Opinions on Ferguson MO

[GEARJAMMER]

I deliver 2 Fenton MO sometime fairly close 2 Ferguson guess its mostly died down now.
I think lot of it was non Ferguson people starting trouble.
They were talking about a African American lady that lost her bakery cake shop.
There raising $ get it back hope she gets her shop back.

 

[skydivr]

That's pretty much proof that the Ferguson department is racist. There are tons of blacks in law enforcement and plenty more who would go into it if it was a fair department. That's the oldest cop out (pun intended) ever. Like saying "my best friend is black". It's very difficult to have a fully functional family without a job. I'm not making excuses as I believe you have to play the cards you're dealt and not cry about your obstacles if you want to make it. But the fact is that the poorer you are the more exceptional you have to be to emerge from that successfully.

Arch, I have a friend of mine (mixed race, btw) who used to work recruiting for Metro Nashville Police dept. Your statement does not reflect the reality. Just like the regular population, Caucasians make up the most applicants. All have to pass a thorough background check, drug screen, etc. Dropout rates also reflect with the spread. So, if 5% of the population is black, in all likelihood, 5% of the applicants, and 5% of the dropouts are also black. To have a predominately black police department, that would require quotas and not selecting the best on their achievements. Unless you are for reverse racism, it won't happen.

 

[TallTom]

I deliver 2 Fenton MO sometime fairly close 2 Ferguson guess its mostly died down now.
I think lot of it was non Ferguson people starting trouble.
They were talking about a African American lady that lost her bakery cake shop.
There raising $ get it back hope she gets her shop back.

I saw this story. To date they had raised like $230K!

I am also glad they showed the video of the black woman putting out the flames in the Convenience store that these "savages" cam back to loot and burn down.

 

[GEARJAMMER]

That's right there is lot of good people there just few making it look bad.

 

[captain]

" A cop should never be a judge delivering a death sentence. "

So Arch are you saying that a police officer doesn't have the right to defend himself? That is exactly how your comment comes across. Do you think that the officer went out just decided after coffee he was going to kill a black kid? I believe he was called to the area on a strong arm robbery.... So, is it really being a the judge jury and executioner if you are defending yourself? the evidence says he wasn't.

All of your comments are the same to me, what the cop did... How about some accountability on the kid, do you think he was in the store? Are you refuting the physical evidence and eye witness testimony?

 

[chrisjp]

its simple...reach in a car...assault a cop, reach for his gun while he is still trapped in car....your "INTENT" is clear... it is common sense, it is logical, it is presumed, that ANY interreaction with that said individual from that point forward is LIFE OR DEATH. to say ..."he was walking away"...to do WHAT?...and to WHOM?....so WHO'S NEXT..... if you are supposed to enforce the law..(ps assaulting a officer is a felony in any state)...it then becomes your SWORN DUTY to stop that individual by any means possible because they have proven......INTENT TO HARM........and it could be ANYONE....unless you fine folks suddenly developed ability to mind read or any officer can.....the attempt to STOP....then when refused and charged....it became a SECOND time proving INTENT TO HARM....gosh...how could anyone not logically conclude that this "unarmed" man had all INTENT (armed or not) to inflict SERIOUS BODILY INJURY???....

 

[GEARJAMMER]

I got stressed on delivery to Akron Ohio on radio going thru Cincinnati protesters blocking highway.
Im trying get up there + get my 10 hours off so my electronic log book will reset+give me 11 more hours.
Turned out fairly peacefull cops got them out of interstate and just issued like jay walking tics.
I can only drive 11 hours then computer will put me in violation.
I cant punch in protesters in road it doesn't do that. hehe
I confess I was little worried after watching Ferguson on tv.

