dyna beads... update?

[card16969]

OMG, please tell me you aren't serious with this series of posts! Noboby could be this far out of touch with reality and still be capable of mounting a tire. Apparently you haven't mounted a tire since 1979 when tires were actually directional. The days of bias ply tires are now in the distant past. It's time to catch up with technology and think "Radial"!

Let me help you out a little on that directional arrow on the sidewall of most if not all current motorcycle tires. The only reason that arrow exists is because the tread is designed to shed water efficiently in one direction. The carcass could care less which direction it rotates. Ask any guy who attends track days or races. We all flip the tire when it shows wear on one side. And, I might add that wearing the rubber down on one side has absolutely no effect on balance. I too have flipped my fair share of tires. Mark the valve stem position, flip the tire over and pop it on the balance machine and bingo, still in balance. It's the odd tire that will be out of balance and its usually due to loosing a wheel weight or wasn't balanced when it was mounted. This is true with both race and street tires.

I don't measure how long a front tire lasts by mileage, I measure their useful life (I'm sure sixpack will agree) by the number of landings. And never ever have I had a front tire wear funky or become unbalanced from wheelie landings nor do they get flat spots.

Dyna beads? If they work for you, great! But,,,,,,,,,, I'm not buying your koolaid!

No i have absolutely no idea what im talking about i just went to school to be a motorcycle mechanic spent a year building bikes for a race team and got a job on a superbike team but i have absolutely no effing clue what im talking about.... and no the directional arrow means nothing but watershed... actually every manufacturer puts the arrow there for a reason and its not because of the radials... it has to do with the way the compounds are laid on the tire and are designed to rotate in that direction because it performs the best in that direction because it was designed to... not only did i graduate from school but i graduated with honors and even while in school got the good fortune of going to several seminars around the country by manufacturers and independent groups on things like tires, oils and fuels.... Also i didnt start this thread to push dyna beads on anyone when in reality i started it to ask peoples opinions based on use not whether or not people who have never used it think it works. Im not pushing some magic elixer im asking opinions from people who have real world experience with a product that same as people ask about oils tires air filters etc on here. This place is a place to gain knowledge from other people who have used a product and either use it because it works or save your money and not waste your time with it because it doesnt... its not a place to come to get bashed because someone has absolutely no experience with a product but bashes people who have and it seems that 99% of the people who use them like them.

 

[card16969]

Card,.......really? I mean....REALLY?

I get on here and give my unbiased first-person opinion based on actual experience and have someone ask me a question like that? I build Porsche's & open road/road race cars for a living so that may actually preclude me from being a complete idiot.

I replace all my bike tires every season regardless of wear just for piece of mind. I do not ride quietly and want all the protection I can get. My Triumph (with dyna beads) will only do 175mph and I also know this from firsthand experience. No worn tires, no patched tires, no cheap tires, my life is worth more than the savings.

I don't track my bikes (yet) because they are my escape from the track. I have spent way too much time on the track in my cars and customers cars and due to my experience I will never scrimp on tires even for my shop truck.

i never once meant it as an insult as i thought i had made clear.... ive had a customer come in with a similar problem and the tire was mounted incorrectly, i was simply trying to give an idea of what to check on to possibly solve your problem as i dont like seeing people with problems .... also the customer had changed to a metal 90 degree valve stem instead of the rubber one and made the balancing even further off... sorry for trying to help and it coming across as an ahole

 

[chrisjp]

i have a problem with straight valve stems. for some reason all my heavy acceleration causes them to crack at the base...i have actually had 2 flat rear tires from this. and also i had one of those decrative metal busa valve stem caps....got rid of them too due to 'logically" affecting the valve stem on acceleration and causing flex.

 

[SKnight]

First off, let's get your facts straight, eh? Not all race tires are soft. Actually some are quite hard. Many race tires run the same carcass with soft - medium & hard tread compounds. Please school me on how I would know if I have a soft or hard carcass that these beads may stick too? Pirelli actually had four compounds on one of their race tires. So, how would you explain that?

Secondly, where did you come up with the idea that these beads are going to stick to the inside of a race tire. Please school me?

If dyna beads work for you when you twist the throttle and hang on, Wonderful! All I'm saying is don't give me this song and dance about how wonderful they are until you or some credible source has given these things a work out. Try laying it on it's lips at your 150mph over a few bumps to rattle those beads around and see if the front tire stays under you? You can get away with a whole-lotta stuff when you are straight up and down that will bite you when you are leaned over.

Do you have any idea what happens to those beads when you encounter bumps? Or how difficult it may be for your forks to control the tire when the beads gets banged around by bumps, especially when the bike is leaned over? How about traction, does dyna beads have any affect on your tires' traction if they become dislodged and unstable over a bumpy surface?

These are all legitmate questions that anyone should ask when considering any aftermarket product that affects performance

Again, you shouldn't denounce what you know nothing about. Despite your extensive delusional knowledge about me I have a lot of experience in the racing world. Been around it all my life and involved hands on for 20 years. You're not the end all beat all authority on high performance vehicle control. Although I'd love to see you lay a bike on it's lips at over 150. Rossi probably would as well.

