Fuel Economy on my new truck

[RamminBusa]

2005 Hemi Quadcab Daytona...

Volant Cold Air Intake
Jet Stream Scoop
1100 miles on her

Set the cruise on the highway and gets 23.2 - 24.5 MPG

My old 2003 Ram Hemi 4x4, same stretch with Flowmaster Exhaust and K&N drop in 14 - 15.9 MPG

Thought mine was about the only one but I have 3 co-workers with the same trucks (no mods) and they still get 18-21 highway.  

The only one that is less is the girl with the 17" rims, she is barely getting 18 highway and 12-13 in town.

I get about 15.5-16 in town

Post up or PM me any links or further information you have on the cold air intake and whatever the Jet Stream Scoop thing is, I'd be interested in anything to help boost both the  mileage and the performance.

I've got the same Ram daytona you have and I'm not getting anyting near that kind of mileage.

Volant CAI

Jet Stream

I was just as amazed at the difference in the two years (03 vs 05) but I really believe the big difference is the 4x2 vs. the 4x4 and the 20" wheels vs. the 17"

The exhaust was different because of the Borla but also my 03 had one large Cat, the 05's have two small Cats coming off the headers.

 

[RamminBusa]

- keep tire pressure at or 4 above vehicle rating
- lower weight oil in engine
- loose weight [you and junk in vehicle like that SILLY spare tire   ]
- put a wing on the back... okay, maybe not  

- trade it in for a Yugo Truck [see pic]

don't fret gas prices.  you're gonna pay it anyway.  like most of us, you probably spend more on coffee in a week than you do the increase in gas price

I like my wing....

 

[RamminBusa]

wing

 

[thrasherfox]

Well update on MPG

I did not have a chance to put the new drop in filter in. however, with just the new Flow Master exhaust here is what I got coming into work today


1) First route which is a 70mph route. I was getting roughly 19.2 mpg which is up almost 2mpg from yesterday, actually closer to 1.5 mpg better

2) Second route off the 70mph route is a 55mph road for about 7 miles, cruise control set at 55 I was getting between 23 and 24 mpg

Keep in mind I have the hard top covering my back area which I have heard that helps allot with gas mileage (prevents the tailgate from acting like a speed brake

)

Next week I will have the drop in Air Hog filter and I will report on the MPG’s with that in.

 

[Projekt]

its a Hemi you're never gonna get good fuel mileage

  As far as trying to get more fuel mileage out of it  If they make underpulleys' that will really help,  My 91 GT Mustang went from getting 21-22 on the hwy to getting 26-28 and thats at 80 mph.  congrats on the truck Thrash

Underdriven pulleys can be beneficial as they drive the accessories slower than stock. However, one concern is where you do your driving. If it is mostly highway then great, go for it since most of your time driving will be at a rotational speed adequate to spin your accessories within a desireable operating range.
If you do mostly city driving, you may run into charging problems specially when you run the lights, stereo and A/C at the same time in stop an go traffic. The alternator may not spin at a speed adequate for the charging system to be replenished.

 

[RamminBusa]

thrasher,

Volant for sale on ebay:

<a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Volant-Cool-Air-Intake-Kit-03-05-Dodge-Ram-5-7-Hemi_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ38634QQitem
Z7982269885QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V" target="_blank">Volant CAI</a>

I ordered a low profile cover for the tailgate last night painted to match the truck

 

[WWJD]

oops! No offense meant on the wing... I was picturing an overly large wooden one like those Ricer jokers do for fun

 

[thrasherfox]

thrasher,

Volant for sale on ebay:

<a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Volant-Cool-Air-Intake-Kit-03-05-Dodge-Ram-5-7-Hemi_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ38634QQitem

Z7982269885QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V" target="_blank">Volant CAI</a>

I ordered a low profile cover for the tailgate last night painted to match the truck

Just tried to look at it and Ebay removed it.

Thanks for looking..

