Apparently when you carry a concealed gun

[twotonevert]

I took the course here in Oklahoma and passed. Before I sent off my paperwork, I tried to carry my gun into a convenience store. I had a shoulder holster and my side arm was unloaded. I felt like everyone in the place was staring at me. I support the ablility for people to carry, I just know it is not for me. Now I do carry something in my vehicle when we travel, especially to areas I dont know. What also bothered me about having a cc license, since I am qualified with a side arm, I know what I am doing, I have been trained. Therefore, if I pull my weapon and kill an attacker that was not trained, I still will face civil charges even if criminal charges are dismissed. Know this: If you carry and you pull your weapon, you had better shoot to kill, dont wound, dont shoot them in the leg, shoot to KILL. In that instant everything in your life will change. With that said, I know that most that do carry know the rammifications of such an act. I also know full well that I would not hesitate to kill anyone to defend my family, just realize that taking a life whether justified or not, will change yours.

 

[busaville]

Do I cc? Yes. Do people know about it? Typically no.
Am I afraid to use it? No.
Go where I've been, see what I've seen, walk in my shoes and you would too, sorry the world is FULL of awesome caring people, but unfortunately it's also full of predators....better Judged by 12 than carried by 6.

 

[solarbarack]

I've carried for a long time. Maybe four people know about it, but if somebody kicks in my door thrying to rob me or cause harm you'd be best to belive that I'm not comming out with my hands over my head.

 

[BUSA_CHeMiST]

twotonevert,

Even if you shoot and kill or wound, they CANNOT come after you in Civil court anymore. That law has changed.

 

[CTA_Busa_LE]

Therefore, if I pull my weapon and kill an attacker that was not trained,  I still will face civil charges even if criminal charges are dismissed. Know this: If you carry and you pull your weapon, you had better shoot to kill, dont wound, dont shoot them in the leg, shoot to KILL. In that instant everything in your life will change. With that said, I know that most that do carry know the rammifications of such an act. I also know full well that I would not hesitate to kill anyone to defend my family, just realize that taking a life whether justified or not, will change yours.

Very good point. It doesn't matter if you are carrying legal, properly trained, and justified in the use of it, if you have to use it you WILL be sued, scrutinized, second guessed and raked over the coals in any other manner that can be found.

As for shooting to kill or wound, never do either. You shoot to stop the threat. If justified to shoot you are justified to shoot them anywhere you have to which includes the two places voted most likely to stop an attacker, the head and chest. Once the theat is stopped, it's up to God and the paramedics as to how it will turn out.

 

[JR'S BUSA]

I believe it is ones choice to carry or not, I believe the constitution says that we as American citizens have the right to bear arms. I do not care either way if someone carries or not, IT'S THEIR CHOICE !!

 

[BUSA_CHeMiST]

Sorry twotonevert,

I forgot you were in Oklahoma, I am checking to see if that law is Federal or not, I know it is in place and active here in Texas...i will keep looking.

 

[twotonevert]

Sorry twotonevert,

I forgot you were in Oklahoma, I am checking to see if that law is Federal or not, I know it is in place and active here in Texas...i will keep looking.

No problem, I have not heard of that change in Oklahoma.

 

[MPH 200]

Unless you have been on the business end of a 45 caliber pistol, you may not understand. I have. My whole family carries, it is legal in Texas w/ a license. I think there are a lot of people that are afraid of guns.I believe this fear is due to a lack of training w/ a firearm.

I agree w/ Busa_Chemist, not all of those people would have died in Virginia, if one person was carrying a licensed firearm. The concealed carry push started in Texas after the massacre at the Luby's in Killeen.

Guns don't kill people, everybody knows that motorcycles do.

 

[BlueHaya]

Carrying around a firearm for the average person is silly. You are better off avoiding areas with a higher statistical probability of violent crime. If you live in a quiet neighborhood and stick around quiet friends you should be alright. On the other hand if you rub elbows with thugs and hoodrats, kill at will.

Sure, there are the occasional mall shootings and what not, but what are the odds that you will be a victim to this type of violence?

The best thing you can do is keep your head under the radar. I know that for big guys like myself and Ben, that is a difficult proposition, but it has to do more with posturing rather than appearance.

Those gun pron mags sure do have a bunch of entertaining albeit poorly written stories submitted by hillbillies and wannabe cowboys.

I usually agree with you logic Projekt, but this write up follows you well written stories.

The average person eats a Luby's (where a massacre happened a few years back in Texas)...the average person goes to schools (where massacres happen seemingly often now).....the average person gets gas and supplies at stores where many criminals are waiting for opportunities to steal a car or kidnap someone.

The average criminal carries a gun...why not the average citizen?..kind of level the playing field so to speak.

I carry a gun, because a cop is too heavy.

 

[landmissle]

I'm glad I live in Florida. I would not live in a state that did not not have a conceal carry provision. I have several police officers in my gym that have flat out said "a person that can carry and does not is crazy!!!"