 

[smedly]

First of all , unless you are an LEO please don't say what the officer should or should not have done . As an LEO I can tell you we are not trained to "wound" or retreat . All situations are fluid and you have a millisecond to decide how to respond to a situation . I can honestly say that if I give a lawful order to an individual and their response is to cause me serious bodily harm I will respond with a level of force necessary to eliminate the threat and only reduce the level of my response when the threat is either eliminated or the situation is under control . All he had to do was obey a LAWFUL order . Also it has been stated that an "unarmed teen" was shot . That's misleading , he was an 18yr old,over 6 foot tall and in excess of 230lbs . All other people male or female over the age of 18 is considered a legal adult .Also the most violent individuals I encounter are 18-25 year olds who are driven entirely by extreme narcissism and a nihilistic view towards the world . Why is there more outrage over a common thug than the countless heroes who've given their lives to advance the agenda of cowardly politicians . And before any bleeding heart says "they chose to enlist" . Well that "innocent,young teen" chose as well . No one told him to commit strong armed robbery in the store and then assault a peace officer HE CHOSE . Why is there no outrage over the fact that his parents did a piss poor job of raising him . They did a sh---- job parenting and a bunch of idiots on a jury will give them a boatload when they file a civil suit . I wont even venture in to the realm of violence when both parties are of the same ethnic background(doesn't matter which one) . When you raise a generation where nothing is their fault and everything is owed to them this is what you get . And for all the idiots laying down in the street I say be careful what you wish for . It's easy to grab your cell phone and video what you think is wrong without knowing the complete facts or thinking "I know my rights" . I highly recommend that bleeding hearts find the most violent area in their area and do a ride along . Preferably at night on the weekend , I think your perspective of what your average "racist,murderer " peace officer encounters BY THEMSELVES might change .

 

[Lycan6]

LEO or not if someone I running away from a situation and is not armed there is no reason to shoot them. I can't even shoot at an intruder in my house if they are running away out the door. The people in Ferguson are pissed off at the seemingly at least if it had gone to trial miscarriage of justice. Not that the officer **** and killed an unarmed teenager that was according to his testimony 8-10 feet away from him when he fire the last shot, but more so at the system that allowed a biased prosecutor to present the case before the grand jury and the piss poor job that he did. So I will agree with those that say the grand jury made its decision based in the case that was presented to them. The problem is the case was poorly presented. So from a black point of view you have a white officer, a white prosecutor, a black victim and a black firsthand witness. When all the smoke clears everything the the black witness said fell upon deaf ears. It's sad that every time a person of color is killed the first thing you hear about is the criminal past or behavior when they usually have nothing to do with the reason they were killed. What he did in the store had nothing to do with him being shot. It's almost as if you are saying that it's okay to kill a black man if he has a criminal background. Now I don't condone what they are doing in a ferguson with the looting. But I also don't feel they are animals and savages as they have been called repeatedly. Blacks are just tired of the seemingly unending pattern of killing by those that are suppose to protect us and not being held accountable to it.

 

[smedly]

It's almost as if you are saying that it's okay to kill a black man if he has a criminal background.

This is the B.S. that ticks me off . I will not debate this crap over the internet . Amazing that anyone who doesn't drink the proverbial kool-aid must condone the killing of an individual . That's not what I typed but ignorant people always go looking for the race card when something isn't to their liking . Respond how you want,this apparent advocate for the killing of black men with a criminal background is done . Oh,btw I was unaware that advancing towards someone was considered running away . Also are you aware just how quickly an individual can travel 10-20 feet ? But that's okay I understand . It must be that I'm racist . After all even though you've never met me you've concluded I advocate killing one ethnic group . Hmmm . Someone might call that a racist outlook . Either way I am done . All this typing has kept me from advocating killing a certain ethnic group . According to your tunnel vision view . Have nice lives 'Busa people .

 

[Lycan6]

This is the B.S. that ticks me off . I will not debate this crap over the internet . Amazing that anyone who doesn't drink the proverbial kool-aid must condone the killing of an individual . That's not what I typed but ignorant people always go looking for the race card when something isn't to their liking . Respond how you want,this apparent advocate for the killing of black men with a criminal background is done .

I didn't mention you or anyone else. I was merely summarizing from the posts that I read. If you find you have to defend your statement then that's your problem. Not mine.

