GNBRETT
Registered
a police officer does not need a radar, laser, vascar or any other speed measuring device to cite you for traveling above the posted speed limit. if in his training and experience (Radar or Laser training) he feels that you are traveling above the posted speed limit he can cite for traveling unreasonably fast.I was peaking in general terms. I have been pulled over and been nothing but nice and submissive to the officer. They are a lot of times the smartass ones. I had a cop pull me over once and say "Did you graduate elementary school? Yes I replied. So then you clearly can understand what 30 means on a sign when you see it. Yes I respond. Do you need any help in understanding what this means? No I said. Well I clocked you doing 52 in a 30, but I am going to do you a favor and only write you up for 45 in a 30. That is fine officer. I signed the ticket and went to court.
Officer did his canned rehearsed speech about how he found me to be exceeding the speed limit and presents the current calibration records to his radar gun just as they are trained to do. Judge ask me if I dispute any of this. Yes your honor I am going to dispute that he was not using methods he was trained and expected to use in the field. Judge paused and raised his eyebrows a bit and said "alright Mr Gibbs I'm going to see where this one goes".
My turn to defend myself. Officer, do you consider yourself literate? Yes was his response. Smug look on his face. Have you passed High school math I ask? Yes he said. Again the look. Judge already is starting to get irritated with me. Your honor I will present as evidence the training manual on proper speeding violation stops. The manual in which he read and claims to understand and has been signed off on as being properly trained. He has admitted to being literate and I will be using some basic high school math in my defense so I want to make sure he can't say he doesn't understand my defense questioning. Judge allowed it.
Hand out copies of the training manual to judge and officer.
Officer if you turn to page 12 and read us the first step in determining a speeding vehicle it says what? Officer will obtain a visual confirmation of speed of vehicle before employing use of any other measurement devices.
Officer did you do this? Ummmm yes of course I did. Alright officer, tell us how you visually established my speed. I observed you in traffic and estimated your speed to be higher based on using a fixed point of reference. (His training manual response). Excellent officer. And what was that fixed point? It was the lamppost on the corner of 3rd Ave as you passed it heading north. That is fine officer. And for how long did you visually track me to determine my speed. About 3 seconds? About 3 seconds officer? Was that about 3-5 seconds or 2-3 seconds. I don't know exactly how long but I'd day 3-5 seconds. Fine officer. No lets talk about your radar gun. You were using a handheld Stalker unit correct? Yes (He began to straighten up his spine right on the spot). Great so how long do you estimate it took you to raise the unit to begin measuring me? Oh I don't know about 3 seconds. Judge interrupts. You are badgering the officer. Your honor if you refer to the training manual it states the proper engagement of a hand held device and the officers responsibilities. (Cop is now reading that section like mad to anticipate my questions. It won't matter anyway). Your honor I want to establish if he in fact did use the trained methods as he is sworn to do. OK I'll allow it but this better get somewhere quickly. Just about 3 more should do it your honor.
So officer what is the prescribed time to correctly engage that unit on your target and ensure a proper reading making sure there are no panning errors. (How the hell does he know what a panning error is?). 4 seconds. OK officer so we have 4 seconds plus and estimated 3 seconds it took you to raise the gun and lock in on me, plus your estimate of 3 seconds give or take a second to visually verify my speed before that. Correct? Yes. OK officer do you wish to re-think any of your answers you have given thus far. No. OK fine so we are all certain that you are testifying 10 seconds at least correct? Yes. Now then officer where did you pull me over? I pulled you over just after Knights Ave on the eastbound side heading north. That is correct officer I have no dispute there and am in total agreement. Was I slow to pull over or did it take awhile for me to. No you pulled right over. Thank you officer. And did you find me cooperative and prepared with all my documents? Yes. Was I polite and prompt? Yes. Thank you officer.
Officer do you know the distance between the lamppost on 3rd Ave and Knights Ave. No I don't. I don't really care. Since you are trained to visually judge distance you can estimate it with a pretty high degree of accuracy right?right? Yes. OK give us your estimate. 250 feet was his resonse. Your honor I'd like to present into evidence the traffic engineering documents held at the city that shows this stretch of Highway 1 in which I was traveling north on. The judge is beginning to take some interest now. So we have no dispute, does everyone know how to read the key that shows how much distance per inch? Officer if you need any help I can show you. (My turn to demean him some now). I have this calculator and ruler you can use if you'd like. I held them out. Judge sort of smiled and the rest of the people waiting in court started laughing. Officer refused them.
