Bull$hit Military Requirments

[RamminBusa]

Politics, AMA, Two Wheel Tuesday, anyone to shed light on this growing pain in the arse...

The commanding General here at Fort Bliss has become a Motorcycle Nazi.  A few bad apples at higher levels made some really bad decisions and got killed or seriously hurt.  Being in the military we have to follow the laws and rules of the state we are in and also follow military regulations.  I understand that, but....

This is getting to be straight up harassment.  This morning they decided to stop all motorcycles and check for a local issued Safety card.  As it stands now we have to be licensed , insured, attend a Motorcycle Safety Class, and now a re-certification course that the Army runs.  Here is the kicker, if we have everything but the Fort Bliss card they will not let you on post.  Then they stated now they will impound the bikes unless the owner shows up with this card.  There are 1100 bikes registered and the classes were held last week but could only support about 400 of the riders.  Now they want to impound the bikes of those not re-certified by the Army...  The next classes will be scheduled in the future (no dates yet).

Yes this is the bullcrap we deal with to ensure the rights of all in the United States....They pull our rights.

We have a group of riders and are looking at starting a congressional inquiry into this Commanding Generals policies and intent.  Yes we have no choice because again we are soldiers and have to external to clear the road.  I appologize to those who pay taxes and foot the bill for this ahead of time.

Just upset at a system letting fellow soldiers, families, and me down.  I guess the 13 years I have in already will make me stay but if this was another job I could leave, I would ride into the sunset...



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[Mr Brown]

Rent a vacant lot close to the post, hire a friend's kid that's out of school for the summer, rent a van and operate a shuttle service with secure bike parking. (For a small fee, of course!)



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[RamminBusa]

Had a couple minutes to cool off...

BTW mine is not one of the bikes, I took the course the first day.

The events that led up to this were:

A SGM driving drunk, going the wrong way on the street, no protective gear hit another drunk driver (go figure) and was killed.

A SGM who was affraid to drive her bike because it was to powerfull (sportster 1200) finally got her learners permit and attended the basic riders course. She then decided not to go get her license finallized but took her bike to the local shop. Picked the bike up after a service, went to pull out gave it too much gas, paniced and proceeded to crash into an overpass breaking both her wrist's.

As a result we are the target of straight up harassment.

Punish the ones doing the right thing, and forget the rest..

 

[RamminBusa]

Mr Brown,

As much as I like your answer it would not be possible except for the civilians on post. Being a green suiter I am subject to the laws and rules all the time on and off post.

We have to wear full finger gloves, helmet, pants, over the ankle boots, goggles or shield, orange reflective vest, and orange reflective vest over our backpacks when we ride.

We do not get issued these items, we pay for them ourselves. If involved in an accident (our fault or not), they investigate and check if we had these items. If not we get punished under the Uniform Code of Military Justice. If killed and we did not have this, no matter what rank we are subject to loosing all benefits for our families.

 

[him]

Well bro sorry to tell you but when you raise that hand you give up some privilages...like the right to curse out the rude beotch thats serving you your food...but anyway. As the base commander he can make any policy he wants and you have to there by follow it while on that base for instance. here at scott i can get on with just my jacket and gear but when i went to camp lejune i had to have a reflective vest on too. see each place is different. As for the impounding is that if you drive it on base or if your caught driving on base? casue here you cant get on base with out the saftey card insurance and license anyway

I dont think they are allowed to impound your vehicle but again its a military base and if thats the base commanders policy so be it. but one thing about the picket line type deal your setting up....you dont want to burn any bridges if you know what i mean

. Good luck

 

[thrasherfox]

Yeah, sounds like some unfair personal issues being passed down.

Most of it ya just got to bite your tongue, say this is a bunch of shid and move on.

But the issue about not having enough space in a safety class and still wanting to impound bikes, ok that is beyond reason.

If they don't have the ability to provide the required training. that is not anyone's fault but their own.

They should give waivers to those that are waiting for classes

Same thing with the Navy, except our situation was a little reversed.

The Navy has a regulation stating that you MUST wear an orange (or bright colored) safety vest.

They have made it that you have to ride it even off base. If you get into an accident off base and are not wearing your bright colored safety vest, the Navy has stated it either will not, or MIGHT not cover your medical expenses.

Our base commander (since we are out in the middle of fricken no where and considered a "remote" location. Changed the local rules for the base and made it so you ONLY had to wear bright colored reflective vests at night on base. During the day there was no requirement.

Someone from higher up outside of the base found out and made the base CO enforce wearing of vests 24/7 again.

Yeah that is another fricken issue. Most civilians who whine about the military have no idea that when you join you sign away your rights.

Each individual in the military has done more than joined to protect our country, they have done so and signed papers giving up all of their rights.

I am not even in the military, but because of what I do and I work for the government, I cannot even go out of country with out telling someone first and explaining WHY I am going.

This includes Mexico and Canada. If I am in San Diego and decide to take a little jaunt across the border, I have to fricken call someone first to let them know.

This is one issue that come to think of it has never been brought up on this board, the amount of rights that people give up when they serve to protect the rights of everyone else.

But anyway, back on track. Yeah, I would follow proper procedures. Maybe even contact your congressman (that is within your rights.. pisses people off but you are allowed to do it).

I would start with the chain of command, work your way up and if you hit a road block. Congressman time.



