Just because the crash was not your fault

[mvanlone]

he didn't say the rear-ending was your fault, but what could you do to prevent it?

btw, didn't your parents tell you : only bad things happen after midnight........oh how so true that statement is.......

I have the right to ride in the night just like everyone else. I was in a city of indianapolis.....it was midnight but in a city there is lights....the time of day or night has absolutely now point here. Drunk Driving and blowing red lights do....so you are BLAMING me for driving at midnight for getting hit at night? So in the same statement if someone hits you during the daylight I can say....see you should had been driving at night...less people......again no point here.

 

[Dino]

I have the right to ride in the night just like everyone else. I was in a city of indianapolis.....it was midnight but in a city there is lights....the time of day or night has absolutely now point here. Drunk Driving and blowing red lights do....so you are BLAMING me for driving at midnight for getting hit at night? So in the same statement if someone hits you during the daylight I can say....see you should had been driving at night...less people......again no point here.

First no one said all could be avoided. Second were you positioned so that you could have gotten out of the had you seen him coming? Were you in 1st gear so you could actually get out of the way? Those are things that might have prevented you getting rear ended.

I would say if you were out at midnight you should have an even greater expectation that you are sharing the road with a drunk and take even greater care.

 

[Rayabusa0818]

The three top reasons motorcyclist die are alcohol, no helmet, and riding at night...it is what it is.

 

[Mr Bogus]

I TOTALLY disagree with you on EVERY point. How can rearends be your fault? How can someone that is drunk at 12:00 at night driving a car WITHOUT lights on running the red light than hitting a car and than hitting you can be avoided?

I have been rearended 2x, I have had 2 weeks ago been hit by a drunk driver that ran a red light that did not even have head lights on. Your argument !!!! I am a human being and I don't have spider man's sense to see through cars, through the dark, and through buildings? Your topic hit a nerve....maybe until you get hit in these scenarios you will change your mind. Since in the drunk driver scenario I was following someone that has more experience than I (20 years of experience) and a car...all of us going through a green light at 35 MPH......how can we all avoid this crash....lol.......dude your logic makes me laugh. It is like you going up in the airplane and someone hands you a bogus parachute and you jump out and when you pull the string no chute......we will say later...you could had avoided this....lol......get real......

There is a certain aspect to controlling your own situation..

Risk assessment and management are key to living a long life..

I have most certainly put myself in life threatening positions on a regular basis over my life but always had the situation assessed and mitigated the circumstances that might contribute to failure.

Any "A" personality that skydives,fly's or engages in dangerous sports can usually vouch for this.

Riding a bike on the streets? easily more dangerous than any of the above listed sports

Sitting at light "stopped" what are you doing... watching cars approaching from behind should be pretty high on the list.. it is entirely possible to avert this crash if you see them coming...

Late night light runners: this is really common... if you are running home at night (midnight?) traffic is going to be typically light in most places.. I run all intersections like the lights are green in all directions.. (honest truth) Guys that ride with me always see me roll off, check oncoming and NEVER bust an intersection at cruise speed... These are some of the worst crashes.. Guy turns left in front of you? Hey you gotta read his mind.. Lane changes are the same way, you see a driver make a nod or a twist of the head? you can almost bet they are about to do something stupid..

you can disagree and that is fine.. not all are going to agree with this but if you have been in multiple bike crashes that were NOT your fault? you might be best served to at least take a moment and reflect on the point here..

If I am wrong? no harm no foul... If I am right? it could save your bacon some day.. As I stated in the title of the post, no blame assignment, blame has NOTHING to do with the reality.. Drop the "At blame" thing and pretend it does not exist...

I am 50+, have some 250,000 street bike miles and never been touched by a car... I have hundreds of "missed" opportunities however.. Some perceived, some probably real.. fact still stands.. they aint got me yet..

 

[kennym4]

I agree completely. That whole "it won't be my fault" reasoning never made any sense to me what so ever. If you can avoid an accident why wouldn't you?

For one reason is some people are looking to hit the lottery, with a lawsuit.

When I went down in a corner, I did the whole "gravel in the road" thing. Even the guys I was with were saying it wasn't my fault. But when you get down to it, there were 3 other bikes in front of me that went through it fine. But I know now what realy happened, I noticed the gravel, and panicked, then hit the brakes, and washed out the front tire. Thank God it was a learning experiance, because I went through the same thing (with a LOT more gravel), and just held my line, and came through fine.

That ego thing is a BEACH !!

 

[Dino]

There is a certain aspect to controlling your own situation..

Risk assessment and management are key to living a long life..

I have most certainly put myself in life threatening positions on a regular basis over my life but always had the situation assessed and mitigated the circumstances that might contribute to failure.

Any "A" personality that skydives,fly's or engages in dangerous sports can usually vouch for this.

Riding a bike on the streets? easily more dangerous than any of the above listed sports

Sitting at light "stopped" what are you doing... watching cars approaching from behind should be pretty high on the list.. it is entirely possible to avert this crash if you see them coming...

Late night light runners: this is really common... if you are running home at night (midnight?) traffic is going to be typically light in most places.. I run all intersections like the lights are green in all directions.. (honest truth) Guys that ride with me always see me roll off, check oncoming and NEVER bust an intersection at cruise speed... These are some of the worst crashes.. Guy turns left in front of you? Hey you gotta read his mind.. Lane changes are the same way, you see a driver make a nod or a twist of the head? you can almost bet they are about to do something stupid..

you can disagree and that is fine.. not all are going to agree with this but if you have been in multiple bike crashes that were NOT your fault? you might be best served to at least take a moment and reflect on the point here..

