His Nuremburg speech puts the million man march to shame. The man could orate and hypnotize doing it.
BUT
Insane as well all of them.



ps......Skydvr thanks for the thoughts.....
 
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Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same, or one day we will spend our sunset years telling our children and our children's children what it was once like in the United States where men were free.
Roland Reagan.

"This present window of opportunity, during which a truly peaceful and interdependent world order might be built, will not be open for too long - We are on the verge of a global transformation. All we need is the right major crisis and the nations will accept the New World Order." David Rockefeller.

"For more than a century ideological extremists at either end of the political spectrum have seized upon well-publicized incidents such as my encounter with Castro to attack the Rockefeller family for the inordinate influence they claim we wield over American political and economic institutions. Some even believe we are part of a secret cabal working against the best interests of the United States, characterizing my family and me as ‘internationalists’ and of conspiring with others around the world to build a more integrated global political and economic structure – one world, if you will. If that’s the charge, I stand guilty, and I am proud of it." -David Rockefeller, from his own book, Memoirs.

"We are grateful to the Washington Post, the New York Times, Time magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected the promises of discretion for almost forty years. It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subject to the bright lights of publicity during those years. But, the world is now more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world-government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the National auto determination practiced in past centuries"--David Rockefeller in an address to a Trilateral Commission meeting
in June of 1991

We head closer to scary direction every single day. I close with this quote:

"We shall have world government whether or not you like it, by conquest or consent."

Something is wrong when people aren't afraid to make claims like this...
 
ANARCHY.....ATTICA......ATTICA....ATTICA...........WOLVERINES....!
We will not survive if we dont fight....fight...fight.....

Our days with Mary Jane Rotten Crotch are over...

Lemme see your Warface soldier.........AAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH !

full%2Bmetal%2Bjacket.jpg


7.62mm FULL METAL JACKET solves all.....:laugh:

SIG AMT 1.jpg
 
Your version of history is based on what? What you read? What you were taught? What the victors wrote in the history books? That's a fairly pompous, though close minded, stance to take.

Can you back up your statement and opinion with any other "eye-witness" accounts?

I would think a person who lived through this, whether right or wrong, has a very distinct perception of what it was to be a youth, a citizen, and a person in that location at that time. Therefore, I don't think one should completely discard what is shared based purely on an outsider's perspective written after the fact. Two "people" can have a different account of events based on how they relate to those events without anyone being incorrect.

Like you said they can live through it and still have the wrong preception.

I never said to completely discard this, there is some factual information. I pointed some of it out. What I am saying is just because someone wrote an article and spun history to fit your idea of events doesn't make it right.

This lady is Head of the South Dakota chapter of Eagle Forum os even if you agree with her: SHE HAS AN AGENDA.

And she is a kook.

Besides, politically, Nazism is a variety of fascism that incorporated elements from left-wing and right-wing ideologies, but, in practice, is a form of far right politics...
 
We must always be conscious of, and stand against, the threat of totalitarianism. As Saiid stated, Hitler was a brilliant man (albiet insane); I do not idolize him one bit (I hope he's burning in Hell every day). "Absolute power corrupts absolutely". This is not a "Left vs. Right" troll, this is more about how sweet the freedoms we have are, and how we must protect them and be forever vigilant or lose them...

My question: Do you see any similarities to what is happening in America today? I'd say "Some"....and that scares me.

The below shamlessly plagarized:

--------------------

totalitarianism (tōtăl'ĭtâr`ēənĭzəm), a modern autocratic government in which the state involves itself in all facets of society, including the daily life of its citizens. A totalitarian government seeks to control not only all economic and political matters but the attitudes, values, and beliefs of its population, erasing the distinction between state and society. The citizen's duty to the state becomes the primary concern of the community, and the goal of the state is the replacement of existing society with a perfect society.

Various totalitarian systems, however, have different ideological goals. For example, of the states most commonly described as totalitarian—the Soviet Union under Stalin, Nazi Germany, and the People's Republic of China under Mao—the Communist regimes of the Soviet Union and China sought the universal fulfillment of humankind through the establishment of a classless society (see communism communism, fundamentally, a system of social organization in which property (especially real property and the means of production) is held in common. Thus, the ejido system of the indigenous people of Mexico and the property-and-work system of the Inca were both
; German National Socialism National Socialism or Nazism, doctrines and policies of the National Socialist German Workers' party, which ruled Germany under Adolf Hitler from 1933 to 1945, on the other hand, attempted to establish the superiority of the so-called Aryan race.