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[RamminBusa]

I understand Him,

I had to vent but the way they are handling this because of the couple accidents involving these SGM's. I am a SFC and understand the rules but this is getting way out of line. I would be willing to bet that if they were E6 or below this would not take place. There would be a couple E7's getting chewed out and maybe a commander or two but not this mass punishment. Who do you hold accountable for doing the stupid thing when its a SGM?? Answer: everyone

Like I satated before I had to vent a little, and come to grips with the fact the free only stay free by us giving our rights up. Its for my son and future generations of the clan...

 

[RamminBusa]

thanks thrasherfox

I follow what you say. I talked to the chain but since I am doing the right things....it stops as a non issue. Have to love it, do the right thing and lose the right to point out how unfair something is. I bet if they got 46mpg right now they would be riding and this again would be a mute point.

They blame the war for the number of bike rising (due to the soldiers coming back with combat pay). I point out that:

1. Its summer (duh)
2. The gas prices are driving people to get bikes
3. It our right (just stay within your limits)

 

[Mr Brown]

That is clan with a "C", right?

 

[Charlesbusa]

That's crap that they will impound bikes because they don't have the facilities to get all bikes re certified.

But it doesn't surprise me. Its the military.

I remember, when I was stationed in Italy, rooming with four guys in a room no bigger than 400sqft. I know Navy and such have it tight in ships/subs. But we're talking about an Army base with tons of land and married folk of same rank on the same base get a house. We took it up the chain of command, all the way to Commander for Europe(can't remember the acronym its been a while) and eventually they built more single soldier housing. But it wasn't easy and it took a while.

Sorry dude, but it will probably be a while before it gets any better...

 

[him]

Yeah thrash i heard about the benefit shid here and dont really like it. What gets me is i can wear a sweater and reflective vest and get on base but if i have a fuggin leather suit i get all types of shid. Also those people you piss off know the people you work for or will work for in the future..not saying this happens but that may lead you to miss out on opportunties or jobs you wanted. From what im told (only been in a year) the last thing you want to do is embarass your boss/Commander. Welcome to the military

 

[RamminBusa]

Mr Brown,

Not sure how to respond to the question but I can assure you it is my family that I am refering to. Nothing more.

The other refference for the clan would be a whole different issue that I would have to stay clear of. I dont feel they have the right to do the things they do since most is against the law...

 

[Pop]

.  This morning they decided to stop all motorcycles and check for a local issued Safety card.  As it stands now we have to be licensed , insured, attend a Motorcycle Safety Class.

USAF Requirement also

 

[FAKK2]

...



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[RamminBusa]

The local safety re-certification was a direct result of two motorcycle accidents where the operator was wrong in what they did (lack of training or other). But how many car accidents happened this last weekend? Why is a car driver not treated to the same special training? When it comes to safety inspections for holidays we have to get our vehicle inspected. When you drive only a car you only bring one in even if you own three. Now you can bring your car in but you also have to bring your bike in even if you are not riding it that day. Unfair, singled out...

BTW we do have annual safety inspections as per the state

 

[Mr Brown]

Mr Brown,

Not sure how to respond to the question but I can assure you it is my family that I am refering to.  Nothing more.

The other refference for the clan would be a whole different issue that I would have to stay clear of.  I dont feel they have the right to do the things they do since most is against the law...

I was kidding, sorry if that wasn't clear. Thankyou for giving up your rights to protect me and my familly's, we appreciate it.

 

[tedbiele]

HOOAH!!!!!!!!!!!
AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I'M HOME BROTHER!!!

Yes - you fight for everyone else's rights! Gotta love it!

 

[gabusa]

Bro,

I'm here in Hawaii and we have the same rules. While we were deployed in Afghanistan and Iraq the rules were made for here. We have to have all the cards and then you have to do an eval on the bike that you own. If you fail the eval you have to go to a one day experienced rider course. So I feel your pain.

 

[RamminBusa]

They had us go through the basic course and the Army funded this.  I asked to attend the advanced course and was told I could do it but the Army would not fund it.  The basic course was $130 for 2 days (workdays).  The advanced course was $60 and one day on the weekend.  I looked at it from the tax payer point of view and decided it was better for the advanced course because it was cheaper.  It would also ensure people would have been riding a bike since you have to bring your bike.  Fort Bliss said this is not the case so they paid for the basic course.  Now if a soldier wants to get a bike and has not got a license he/she has got it made.  The Army will pay for you to get trained, the state recognizes the diploma and waives the riding test requirement, take a written test and bam you have a valid license and an MDDC card.

Save money, offer the advanced course.  This would also ensure you do not have un-experienced riders getting over on the system.  Hell the course is a state reruirment anyway, make the rider pay for it.



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[vincent]

The Marine Corps has to do all the same stuff. Now they are getting to the point where if I am seen at a drag stip I have to report to my CO's office since this is a high risk factor activity and therefore not allowed. I may spectate, nothing more. I have heard instances of officers in this area being told that them might want to review their choice of transportation (not in those words, I don't remember the whole convo). If caught out in town without any of the required so called safety gear, our medical does not get paid, and SGLI can be revoked. Although during daylight hours if our outer jacket is brightly colored we dont have to wear the day-glo orange or international green safety vest.

Remember, it is a CO's perogative to go above and beyond the order, they just can't take away from it. If you can get riders together and bring it up in a tactful and professional manner, you may or may not be able to do something about it. If not, request orders elsewhere or just wait your time. Its not like your going to be stationed at the one base for the entirety of your career.