Here's your schooling in the link and quotes below.

Gathered from here. Yes yes, I'm sure you'll give me the song and dance about how the manufacturer will say anything to sell it's product and this actually isn't a credible source.

A: No. The inner liner compound of motorcycle road racing tires is too soft to allow Dyna Beads to perform properly.
This does not apply to off-road motorcycle racing.

A: The balancing principle is based on centrifigal force, and enough force is developed to keep the beads in position at approximately 25 - 35 MPH, but the exact speed is dependant upon tire diameter.

I've hit bumps at pretty considerable speeds and had not even any shake much less something that would cause concern. And I'm not talking ripples I'm talking a jolt that would have track operators in hot water. One of those that didn't look bad but ended up bad enough that I turned around and looked at it. Do the math regarding gforces of a revolving object and prepare to pick your jaw up. A 120/70-17 at 100MPH, since you like to talk racing speeds, is pulling a whopping 717.2 G's! Can you imagine it? At 717 G's those little beads aren't going to move. And if they did move and all clump in one place they would account for.......static 1oz. in the front and 2oz. in the rear. If you can't handle a vibration caused by static 1oz. and 2oz. then you've got bigger issues than the fact you now have a shake especially considering the overwhelming number of riders that don't balance at all. Surely one of them is having an imbalance issue of that scale or larger.

You've issued the challenge for us to find one credible source stating that these things work. I'd like to reverse that challenge. You need to find credible evidence where they don't work. If you're going to use magazine articles where they tossed them on a dynamic balancer and declared them a fraud understand that the tire has to move vertically along the suspension's path to properly orient themselves. And you'll find a few guys on the web that tried them and declared them junk. There's one in every crowd. But you'll find 10X or more that love them.

I've used them, convinced a few of my friends to try them, seems several on here use them. They work. They work very well. Would I put them in a racing tire? Nah, they don't last long enough to justify the trouble and they do take a few minutes to put in plus you have to gather them up to transfer to the next tire. Not worth the time.

But on a DOT tire they're more than worth it.

Until you try it or actually find credible evidence stating they don't work I don't see where you have a dog in this hunt. I respect your considerable experience and time in this hobby but frankly you are wrong.

 

[card16969]

Again, you shouldn't denounce what you know nothing about. Despite your extensive delusional knowledge about me I have a lot of experience in the racing world. Been around it all my life and involved hands on for 20 years. You're not the end all beat all authority on high performance vehicle control. Although I'd love to see you lay a bike on it's lips at over 150. Rossi probably would as well.

Here's your schooling in the link and quotes below.

Gathered from here. Yes yes, I'm sure you'll give me the song and dance about how the manufacturer will say anything to sell it's product and this actually isn't a credible source.





I've hit bumps at pretty considerable speeds and had not even any shake much less something that would cause concern. And I'm not talking ripples I'm talking a jolt that would have track operators in hot water. One of those that didn't look bad but ended up bad enough that I turned around and looked at it. Do the math regarding gforces of a revolving object and prepare to pick your jaw up. A 120/70-17 at 100MPH, since you like to talk racing speeds, is pulling a whopping 717.2 G's! Can you imagine it? At 717 G's those little beads aren't going to move. And if they did move and all clump in one place they would account for.......static 1oz. in the front and 2oz. in the rear. If you can't handle a vibration caused by static 1oz. and 2oz. then you've got bigger issues than the fact you now have a shake especially considering the overwhelming number of riders that don't balance at all. Surely one of them is having an imbalance issue of that scale or larger.

You've issued the challenge for us to find one credible source stating that these things work. I'd like to reverse that challenge. You need to find credible evidence where they don't work. If you're going to use magazine articles where they tossed them on a dynamic balancer and declared them a fraud understand that the tire has to move vertically along the suspension's path to properly orient themselves. And you'll find a few guys on the web that tried them and declared them junk. There's one in every crowd. But you'll find 10X or more that love them.

I've used them, convinced a few of my friends to try them, seems several on here use them. They work. They work very well. Would I put them in a racing tire? Nah, they don't last long enough to justify the trouble and they do take a few minutes to put in plus you have to gather them up to transfer to the next tire. Not worth the time.

But on a DOT tire they're more than worth it.

Until you try it or actually find credible evidence stating they don't work I don't see where you have a dog in this hunt. I respect your considerable experience and time in this hobby but frankly you are wrong.

THANK YOU.. real life experience like this is what ive been looking for

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

Tuf I see on their website why they wouldnt work for you.

Q: Up to what age can I use Dynabeads?
A: Dynabeads only work for people under age 90.

Q: I own a poodle. Will they still work for me?
A: No, men who own poodles are not manly enough for Dynabeads to work properly.

:kiss:

 

[kml]

Can anybody explain the rotational dynamic theory behind how these perform in the transient condition?

 

[karnage]

You can have the tires static balanced and then you need no weights.Mine are static balanced from BallZ.