 

[chrisjp]

LEO or not if someone I running away from a situation and is not armed there is no reason to shoot them. I can't even shoot at an intruder in my house if they are running away out the door. The people in Ferguson are pissed off at the seemingly at least if it had gone to trial miscarriage of justice. Not that the officer **** and killed an unarmed teenager that was according to his testimony 8-10 feet away from him when he fire the last shot, but more so at the system that allowed a biased prosecutor to present the case before the grand jury and the piss poor job that he did. So I will agree with those that say the grand jury made its decision based in the case that was presented to them. The problem is the case was poorly presented. So from a black point of view you have a white officer, a white prosecutor, a black victim and a black firsthand witness. When all the smoke clears everything the the black witness said fell upon deaf ears. It's sad that every time a person of color is killed the first thing you hear about is the criminal past or behavior when they usually have nothing to do with the reason they were killed. What he did in the store had nothing to do with him being shot. It's almost as if you are saying that it's okay to kill a black man if he has a criminal background. Now I don't condone what they are doing in a ferguson with the looting. But I also don't feel they are animals and savages as they have been called repeatedly. Blacks are just tired of the seemingly unending pattern of killing by those that are suppose to protect us and not being held accountable to it.

here is the release of ALL documents and ALL testimony of this case...i assure you....he wasnt "running away"...he was shot after he turned around (after given lawful orders to stop and get on the ground) and CHARGED.... Documents from the Ferguson grand jury

 

[Lycan6]

here is the release of ALL documents and ALL testimony of this case...i assure you....he wasnt "running away"...he was shot after he turned around (after given lawful orders to stop and get on the ground) and CHARGED.... Documents from the Ferguson grand jury

From your own post, why was he told to stop if he wasn't running? Why was he told to turnaround if he was running away? Common sense suggests he was running away. If he wasn't running away he would have been sit beside the car correct?

 

[Lycan6]

We can all read what was present d but my point again is how was it presented and what evidence was not presented.

 

[fallenarch]

So Arch are you saying that a police officer doesn't have the right to defend himself? That is exactly how your comment comes across. Do you think that the officer went out just decided after coffee he was going to kill a black kid? I believe he was called to the area on a strong arm robbery.... So, is it really being a the judge jury and executioner if you are defending yourself? the evidence says he wasn't.

All of your comments are the same to me, what the cop did... How about some accountability on the kid, do you think he was in the store? Are you refuting the physical evidence and eye witness testimony?

Captain, that's not what I said, it's what you read into what I said. Since I can't control how you read what I say I frankly don't really care how what I wrote is taken (no offense intended, that's just the way it is). GsxrBot said to me that when I left we did not have any of these race discussions, and now that I'm back they are happening again. I would consider many of you friends and as long as we are talking about Hayabusas all is cool. But a lot (not all) of the comments that are in this forum are racist. It's sort of unfortunate that this sort of stuff has to be a part of a great site about a great motorcycle. You'll notice there is very little minority participation (posts) here (this sub-forum) and at org events. I suppose if I didn't respond to a lot of this stuff it might actually go un-noticed, but I notice it.

I am an expert on integration because it is the story of my life and my parents life for that matter. My father entered the Air Force just 2 years after it was integrated. We faced all sorts of racism and the obstacles that you have to overcome every day as an extreme minority. When I went to Virginia Tech there were only 300 blacks in a 22,000 student body. I was told we (there were 4 of us) we the first to graduate from their architecture school. Now, in the company I am currently in I am the first black associate (part owner) in the company's 100 year history. When they told me I was the first black that was able to buy into the company I knew they were full of crap and frankly, had I had a plan B ready at the time I would have left. If a company gets to this day and age without blacks it's because they don't want them. Frankly that's exactly what I have found and I actually tell young blacks to look elsewhere for work. But when they needed an architect to design their new headquarters, they asked me to do it. I can't have a position of authority or an office, but I can create the home for the corporation for the next 15-20 years? Really? I know about integration and what it takes to do it properly.

You aren't going to get good blacks to be a part of oppressing their own people. If they join the force they would not be welcome in their own families. Whether you accept this view or not that's why minorities don't want to be police. Obviously not all police are racist but the justice system in this country has earned a very factual bias against minorities. Of course there are great traditions of blacks in law enforcement (mostly in larger urban areas), but why would they go to an ass-backwards redneck operation with a pretty obvious bias against diversity?

So here's why diversity is important: The country is going to get more and more brown. Diversity is necessary because if we get to the level of a white police force and a majority brown population chaos will result. It's really that simple. If police departments in areas like Ferguson want to integrate, they need to change their image so that minorities will consider it a viable career option. I think the people trying to get minorities into the police departments see it as either a forced effort or feel good quotas that reduce the performance of the department. In fact, it is necessary to make the department effective. If authorities think militarizing their force and increasing the force used against minority populations will work they are going to get a very unfortunate surprise. Putting the effort into achieving diversity is no different than arming for a different tactical situation.