Characteristics: Despite the many differences among totalitarian states, they have several characteristics in common, of which the two most important are: the existence of an ideology that addresses all aspects of life and outlines means to attain the final goal, and a single mass party through which the people are mobilized to muster energy and support. The party is generally led by a dictator dictator, originally a Roman magistrate appointed to rule the state in times of emergency; in modern usage, an absolutist or autocratic ruler who assumes extraconstitutional powers. From 501 B.C. until the abolition of the office in 44 B.C., Rome had 88 dictators; and, typically, participation in politics, especially voting, is compulsory. The party leadership maintains monopoly control over the governmental system, which includes the police, military, communications, and economic and education systems. Dissent is systematically suppressed and people terrorized by a secret police. Autocracies through the ages have attempted to exercise control over the lives of their subjects, by whatever means were available to them, including the use of secret police and military force. However, only with modern technology have governments acquired the means to control society; therefore, totalitarianism is, historically, a recent phenomenon.

By the 1960s there was a sharp decline in the concept's popularity among scholars. Subsequently, the decline in Soviet centralization after Stalin, research into Nazism revealing significant inefficiency and improvisation, and the Soviet collapse may have reduced the utility of the concept to that of an ideal or abstract type. In addition, constitutional democracy [Gr.,=rule of the people], term originating in ancient Greece to designate a government where the people share in directing the activities of the state, as distinct from governments controlled by a single class, select group, or autocrat.

Totalitarianism, as forms of the modern state, share many characteristics. In both, those in authority have a monopoly on the use of the nation's military power and on certain forms of mass communication; and the suppression of dissent, especially during times of crisis, often occurs in democracies as well. Moreover, one-party systems are found in some nontotalitarian states, as are government-controlled economies and dictators.

Causes: There is no single cause for the growth of totalitarian tendencies. There may be theoretical roots in the collectivist political theories of Plato Plato (plā`tō), 427?–347 B.C., Greek philosopher Jean Jacques Rousseau, and Karl Marx Marx, Karl, 1818–83, German social philosopher, the chief theorist of modern socialism and communism .

Early Life

Marx's father, a lawyer, converted from Judaism to Lutheranism in 1824. But the emergence of totalitarian forms of government is probably more the result of specific historical forces. For example, the chaos that followed in the wake of World War I allowed or encouraged the establishment of totalitarian regimes in Russia, Italy, and Germany, while the sophistication of modern weapons and communications enabled them to extend and consolidate their power...(etc. etc.)
 
Have I mentioned that I like PB&J sammies , with lays chips in between !

Nice glass of Vitamin D milk


Hi !
 
Someone needs a history lesson, that is not exactly how it happened... For those that think they learned something I have a bridge to sell you.

It's too late, you have already bought the bridge! :dunno:
 
Like you said they can live through it and still have the wrong preception.

I never said to completely discard this, there is some factual information. I pointed some of it out. What I am saying is just because someone wrote an article and spun history to fit your idea of events doesn't make it right.

This lady is Head of the South Dakota chapter of Eagle Forum os even if you agree with her: SHE HAS AN AGENDA.

And she is a kook.

Besides, politically, Nazism is a variety of fascism that incorporated elements from left-wing and right-wing ideologies, but, in practice, is a form of far right politics...


I also asked you where you are getting your "facts" and what you are basing your opinion on that makes you attack her recollection.

I won't mince words with ya Dino. You're attacking a person who has a MEMORY of actually BEING THERE versus what you have come to BELIEVE to be accurate. However, you won't share how you came to believe what it is that you do.

Once again you're adding nothing to the conversation other than a superior (read: pompous) attitude.

Care to share? :poke:

No wait. Give me a second. I'll hold my breath. :moon:
 

Where yu at...where yu at...
There he go....there he go..

Peanut butter and jelly with a baseball bat.....


Now there he go.....

Peanut butter jelly..Peanut butter jelly..Peanut butter jelly..Peanut butter jelly..Peanut butter jelly..Peanut butter jelly..Peanut butter jelly..

with a baseball bat...


Now freestyle.....

:welcome:


umanut !
 
I also asked you where you are getting your "facts" and what you are basing your opinion on that makes you attack her recollection.

I won't mince words with ya Dino. You're attacking a person who has a MEMORY of actually BEING THERE versus what you have come to BELIEVE to be accurate. However, you won't share how you came to believe what it is that you do.

Once again you're adding nothing to the conversation other than a superior (read: pompous) attitude.

Care to share? :poke:

No wait. Give me a second. I'll hold my breath. :moon:


You do realize that the Nazi's were Facist and Facism is a radical right wing ideology, right?

Maybe we should start there:

Politically, Nazism is a variety of fascism that incorporated elements from left-wing and right-wing ideologies, but, in practice, is a form of far right politics.

Fritzsche, Peter. 1998. Germans into Nazis. Cambridge, Mass.: Harvard University Press; Eatwell, Roger, Fascism, A History, Viking/Penguin, 1996, pp.xvii-xxiv, 21, 26–31, 114–140, 352. Griffin, Roger. 2000.

"Revolution from the Right: Fascism," chapter in David Parker (ed.) Revolutions and the Revolutionary Tradition in the West 1560-1991, Routledge, London.