 

[mzrsq]

thrasher,

Volant for sale on ebay:

<a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Volant-Cool-Air-Intake-Kit-03-05-Dodge-Ram-5-7-Hemi_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ38634QQitem

Z7982269885QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V" target="_blank">Volant CAI</a>

I ordered a low profile cover for the tailgate last night painted to match the truck

OK, Now who's making a tonnue that will work with the wing on?

And painted to match at that.

Thanks for the cold air info!

 

[Charlesbusa]

Nice truck Ron!!!

Its not quite as big as Rich's though

 

[Wag]

More gas + more air flow = more POWER and greater EFFICIENCY, therefore, lower fuel usage. Bear in mind, however, that you may not see much of a difference in town. You WILL, however, see a notable difference on the freeways. Also, like sully said, if you reduce the load, you'll get better mileage and more POWER.

Also, do the calculation you need to figure out how many bux you're going to save for ever mpg of improvement you make. Take the guesswork out of it and improve your satisfaction rating!

--Wag--

 

[TheAtomicAss]

The concept of more air in equals more fuel used, i.e, less fuel economy only applies to forced induction such as exhaust driven surperchargers (turbo-chargers), and belt-driven superchargers. This is because they stick more air (and therefore the commeasurate amount of fuel) into the cylinders than they are able to draw in through conventional atmospheric induction.
Removing air restrictions only allows the internal combustion engine (air pump) to spin (fill with air) more easily and therefore lose less fuel energy in the act of spinning (filling the cylinders with air). Thus leading to more power reaching the drivetrain. The engine management system DOES NOT add more fuel just because it senses the air coming in easier, instead it simply maintains the factory set air:fuel ratio. That is it.

Now I must admit, I am ill-informed as to exactly how a turbo or super-charged engine is managed, in terms of feeding the engine the extra pressure. Not being sarcastic, I really don't know.

But take the throttle-body off your car/truck/busa and tell me what happens. I'll bet my next paycheck that the engine will rev sky high until it smacks the rev limiter, or, runs so lean as to stumble. An engine that is running wants to rev itself into oblivion. Open the throttle, and it does so. Close the throttle, and it chokes, and slows down.

And tell my Pontiac not to dump more fuel into the engine to compensate for a perceived increase in air. I'd really like to get 20+ out of this shitty 4-banger.

The PCM can and does adjust the fuel going into the engine if it thinks the engine is going lean or rich. Within limits, of course, slap a super-charger on it and it will go outside it's inbuilt limits.

I do agree on the exhaust, however.

 

[grabntwist]

Man, very involved and lenghty repiles. TF, not to sound a bit on the harsh side but you did buy a Hemi Ram? Right. It's a great truck and I bet you got it at a good price considering the fuel costs. Enjoy it.. Please don't go moddin' it to save fuel, you'll only spend money and chase your tail to find miniscule gains. I thought the newer Hemi's run half the cylinders under low loads. They shouldn't be to bad on fuel.

 

[Projekt]

Man, very involved and lenghty repiles. TF, not to sound a bit on the harsh side but you did buy a Hemi Ram? Right. It's a great truck and I bet you got it at a good price considering the fuel costs. Enjoy it.. Please don't go moddin' it to save fuel, you'll only spend money and chase your tail to find miniscule gains. I thought the newer Hemi's run half the cylinders under low loads. They shouldn't be to bad on fuel.

That is a good way to look at it. Use the KISS concept. Keep It Simple Stupid.
Grab n Twist is right. You will probably spend more money than the efficiency gains will net in savings within a reasonable amount of time. This really depends on your driving characteristics and concentration such as open road versus city.
As I said before, stick to the intake and exhaust mods. If you are still dissatisfied, try the custom tuned chip/ computer.

 

[Projekt]

The concept of more air in equals more fuel used, i.e, less fuel economy only applies to forced induction such as exhaust driven surperchargers (turbo-chargers), and belt-driven superchargers. This is because they stick more air (and therefore the commeasurate amount of fuel) into the cylinders than they are able to draw in through conventional atmospheric induction.
Removing air restrictions only allows the internal combustion engine (air pump) to spin (fill with air) more easily and therefore lose less fuel energy in the act of spinning (filling the cylinders with air). Thus leading to more power reaching the drivetrain. The engine management system DOES NOT add more fuel just because it senses the air coming in easier, instead it simply maintains the factory set air:fuel ratio. That is it.