OK then I have measured this and submit that the distance between the lamppost and the point I was pulled over was 312 feet. Everyone wanna check that info. Judge actually did ask for a ruler. He took a minute and agreed. He said I don't know about the 2 feet but I will agree you've done your homework enough to say its probably right on. I paced it off with a roller ruler to make double sure your honor.
OK now to save time and all sorts of calculators being used, I'd like to submit a spreadsheet that uses simple high school math to show an object traveling at various speeds and what distance they would travel. It will save us all a lot of work and calculating as we go. It shows my formulas in easy to understand high school terms. The formula is (D)istance =(S)peed divided by (T)ime. Judge allows it and I gave the baliff the spreadsheets to hand out.
Now officer you originally wrote on my ticket that I was traveling at 52 MPH correct. Yes. And you did me a favor by writing it up at 45 to "help me out" right? Yes. OK officer using the concept of division which you claimed to have passed in high school do you feel you need any help in understanding this spreadsheet? If you'd like to check my work using a calculator to make sure there is no errors (as I again held out the calculator). Do you feel you'd need any help in using a calculator (My turn to treat him like he treated me on the side of the road)? Of course he says no. By now he isn't going to fall for anything I offer. In fact I made the first line easy. 60 MPH = 88 feet per second. Multiply 88 times 60 seconds and we get 5280 feet or one mile. Follow along officer? He is showing signs of being visually pissed about now.
Now officer lets look at 52 MPH. Go ahead find it there on the spreadsheet. The little square that has a 5 and 2. At 52 MPH I'm traveling at 76 feet per second, correct? Yes And as you testified you took 10 seconds to verify my speed as trained correct. Yes (He can't back out now). So at 52 mph how many feet have I traveled in 10 seconds. Ummm it says 763. His face is getting red now. Now officer since you did me a favor let me ask you to do me one. Lets look at 45 and see how far I went in 10- seconds. The answer 660 Feet.
Now officer if Knights Ave. was 312 feet from the time you saw me speed to the time you pulled me over, and none of us are disputing that as fact, how is it that I am doing 45 let alone 50. No answer. Now officer look in the time column there and see what speed it says I was doing if I traveled 312 feet. It says 20 at 300 feet he replies. So officer is it safe to assume that you being literate and having passed high school that 312 feet would be closer to say 22-25 than it would be 45-52. No answer. Do you need my calculator officer? More laughter from the people waiting their turn. He stood there with the veins on his forehead now showing and throbbing. Your honor do you have any questions for me? Mr. Gibbs are you saying you were doing 25 MPH and disputing the officers accusation. Your honor I believe I was doing 30 to 32, but it appears by the officers testimony that I was actually doing more like 25 so I guess I will say I am disputing any speed he claims I was doing as we have already used the facts as he presented them to disprove I was doing anything close to 45. The judge pondered a bit. Your honor do you have any more questions for me? Mr Gibbs do you realize that you have to ask for a case to be dismissed? No your honor I did not. The judge said Mr. Gibbs do you have any questions for me? At this time I would request a dismissal. Request for dismissal approved. Mr. Gibbs I'd like to see you after the officer leaves. Officer do you ave any more cases to be heard today? No your honor. In that case you better go back and think about this one because if I see you before me again on a speeding violation I am going to remember this case for a long time.
The judge waited for him to leave and said in open court. Mr. Gibbs I wish more people like you made judges like me aware of what is going on out there. He turned to the other officers waiting on their cases and said. "He is one of the few that isn't gonna let you guys pull this stuff out there".
To be honest I probably was doing 40ish in that 30. I would have taken my medicine and paid the fine, until the cop turned into a *ick with me.
That is what planet I come from. Treat the citizens with respect and get it back. Treat them like they are serving you and they will eventually get you back. If not peacefully, then eventually by violence.
I don't think the kid should have been thrown around and arrested. Ticketed yes. IF in fact his plate was obstructed. Like it was suggested. An attorney is going to chop this cop up and feed him to the seagulls.
being cited for SPEEDING is a different charge all together and would surely need an exact speed from either radar, laser, vascar or simply following for a given distance with a calibrated speedometer.
you seem to be under the impression that if a cop is very respectful to a citizen they will get respect in return. that could not be further then the truth.
an attorney is gonna chop him up and feed him to the seagulls? keep dreaming.....
if the cop wants to arrest him for an arrestable offense thats his choice. and based on the little punks attitude I can assure you every cop on this planet would be takn his ass to jail to.