 

[captain]

You aren't going to get good blacks to be a part of oppressing their own people. If they join the force they would not be welcome in their own families.

Here in lies the answer... People won't stand for the truth and try to play the popular line... If blacks are not going to go against what they know is wrong then you tell me sir, who is the racist... Just let the white cop that did the right thing fall?

I'm done because you just proved my point..

Cap

 

[skydivr]

Exactly Cap....

Stories about Black Cop shooting white kid, justified or not - no news
Stories about Black Cop shoot black kid, justified or not - no news
Stories about White Cop shooting white kid, justified or not - no news
Stories about Black kids shooting other black kids - no news (and THIS is the REAL tragedy)...
Stories about White Cop shooting black kid - justified or not - "burn the boich down!"

IF this were about a White or Black Cop, shooting a white gangbanger who just robbed a convenience store, fought the officer in his car, charged him after multiple commands.....I'd BACK THE OFFICER - Because what Arch fails to recognize is that I give a crap about the color/race of either - I care about what the OFFICER did, and what the ACCUSED/WOUNDED/DEAD PERSON did...

This may surprise you Arch, but I have the same level of contempt for cheap white trash....

For you LEO's on the the .org - It takes a special person do to what you do - I couldn't do it I don't have your patience. You strap your badge, gun and body armor on every morning, saying goodbye to your family with everyone knowing you might not ever come back home, and still go out into the world to do your job. You have my respect.

 

[fallenarch]

Captain your focus is just on Ferguson. Brown is just the flame that lit the fuse but the basic issues have been stewing for a long time. you proved my point too, Lol!

 

[Flicka]

From your own post, why was he told to stop if he wasn't running? Why was he told to turnaround if he was running away? Common sense suggests he was running away. If he wasn't running away he would have been sit beside the car correct?

The autopsy report that I've seen all over the news shows that he was impacted by 6 bullets, all of which struck the front of his body. It shows no wounds at all to the back of his body. He may have been running, but it certainly would seem that he wasn't running away. No matter which direction he was running, by that point he was a fleeing felon (assault on an officer) and the use of force was legally justified. From everything I've seen this whole thing went down by the book. It's unfortunate that someone lost their life. That said... Buy the ticket, take the ride.

 

[GNBRETT]

I wonder how many protests white ppl wud hav participated in if the police officer was indicted? call me crazy but I'm betting NONE! I certainly did not agree with the casey anthony verdict but its our system and its not perfect but its what we hav and usually they get it right.

this incident is viewed by many based on which race they are. did anyone see the polls? it was almost 98% against the cop from black people and 98% for the cop who were white. this was clearly made into a racial issue vs. a justified and unjustified issue. TV has a lot to do with that. same as the OJ trial.

I was asked today why didn't the cop use his Taser. we all have them in my dept and are issued to us individually. personally, the Taser is the best tool LE has ever received. I honestly can't remember when the last time a cop got hurt and had to go hands on with someone and I work in a violent chithole!

but to my understanding the cop did not have a Taser. IDN why? maybe the whole PD doesn't hav em. or maybe SWAT only. not sure or maybe supervisors only which is really stupid imo since its the officer responding there first. but I can tell u for sure that no way and I gettn my Taser out of my holster while sitting in the car. its on my weak side and my holster requires u to be standing to disengage it. my old one did not and thinkn of going back to that one actually.

but even if he did have a Taser the gun would be ur first weapon that you would go for. remember, this was a strong arm robbery but that doesn't mean he wasn't armed. he a big dude and I've seen strong arm robberies take place simply cause they are easier to pull off then brandishing a weapon if u can simply over power them but still be armed. very common.

I asked myself if I had just shot someone in my cruiser and exited my vehicle and was able to go for my Taser would I have? definitely not! if I have drawn my weapon and discharged it at a suspect its a deadly force situation and the intention is to stop the suspect from gaining access to my weapon then no way wud I exit the vehicle and then holster my weapon and take my Taser out. no way.

ANY type of robbery is considered a violent crime and as a cop you HAVE to assume the worst and that he is armed. why all this took place in the car I have no idea but eventually the cop exited. I don't have all the details but I'm sure one cud criticize the officers approach of the suspect just as every deadly force situation cud have gone different and therefore resulted in a different course of events. poor tactics does not mean unjustified.