Now I must admit, I am ill-informed as to exactly how a turbo or super-charged engine is managed, in terms of feeding the engine the extra pressure.  Not being sarcastic, I really don't know.

But take the throttle-body off your car/truck/busa and tell me what happens.  I'll bet my next paycheck that the engine will rev sky high until it smacks the rev limiter, or, runs so lean as to stumble.  An engine that is running wants to rev itself into oblivion.  Open the throttle, and it does so.  Close the throttle, and it chokes, and slows down.

And tell my Pontiac not to dump more fuel into the engine to compensate for a perceived increase in air.  I'd really like to get 20+ out of this shitty 4-banger.  

  The PCM can and does adjust the fuel going into the engine if it thinks the engine is going lean or rich.  Within limits, of course, slap a super-charger on it and it will go outside it's inbuilt limits.

I do agree on the exhaust, however.

You are right about the throttle body's role in controlling engine RPM.
Correct: The removal of an air limiting device (Throttle Body) will result in the engine spinning to maximum operational RPM. This may be limited further by the fuel system's operational limit. In other words how much gas the fuel pump can push through the system. Taking it a step further in modern engines, you would reach one of the RPM limiters such as a timing retard, ignition cut-off, and or fuel cut-off process.
If you don't hit an Electronic RPM limiter of some sort you would then be at the mercy of the internal engine components that are designed for maximum material efficiency and not strength in mind. Thus the need to control RPMs to a range tolerable by the design and inherent strength of the rotating assembly and or valvetrain. Float the valves, break a spring or gear and piston to valve contact resulting in bent valves and a sudden stop.

Supercharging has been around for a very long time and I believe it was first used in High Performance (internal combustion) Aircraft during the second world war.

Take a 5.7 liter engine. It pumps 5700 cubic centimeters (cc's) of air in one revolution. That means that if it sucks in air normally it will try to suck in 5700cc's per revolution. Since air pressure at sea level is 14.7 Psi you get that amount of air charge per pumping cycle. So you have 5700 cc's of air charge that must maintain an A/F ratio of around 11:1 to be safe and cool.
Then stick on a turbocharger that is set to deliver 14.7psi of boost. Boost is the increase in air pressure over atmospheric pressure (14.7 + PSI). If you expect to deliver an extra atmosphere by pumping in 14.7 PSI Boost, you have effectively doubled the air charge entering the cylinders. That means you will theoretically push in 11,400cc's of air charge at 11:1 A/F ratio. This results in double the fuel requirement for the given boosted condition to keep the engine alive and cool. This is why supercharged engines use more fuel and produce more power. It is like increasing the capacity of the engine without increasing the dimensions and proportionately adding mass to contain and gather all of that air.
I hope this explanation is clear enough.

 

[RamminBusa]

thrasher,

Volant for sale on ebay:

<a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Volant-Cool-Air-Intake-Kit-03-05-Dodge-Ram-5-7-Hemi_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ38634QQitem



Z7982269885QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V" target="_blank">Volant CAI</a>

I ordered a low profile cover for the tailgate last night painted to match the truck

OK, Now who's making a tonnue that will work with the wing on?

      And painted to match at that.

Thanks for the cold air info!

Sent PM, talk to Jesse if you call them

cover



<!--EDIT|RamminBusa
Reason for Edit: None given...|1126330158 -->

 

[TheAtomicAss]

I hope this explanation is clear enough.

The what of supercharging I understood, it's how the TB controls it that still confuses me.

(Oh, and if I'm not mistaken, a 4 cycle 5.7L would displace 2,850 CC's of air every revolution. A 2 cycle would displace 5,700.

)

Man what I wouldn't give to see a 2 cycle version of the Viper V10.