Ok back to what she posted and I already stated:

MOSCOW CONFERENCE, October, 1943,

DECLARATION ON AUSTRIA

The governments of the United Kingdom, the Soviet Union and the United States of America are agreed that Austria, the first free country to fall a victim to Hitlerite aggression, shall be liberated from German domination.

They regard the annexation imposed on Austria by Germany on March 15, 1938, as null and void. They consider themselves as in no way bound by any charges effected in Austria since that date. They declare that they wish to see re-established a free and independent Austria and thereby to open the way for the Austrian people themselves, as well as those neighboring States which will be face with similar problems, to find that political and economic security which is the only basis for lasting peace.

Austria is reminded, however that she has a responsibility, which she cannot evade, for participation in the war at the side of Hitlerite Germany, and that in the final settlement account will inevitably be taken of her own contribution to her liberation.



Now you imply that being there gives you credability. Well maybe but Palin was the Governer of Alaska and I think that qualifies as "being there", and she can't figure out how much Alaska contributes to the domestic suppy of energy:

Palin claims Alaska "produces nearly 20 percent of the U.S. domestic supply of energy." That's not true.

Alaska did produce 14 percent of all the oil from U.S. wells last year, but that's a far cry from all the "energy" produced in the U.S.

Alaska's share of domestic energy production was 3.5 percent, according to the official figures kept by the U.S. Energy Information Administration.

And if by "supply" Palin meant all the energy consumed in the U.S., and not just produced here, then Alaska's production accounted for only 2.4 percent.

FactCheck.org: Energetically Wrong


WAIT MAYBE SHE HAD AN AGENDA?
 
Careful guys keep it civil otherwise we risk the wrath of our admins with whose rules I am respectful of.

Dino, I never took a swipe at our President or Liberals/Democrats or Conservatives/Republicans; I would appreciate you stop the repetiive accusations that somehow aligns Right wingers with Facism or Nazism. One of the sources you used was Harvard University Press who I do not necessarily consider the bastion of unbiased thought.

I actually thought that this was something we could all agree on. Nobody wants America to turn towards a totalitarian state. And you have to admit you can see some similiarities.
 
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Where yu at...where yu at...
There he go....there he go..

Peanut butter and jelly with a baseball bat.....


Now there he go.....

Peanut butter jelly..Peanut butter jelly..Peanut butter jelly..Peanut butter jelly..Peanut butter jelly..Peanut butter jelly..Peanut butter jelly..

with a baseball bat...


Now freestyle.....

:welcome:


umanut !

I love me some PB&J!
 
Thought I would throw a Hijack distract in there !

That song when it came out...OMFG..I even had salesmen walking around the lot saying
'Wher yu at...wher yu at......'!
 
Thought I would throw a Hijack distract in there !

That song when it came out...OMFG..I even had salesmen walking around the lot saying
'Wher yu at...wher yu at......'!

Probably a good thing at this point.
 
this is funny....

political discussions, and religious discussions alwaus show how little people know and understand about things they insanely emotional about.

conservatives, and ultra-conservatives share much ideology with the NAZI party they use so often to antimidate and envoke fear.
 
History is written by the victors and sometimes the actual truth does get lost.
Nothing to do with thread..just sayin'


Met enough WWII, Holocaust survivors and living members selling Lincolns to retirees in Palm Beach. Heard enough stories and seen enough awards to know that back then each little spot on the map was just that a spot on the map. What happened 50 miles away in one town may not have been same in another. It was that small and local sometimes. There are folks who lived in Germany and Austria throughout entire war who never saw a troop or heard a round fired.
Vast areas of mountains and prairies noody cared about at the time.
No elec, no radio, no TV....NADA. Just folks living the way it used to be.
So each persons recollection could be slightly different than anothers.
 
Careful guys keep it civil otherwise we risk the wrath of our admins with whose rules I am respectful of.

Dino, I never took a swipe at our President or Liberals/Democrats or Conservatives/Republicans; I would appreciate you stop the repetiive accusations that somehow aligns Right wingers with Facism or Nazism. One of the sources you used was Harvard University Press who I do not necessarily consider the bastion of unbiased thought.

I actually thought that this was something we could all agree on. Nobody wants America to turn towards a totalitarian state. And you have to admit you can see some similiarities.

I am not swiping at anything. It is pretty well documented that Fascism and Nazism were types of radical right wing movements. Let’s not try to rewrite history because we don't like what is says. The radical movements in Central and South America in the late ‘60s and ‘70s were for the most part leftist movements, but it is not taking a swipe at anyone to point that out.

I think the point which you very graciously made clear; any social or economic system that is totalitarian is not something that we want in this country. It doesn’t matter if is it socialist, capitalist, communist or any other –ist\-ism.

Personally, I don't think it is possible with our constitution but I also believe anything is possible.
 
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