 

[sixpack577]

You can have the tires static balanced and then you need no weights.Mine are static balanced from BallZ.

The tires are spun on a static balancer and sometimes they do not need any weight. Most times they do though.

 

[stangman327]

Dynabeads win!

 

[card16969]

Dynabeads win!

hahahhahahahahahahaahahah ok wait ahahhahahahahahahahahahaha ok i think im done now

 

[Blanca BusaLess]

Freeze frame was trippy and induced a flashback. I'm gonna go watch the weeping willow blow and listen to 'In thru the out door'

 

[card16969]

Freeze frame was trippy and induced a flashback. I'm gonna go watch the weeping willow blow and listen to 'In thru the out door'

lol blanca you would ... thanks for the laugh

 

[Tufbusa]

I talked to a buddy who worked on a superbike team and the reason why they dont use any type of internal balancing media is because a tire is never on the rim for more than a week +

Does your friend have a name? What super bike team did he work as an employee on and during what time frame?

Well I guess I am one of the few that have actually tried them and don't like them. .

Ketchmi said this,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Ok now heres a question for you as your problem sounds like something else... have you checked your direction of rotation on your tire and rim because your bouncing/imbalance after 20mph sounds like your tires are mounted incorrectly. No im not saying you dont know what your doing just an observation of a common problem.

And your response above:
I'll take you at your word that it wasn't meant to be insulting but it was condescending to say the least.

You CANNOT base every product off of whether or not a racer would use them, as i stated i talked to a friend who worked on an actual superbike team and the reason that they dont use them is practicality but yet several of the crew members use them personally.

Second time you mentioned this friend with no name who worked for a ficticious superbike team!

No i have absolutely no idea what im talking about i just went to school to be a motorcycle mechanic spent a year building bikes for a race team and got a job on a superbike team but i have absolutely no effing clue what im talking about.

"i have absolutely no effing clue what im talking about" Thank you! I totally agree with you 100%!

Third time you mentioned this friend who worked for a superbike team!

Oh wait, this time its not a friend its YOU!

Your daddy should have taught you to always tell the truth and you wouldn't have to worry about remembering what you may have said in the past!

If you have ever worked on a superbike team, post up a photo of you and your team mates. If you ever built a motor for a race team, who's bike was it in and what year did it race? If you have worked with a superbike team I most likely know someone who knows you and can confirm your credentials.

However, if you decide to respond with another song and dance fairy tale lullaby please wait until bed time to post as the soft music will help me achieve a deep sleep! :sleeping:

 

[Tufbusa]

Again, you shouldn't denounce what you know nothing about.

I see you've had a job on the same superbike team as the CardMan!

 

[Twobrothersbusa]

Tuf,

We really need to work on getting you to open up more...

Does your friend have a name? What super bike team did he work as an employee on and during what time frame?



Ketchmi said this,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,



And your response above:
I'll take you at your word that it wasn't meant to be insulting but it was condescending to say the least.



Second time you mentioned this friend with no name who worked for a ficticious superbike team!



"i have absolutely no effing clue what im talking about" Thank you! I totally agree with you 100%!

Third time you mentioned this friend who worked for a superbike team!

Oh wait, this time its not a friend its YOU!

Your daddy should have taught you to always tell the truth and you wouldn't have to worry about remembering what you may have said in the past!

If you have ever worked on a superbike team, post up a photo of you and your team mates. If you ever built a motor for a race team, who's bike was it in and what year did it race? If you have worked with a superbike team I most likely know someone who knows you and can confirm your credentials.

However, if you decide to respond with another song and dance fairy tale lullaby please wait until bed time to post as the soft music will help me achieve a deep sleep! :sleeping:

 

[SKnight]

I see you've had a job on the same superbike team as the CardMan!

And where did you come to that conclusion? You really are pitiful sometimes. Throwing insults where you have nothing intelligent to say.

Have you tried them yet? Come up with any credible evidence against them besides one man here that doesn't like them?

Bye bye. See you when you have something intelligent to say. Something with more than thinly veiled insults to hide behind. You have nothing constructive to say here, you know nothing about the subject except armchair ranting with beliefs drawn from your single vision of track use, move along until you can actually hold a conversation with facts and experience.

 

[SoCal Blur]

If you examine the video closely you'll see that the first start-up of the wheel is very smooth. However, when the wheel has the magnet and the ball bearings or just the ball bearings by themselves, there is an out of balance hop at initial start of spin until the ball bearings are able to get into the balance position. I think this answers the question as to what happens if you accelerate rapidly. Based on the video, with the ball bearings, there is a moment, initially, when your tire is unstable. At least that's how it appears to me when watching the video.

 

[Tufbusa]

What the hell? So a wheel barrow tire demonstration using ball bearings as a balancing tool is all it takes to convince you that a motorcyle tire will perform exactly the same at high speeds?

You still don't get it, eh? But don't give up, you may get there eventually! I'll be praying for ya! lease:

 

[RussellJ]

:tiptoe: