Lane splitting

[johnstein]

id rather have the bike in front of me gives me more visability in front and atleast i know a dink isnt goin to ram the bike in the rear ! cause i got his back !
so if i see bikes comming up in the rear view i will give them room to get buy and a place to catch thier breath in front of me , if they choose to ? always try to make some kinda contact with them weather a wave or a nod always good to have a fellow rider around ! even if hes playin defense in a cage !

 

[JustBusa]

I would never do it, very unsafe. I have a couple guys every week that do it to me when I am in my car or dually, if I am in the car I just try to get them to pull over so we can 'talk', but if I am in the dually I move them into their own lane as they pass. I am a very defensive driver, very conscientous (wow I think I got that right) and like I have mentioned before, 24 years of volunteer Rescue/EMS makes me think twice about doing stupid #### like that.
When you guys do that crap, you should go help out the local fire department and EMS, see what is actually involved in tc's.

WTF, FIRST OFF YOU ARE ON A MOTORCYCLE WEBSITE SAYING THIS.  WE MUST BE MISUNDERSTANDING YOU, BECAUSE YOU ALMOST SOUND LIKE THE GUY WHO WAS RUNNING BIKERS OF THE ROAD.  Second, I've never passed a biker(s) who was lane spilting while in my cage. When I lane spilt I know when I can and can't do it safely. I mean if a ? pops in my head i just hang back till I'm sure.  Third, I think your confused with what defensive driving is. By saying you intentionally block or "move them over" is being aggressive yourself . Defensive driving means to identify and allow  potental harzards the safest means possible to be resolved.. In this case getting the F@#$ over and allowing the hazard to pass would be the correct choice.  Now a LEO has the proper equipment and stature to notify and correct the biker i.e. light and sirens and citations or warnings. That has the least amount of chance to cause an accident. Somebody cutting people off and yelling "HEY PULL OVER" is more likely to distract the biker and cause an accident.  Again I hope this is a BIG misunderstanding and remember help your fellow rider.      

 

[JustBusa]

I would never do it, very unsafe. I have a couple guys every week that do it to me when I am in my car or dually, if I am in the car I just try to get them to pull over so we can 'talk', but if I am in the dually I move them into their own lane as they pass. I am a very defensive driver, very conscientous (wow I think I got that right) and like I have mentioned before, 24 years of volunteer Rescue/EMS makes me think twice about doing stupid #### like that.
When you guys do that crap, you should go help out the local fire department and EMS, see what is actually involved in tc's.

Oh... and to add in referance to your comment about working with EMT's to see "what is really going on"

I have never heard of someone getting into an accident from lane splitting..


while I am confidant it does happen.. I have never seen it or heard of it..

Most of the motorcycle accidents I am aware of (seen and or heard about) is by people pushing themselves past their limits and smacking a wall or doing some stupid stunt OR some stupid a$$ cager being a jerk and running them over or into them. sometimes on purpose, sometimes because they dont see the bike...

Worse I have ever heard of happening when a bike was splitting lanes is hitting a mirror, which was a direct result of the a$$hole driver trying to push the bike into their own lane. if the car would have stayed put there would not have been a problem..

Which is why a nice hammer fixt DOWNWARD on someones mirror works well.. mirrors are made to bend forward and back. they snap realy well with a downward force

i knew it was a misunderstanding.



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[Rogue_Biker]

I would never do it, very unsafe. I have a couple guys every week that do it to me when I am in my car or dually, if I am in the car I just try to get them to pull over so we can 'talk', but if I am in the dually I move them into their own lane as they pass. I am a very defensive driver, very conscientous (wow I think I got that right) and like I have mentioned before, 24 years of volunteer Rescue/EMS makes me think twice about doing stupid #### like that.
When you guys do that crap, you should go help out the local fire department and EMS, see what is actually involved in tc's.

I just had to respond to this post.

WTF!!!!

I've lived in CA all my life and lane splitting has been done ever since. I've also been riding over 15 years and well over 100k miles. Not once have I ever seen a lane splitting accident, nor heard of it. Not once have I ever had anyone open a door, try to run me off the road, try to pull me over for a "talk", whatever. In fact, the drivers in CA EXPECT you to lane split so most of them just stay in their lanes or even give you some room. BTW, I used to ride all over Los Angeles, which has the worst traffic and most hot headed drivers.

It is NOT the motorcyclist that is the danger. It is drivers with YOUR attitude that is the danger.

Did you know lane splitting is allowed EVERYWHERE except north America (CA being the exception)? It is allowed because it is efficient and not inherently unsafe as long as the drivers don't cop a freakin' attitude AND they are aware that it is legal.

Sorry but, your attitude about lane splitting and how you handle it is VERY NASTY to say the least.

 

[Ken02busa]

I would never do it, very unsafe. I have a couple guys every week that do it to me when I am in my car or dually, if I am in the car I just try to get them to pull over so we can 'talk', but if I am in the dually I move them into their own lane as they pass. I am a very defensive driver, very conscientous (wow I think I got that right) and like I have mentioned before, 24 years of volunteer Rescue/EMS makes me think twice about doing stupid #### like that.
When you guys do that crap, you should go help out the local fire department and EMS, see what is actually involved in tc's.

Seriously, you work as a rescue/EMS and you actually admit to trying to "move" bikes into their own lane... or getting them to pull over to "talk".....

? WTF??? and you ride too???

AGAIN- NEVER A BIKE. NO ONE HERE IS DUMB ENOUGH TO DO THAT. Our roads are too bad.

It's morons in trucks and semis that try to run you off the road.

where the hell does it say I run bikes off? I forgot to say cars/trucks/semis/ etc. but does not say bikes anywhere in my original post.

 

[motioncobra]

Lane split every single time I ride. It is safer. Ask any LEO here. I often follow motorcycle LEO through traffic or they will follow me. I would move over though when they are the one following me to which end they would usually speed up. Thank goodness I live in southern CA. where most driver are biker friendly and often move over to let us pass. I lived and rode in Japan for nearly 10 years where they are also very  motorcycle friendly (but also scooter and bike(cycle) friendly).
Touchy subject for some. Any Hawaaiian riders here? I just returned from there where I rented a Harley motorcycle for a day. Niiicce, you know, the weather I mean. They actually asked me if I wanted a helmet. (No helmet law there) Hell yehh I said. Well I lane splitted like I was in CA. Duhh. Didn't know if it was legal there or not. Anyhow made it back to CA. without a ticket.



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[TIMMYDUCK]

Lane splitting in Vt never need to happen, not that many cars ever.
Not many traffic control signals either unless you are in Burlington.
And we can pass anywhere, anytime legally.
There is no line law in VT.

 

[chrisjp]

uhh...truthfully people have moved over while i am driveing and i am like...uhh dude what are you doing...now i understand its not so much a "hey you are following me too close so ill move over just so you are not on my butt" but a statement of hey ill help you out i know you are rideing faster than me and with no passing lanes in the area ill move over and let you ride free"...(not many 4 lanes around here) but when i lived in daytona..if there was alot of traffic ...yes i would (while traffic is stopped) split the lane and move to the front...in my mind that was what "lane splitting" ment

 

[AlbanianEagle]

Definitly illegal in New York. I was splitting lanes on the Northern State Parkway because of an accident that happened about 3 exits up ahead. I was with two of my friends at the time and when we came close to the accident we merged back. Well the officer saw us splitting lanes and came over to us and told us to turn off our bikes and give him the keys. So we pulled over to the shoulder and did as he said. One of my friends works for a guy who does all the paint work for the local State troopers and started giving names and so on. As this is happening another guy on a cruiser is splitting lanes and the officer sees him and tells him to pull over. So the officer goes back and speaks to the person my friend knows and comes back and asks for our licenses. He tells me to follow him and then tells me that he is going to let us go and bust my friends balls. So we go back and he just goes off on him. At this point I almost piss myself because my friends face looked like he was going to #### himself. At this point the officer said I'm only breaking your balls because your friend(the other officer) told me to. So we left and he also let the other guy go as well. But as we were splitting lanes I did get a few looks that were nasty and a few who had no clue we were beside them until we pulled ahead.

 

[WuzzaCBXRider]

"ok, if I split a lane doing 140, that is stupid.. but yeah. I am stupid sometimes... but other than that, California law states you can split lanes, share a lane with a car as long as you are not exceeding 5 miles an hour faster than the vehicle you are splitting lanes with."

Come on thrasher, I'm pretty sure the vehicle code says nothing of the sort. Its not so much legal as not, illegal. The CHP is pretty much the only agency that 'allows' it or regulates lane (sharing) and its really up to their discretion. Regulation of lane sharing will usually get the rider's signature for unsafe lane change or riding too fast for conditions present, or out and out reckless driving, an arrestable offense, just depending. The others are infractions and not arrestable offenses. And Ken, causing someone, car, bike or dually to move into another lane can be construed as an assault with a deadly weapon.

I also had the impression that Ken's reply included motorcycles but I wasn't sure he knew the definition of lane sharing between a m/c and a car (that California drivers know) that was being discussed in the thread. Part of his response just might be related to your post which was just above his in which you profess to lane split at 140 mph.

 

[thrasherfox]

QUOTING THRASHERFOX
Well lets see.. You comment  


"I would never do it, very unsafe. I have a couple guys every week that do it to me when I am in my car or dually"

Leads me to believe you are referring to motorcycles trying to split lanes while you are in a cage
-WELL YOU ARE WRONG, THEN JUMP TO CONCLUSIONS!

And then your comment

"if I am in the car I just try to get them to pull over so we can 'talk', "  

Makes it sound as though you take it personally on yourself to chastise someone on a motorcycle that tries to split lanes
-HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MOTORCYCLES, ITS GUYS TRYING TO KILL ME BY RUNNING ME OFF THE ROAD. YOU JUMPED TO THE WRONG CONCLUSION (2)

And then you proceed with

"but if I am in the dually I move them into their own lane as they pass."

Makes it sound like you use your vehicle as a weapon.. there is NO DOUBT about this one.. if you utilize your vehicle in such a manner regardless if it is towards a motorcycle or another cage, what you stated is without a doubt using your vehicle in a manner that is dangerous and aggressive. I know enough about the law and have enough friends that work for law enforcement to know if you pulled that stuff here and an officer saw you, you would be in lots of trouble.. I believe that is a felony
-YOU MAY BE RIGHT ABOUT A FELONY WHERE YOU ARE FROM, I AM NOT AWARE OF YOUR LAWS. HERE, WHEN SOMEONE TRIES TO RUN YOU OFF THE ROAD, HANCEFORTH ATTEMPT TO KILL YOU, WITH ***A SEMI*** I TEND TO LET THEM KNOW I WILL NOT BULLIED OFF THE ROAD. I STAY IN MY OWN LANE.
And then you state


"twice about doing stupid #### like that.
When you guys do that crap, you should go help out the local fire department and EMS, see what is actually involved in tc's."

Well you are basically calling all of us who split lanes stupid.. well at least in California, the state has declared it as a legal vehicle maneuver, so I don't get why you would call us stupid when it is totally legal?
-AGAIN, NOT BIKES. TRUCKS AND SEMIS!

ok, if I split a lane doing 140, that is stupid.. but yeah. I am stupid sometimes... but other than that, California law states you can split lanes, share a lane with a car as long as you are not exceeding 5 miles an hour faster than the vehicle you are splitting lanes with.

Which most people who split lanes DO follow that rule because it is safe and curtous that way

So to most of us, your comments came off as you would use your vehicle to force a motorcycle into its own lane, and further more you called us California people stupid for doing something totally legal..
-THERE WAS NEVER ANY MENTION OF TRYING TO RUN A BIKE OFF THE ROAD. Sharing a lane is very illegal in Canada.

And you wonder where the hostility came from?
- YOU SHOULD ASK ME BEFORE YOU JUDGE ME.
Was I able to make it clear enough for you?
- You made your point with blazing clarity. You jumped to the wrong conclusions, and apparently my asking for a thread cleanup has been met with an astounding NO, so thanks for making me look like a jerk, even though it was a total misunderstanding.

lol.. wasnt just me that took it wrong.. lol..

Relax.. have a beer...

If trucks and Semis are trying to run you off the road and you are just defending yourself that is cool..

Sorry I perceived what you were saying incorrectly...

now that you have cleared everything up and you are not madmax out to kill bikers it is all good..

seriously.... everyone gets their feathers ruffled once in awhile.. heck I have been pissed off at this board in the past..

its all good.. thank you for clearing everything up

 

[cosmo]

Just a point of order:
Lane "Sharing" is legal in Kali.....Lane "splitting" is not.

The difference is subjective and covered in depth by the LEO's at BARF: Link
And SBR: Link

 

[CorrodedAlien]

...umm, Actually, it is NOT legal in CA... just tolerated... Ask a CHP if it is LEGAL. They can cite you for a couple of moving violations EZ.

"While not specifically prohibited by Motor Vehicle Code..."

I used to teach the MSF course out here and got asked that question in every class. One of the CMSP (CA MSF org) people out here was a CHP Motorcycle cop gave us the above quote. I do not remember the whole of it.

 

[Ken02busa]

If I am in the right lane, we are talking a 16 foot wide lane, yellow to white, and someone pulls into the SAME lane I am in, to pass me, more- the semi wheels are in the same lane I am in, forcing me off the road, and I hold my ground, where am I using my vehicle as a weapon? How is NOT pulling off the road a felony?
I am allowed, in a vehicle, to drive anywhere between the yellow and white line of a single lane, I can hog the white or yellow, but can not cross the threshold of the yellow (left side on a 2 lane) unless I am passing, or the white line (generally right side on right lane, left side on left lane(s)), then I am in the wrong lane or crossing the median.

If I cant make this any clearer, I will try to draw a picture and post it here so there is no further confusion. I think 2 vehicles in a single vehicle lane is very dangerous, and I will hog the left line while in the right lane WITHOUT crossing into the next lane.

 

[shortBoarder]

When you guys do that crap, you should go help out the local fire department and EMS, see what is actually involved in tc's.

try sitting in stop-start traffic on the 405 in Los Angeles as some self-important idiot on a cell phone in a 3-ton SUV rides your rear tire all the way to Sherman Oaks, then ask me why we do that "crap"

I've lane split for nearly an hour straight in southern Cal, (yep, traffic is that bad), and wouldn't have it any other way.

 

[thrasherfox]

"ok, if I split a lane doing 140, that is stupid.. but yeah. I am stupid sometimes... but other than that, California law states you can split lanes, share a lane with a car as long as you are not exceeding 5 miles an hour faster than the vehicle you are splitting lanes with."

Come on thrasher, I'm pretty sure the vehicle code says nothing of the sort.  Its not so much legal as not, illegal.  The CHP is pretty much the only agency that 'allows' it or regulates lane (sharing) and its really up to their discretion.  Regulation of lane sharing will usually get the rider's signature for unsafe lane change or riding too fast for conditions present, or out and out reckless driving, an arrestable offense, just depending.  The others are infractions and not arrestable offenses.  And Ken, causing someone, car, bike or dually to move into another lane can be construed as an assault with a deadly weapon.

I also had the impression that Ken's reply included motorcycles but I wasn't sure he knew the definition of lane sharing between a m/c and a car (that California drivers know) that was being discussed in the thread.  Part of his response just might be related to your post which was just above his in which you profess to lane split at 140 mph.

Well actually have habve numerous friends that work for CHP, local departments and the SO.. and well hate to tell you but each of them have stated 5mph passing and using caution when doing so as a rule...

So if it is not written in ink, it is at least a general rule they all follow...

So I guess I need to talk to one of my friends and see if it is in black and white and get the section number and post it?

As far as his referrance to my comment about doing 140, well him and I have been talking in PM's and it seems he did NOT intend to insinuate his actions were toward bikes, only as self defense toward other cages and Semi's

So.. uhh wrong again... na na na

 

[cosmo]

...umm, Actually, it is NOT legal in CA...  just tolerated...  Ask a CHP if it is LEGAL.  They can cite you for a couple of moving violations EZ.

"While not specifically prohibited by Motor Vehicle Code..."[/QUOTE]
Take the time to follow the links I provided before you pounce. You might learn something. Like the word subjective.



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[thrasherfox]

...umm, Actually, it is NOT legal in CA...  just tolerated...  Ask a CHP if it is LEGAL.  They can cite you for a couple of moving violations EZ.

"While not specifically prohibited by Motor Vehicle Code..."

I used to teach the MSF course out here and got asked that question in every class.  One of the CMSP (CA MSF org) people out here was a CHP Motorcycle cop gave us the above quote.  I do not remember the whole of it.

Russ you are wrong.. lane splitting is legal..

However you are correct, and I have been told this by CHP before, while that cant site a person for lane splitting, if they want to get someone they will use other means to justify the ticket that would indicate unsafe operation of the motorcycle..

 

[cosmo]

BTW: I'm doing a 150 mile ride with one tomorrow morning..and I will ask him.

 

[thrasherfox]

Just a point of order:
Lane "Sharing" is legal in Kali.....Lane "splitting" is not.

The difference is subjective and covered in depth by the LEO's at BARF: Link
And SBR: Link

Actually if you are going to get technical I would concur that the terminology of lane sharring is correct

Thanks for the links