<!--EDIT|TheAtomicAss
Reason for Edit: None given...|1126335907 -->

 

[Toyz]

Very nice truck...it's a hemi...if you are worried about fuel economy trade it in on an economy car...other wise drive it like you stole it and enjoy the gas stations.

 

[Projekt]

I hope this explanation is clear enough.

The what of supercharging I understood, it's how the TB controls it that still confuses me.  

(Oh, and if I'm not mistaken, a 4 cycle 5.7L would displace 2,850 CC's of air every revolution.  A 2 cycle would displace 5,700.  

)

Man what I wouldn't give to see a 2 cycle version of the Viper V10.  

Sorry a 5.7 liter engine is a 5.7 liter displacing engine period.

A four cycle 5.7l engine with 9:1 compression works on the following principles.
Intake - Compression - Combustion - Exhaust.
1. Downward motion of one (of eight) piston inside a cylinder with an open valve results in 1/8 of 5700cc's being drawn into the void created by that action. One eighth of 5700 equals 712.5 cc's.
2. Upward motion of one piston in a cylinder with a closed valve results in compression of the air fuel mixture to 1/9 the volume of air drawn into the cylinder. Thus 712.5/9=79.16cc. This results in the mixture being heated to support rapid combustion.
3. A spark is lit just before the piston reaches TDC (Top Dead Center). This lights the mixture and sets off the chemical reaction between the Hydrogen and Oxygen Molecules found in the air fuel mixture. Combustion propels the piston downwards in a cylinder with close valves.
4. The piston rises in the cylinder with an open exhaust valve/s and expels the spent air charge.

A two cycle engine accomplishes the above functions through a different design.
The valves in a 4 stroke are replaced with intake and exhaust ports in a 2 stroke found in the cylinder walls. The ports are arranged so as to allow the cylinders to intake and exhaust in a manner to support combustion.

 

[thrasherfox]

Ok, just so everyone understands.

I understand the Hemi is going to suck gas. If I were THAT concerned about fuel economy I would not have purchased the truck.

With that said, I have spent the last month looking at trucks, going on line to consumer reports, talking to people, going to each of the main company's web sites looking at ALL the trucks in the class I wanted.

My primary requirements were

1) New vehicle 2003 or newer (even brand new)

2) Less than 20,000 miles on the vehicle

3) Quad cab

4) More balls that my current truck (my current truck is a 94 GMC Z71 4x4 extended cab. All black.. which I will be selling here shortly)

5) Decent size bed

6) Tow package

7) Running boards

8) Half ton or larger

Those were my primary criteria, fuel economy did not really play much into the decision making process.

I test drive Toyata Tundras, brand new chevy Z71's, a chevy 2500HD with a turbo diesel with an 8 foot bed and had a fifth wheel setup.

After doing all my research and test driving, it boiled down to the Chevy Z71 and the Dodge Ram Hemi.

The Chevy Z71 is on the Consumer reports recommended vehicle lists. It gets the best gas mileage of the trucks I was looking at. However it really did not seem to have much more power than my 94 Z71. Miy 94 has the 5.7 350 with 190,000 miles on it and the brand new Z71's have a 5.2 which is equivalent to a 327 motor (that is what I was told anyone?

And I just did not like the view I had over the hood as much as the Dodge.

So the Dodge won out because it pretty much had everything I needed and wanted, 4x4, power, looks, etc.
Even though it was the exact truck I wanted, I do want to optimize fuel economy the best I can. This truck is more of a toy for me, primarily for weekend stuff (towing my boat, taking quads out etc) and with the price of gas and the looks that it is going to get worse, I figure if I can optimize my fuel economy it will just hurt a little less at the pump.

And when I go on trips for business, the better fuel economy I get the longer I can go on one tank of gas.

So I know I bought a gas sucking machine and accepted that from the beginning.. just want to make the best out of it that I can….

My daily commuters are my camaro or my Busa

Thanks for all the input people, I think this thread not only helped me out but maybe gave some other members food for thought and some ideas...

Great thread. anyone else have any good ideas please keep posting them. And I will continue to post my results from time to time