Let's put this in perspective....driving a car is a previledge......keeping and bearing arms is a right! The police protect society as a whole, but, are not expected to protect any one individual. People need to take responsibility for their own protection. An armed society is a polite one!

Anyone that wants to disarm America can kiss the business end of my glock!!! Let the flames begin!

 

[BUSA_CHeMiST]

Sorry twotonevert,

I forgot you were in Oklahoma, I am checking to see if that law is Federal or not, I know it is in place and active here in Texas...i will keep looking.

No problem, I have not heard of that change in Oklahoma.

Twotone, I found it! And for all the other residents of Oklahoma that might have not known the law change...

This is according to the last revised statutes of 2007...

§21-1289.25. Physical or deadly force against intruder.

I. A person who uses force, as permitted pursuant to the provisions of subsections B and D of this section, is justified in using such force and is immune from criminal prosecution and civil action for the use of such force. As used in this subsection, the term "criminal prosecution"￾ includes charging or prosecuting the defendant.

So yes, YOU ARE FREE from any type of criminal or civil litigation if the use of force was justifiable.

Now is this saying that you are gonna be free from the process before it reaches the Grand Jury?? NO, probably not.

 

[yamahor]

No offence Ben, but as soon as you shoot someone, you will be going to jail. Why you ask?
Because the laws are very poorly written. They are written for the criminals to get off. The jurors themselves are morons, and the whole system is corrupt...

I understand this. But as stated before, I'm not going to just let them kill me, I'm going to fight back. If it's just fist's coming at me, I'll use my fists, but when it becomes deadly on their behalf, I'm going deadly.

 

[yamahor]

Ben, how Hollywood killing gun community?

I'll start another post on that.

 

[twotonevert]

Sorry twotonevert,

I forgot you were in Oklahoma, I am checking to see if that law is Federal or not, I know it is in place and active here in Texas...i will keep looking.

No problem, I have not heard of that change in Oklahoma.

Twotone, I found it!  And for all the other residents of Oklahoma that might have not known the law change...

This is according to the last revised statutes of 2007...

§21-1289.25.  Physical or deadly force against intruder.

I. A person who uses force, as permitted pursuant to the provisions of subsections B and D of this section, is justified in using such force and is immune from criminal prosecution and civil action for the use of such force.  As used in this subsection, the term "criminal prosecution"￾ includes charging or prosecuting the defendant.

So yes, YOU ARE FREE from any type of criminal or civil litigation if the use of force was justifiable.

Now is this saying that you are gonna be free from the process before it reaches the Grand Jury??  NO, probably not.

Thanks bro. I will have to look into that a little more.

 

[Fate]

States that have a concealed and carry seem to have crime rates go down right after they are implemented, the thought the victim may be armed seems to help, however the average Joe with no real training has a good chance of not hitting their target, and maybe hurting someone else. I am a backer of the victim being able to carry since the criminals may be, but getting the proper training is a must. Someone in a high stress, adeniline filled moment that is a great shot at the firing range, can miss a person very easily. I carry alot but never tell anyone. My best friends don't know, it is hidden and not discussed. So I do not have to worry about those discussions like Yamahor had.

 

[landmissle]

It is better to stand before 12 than be carried by six!

 

[Projekt]

My post was composed solely to serve as something to argue against. In fact, the holes I left in the argument were answered in the exact fashion I predicted. Thanks for playing.
I don't live in the US most of the time so I can't walk around with a gun legally where I do live. With proper training, I agree that it is generally beneficial for citizens to be able to carry a firearm. If I were back in the US I'd probably acquire a concealed carry permit but would rather not feel compelled to do so.

 

[BUSA_CHeMiST]

I see where you are coming from Projekt.

As stated in my CHL class, carrying IS a HUGE responsibility. You have to display sound judgement and know when it is necessary to dram down or not. Thats where the training comes into play. I cant tell you how many times I watch a COPS episode and think "Man, how did that cop have that much restraint NOT to shoot the perp?" Its the training.

Another aspect of the training, obviously, is accuracy. They do have laws in place to protect 3rd party victims in the case that you are involved in a justifiable shooting and a 3-rd party, innocent victim were to be injured/killed. So you have to know where that bullet is going and understand "once it has left the gun, you can't take it back"

I go to the range multiple times a month with multiple caliber handguns to work on my proficiency. The majority of the time I spend at the range is with my weapon I choose to use as my concealed sidearm.

 

[kreator]

Unless you have been on the business end of a 45 caliber pistol, you may not understand. I have. My whole family carries, it is legal in Texas w/ a license. I think there are a lot of people that are afraid of guns.I believe this fear is due to a lack of training w/ a firearm.

I agree w/ Busa_Chemist, not all of those people would have died in Virginia, if one person was carrying a licensed firearm. The concealed carry push started in Texas after the massacre at the Luby's in Killeen.

Guns don't kill people, everybody knows that motorcycles do.

Yep,
Bottom line, it's our right to carry, we carry.