If I am wrong? no harm no foul... If I am right? it could save your bacon some day.. As I stated in the title of the post, no blame assignment, blame has NOTHING to do with the reality.. Drop the "At blame" thing and pretend it does not exist...

I am 50+, have some 250,000 street bike miles and never been touched by a car... I have hundreds of "missed" opportunities however.. Some perceived, some probably real.. fact still stands.. they aint got me yet..

Bogus, It is not often we agree but I am again with you 100%.

 

[mvanlone]

The three top reasons motorcyclist die are alcohol, no helmet, and riding at night...it is what it is.

The 3 reasons that I got hit.

1. Cell Phones (driver talking on cell and not paying attention) result rearend to me.

2. Cell Phones (driver talking on cell and not paying attention) result rearend to me.

3. Drinking and driving, person with warrants for his arrest, had a suspended license, hit and run. Result: Running red light hitting car than 2 motorcycles.


I live by my own stats.....I dont drink and drive bikes, most times I wear helmets, riding at night has no reflection on my driving ability.

 

[Dino]

The 3 reasons that I got hit.

1. Cell Phones (driver talking on cell and not paying attention) result rearend to me.

2. Cell Phones (driver talking on cell and not paying attention) result rearend to me.

3. Drinking and driving, person with warrants for his arrest, had a suspended license, hit and run. Result: Running red light hitting car than 2 motorcycles.


I live by my own stats.....I dont drink and drive bikes, most times I wear helmets, riding at night has no reflection on my driving ability.

In one and two if you were paying attention to what was going on behind you then you might have been able to avoid being rear-ended. At every stop I watch what is coming up behind me until they stop in case they are not paying attention. I also tap the brakes a couple times. In the third situation there may not have been much you could do.

You ability to ride at night doesn't make you more visible.

But this says it all to me: "most times I wear helmets"

 

[trekfuel]

We Know the risks i hope......

It is our fault....the moment we throw a leg over the seat.

Ride like everyone wants to kill you.{including yourself.... busa owners}

ride like every corner may have gravel.

 

[mvanlone]

In one and two if you were paying attention to what was going on behind you then you might have been able to avoid being rear-ended. At every stop I watch what is coming up behind me until they stop in case they are not paying attention. I also tap the brakes a couple times. In the third situation there may not have been much you could do.

You ability to ride at night doesn't make you more visible.

But this says it all to me: "most times I wear helmets"

You are right you caught me. I am a terrible rider. How can I be just like you!!! You are my hero!!!! Thank you God for me to read such great post!!! Spider Man....I am here!!!!! lease:

 

[kennym4]

He wasn't saying that YOU could have prevented the accident you were in. He's just saying that there are sometimes when IF SOMEONE was at a red light, pointed in a way out, in gear, and looking in their mirrors JUST IN CASE the car approaching them didn't stop, that THEY might have been able to avoid an accident.

I know I'm bad to sit there, and rest on my tank, and sight see, so I would most likely be the one that gets nailed. BUT someone that is looking in their mirrors thinking "I wonder if that car is going to stop" probably wouldn't get hit.

 

[Dino]

You are right you caught me. I am a terrible rider. How can I be just like you!!! You are my hero!!!! Thank you God for me to read such great post!!! Spider Man....I am here!!!!! lease:

No need to thank me just be smart, wear your helmet and ride with the assumption that everyone wants to kill you.

 

[Dino]

He wasn't saying that YOU could have prevented the accident you were in. He's just saying that there are sometimes when IF SOMEONE was at a red light, pointed in a way out, in gear, and looking in their mirrors just IN CASE the car approaching them didn't stop, that THEY might have been able to avoid an accident.

I know I'm bad to sit there, and rest on my tank, and sight see, so I would most likely be the one that gets nailed. BUT someone that is looking in their mirrors thinking "I wonder if that car is going to stop" probably wouldn't get hit.

Exactly.

I rest at lights too, sometimes. I just wait until the car behind me comes to a complete stop.

 

[RACER_X]

I have the right to ride in the night just like everyone else. I was in a city of indianapolis.....it was midnight but in a city there is lights....the time of day or night has absolutely now point here. Drunk Driving and blowing red lights do....so you are BLAMING me for driving at midnight for getting hit at night? So in the same statement if someone hits you during the daylight I can say....see you should had been driving at night...less people......again no point here.

of course you have the right, that doesn't make it less dangerous...

less people, yes, more drunk people yes.

i wonder if there are more drunks running around at say midnight vs noon? my guess, midnight. i could be wrong.

so if you so choose to exercise your right to ride at midnight, don't be suprised if you encounter a drunk guy.

i know both friends of mine that died on bikes, both died late at night, due to drunk drivers.......

i stopped riding w/ the squids in town
i stopped riding late at night

crazy, i haven't been to a biker funeral in 5-6yrs.

 

[mvanlone]

He wasn't saying that YOU could have prevented the accident you were in. He's just saying that there are sometimes when IF SOMEONE was at a red light, pointed in a way out, in gear, and looking in their mirrors JUST IN CASE the car approaching them didn't stop, that THEY might have been able to avoid an accident.

I know I'm bad to sit there, and rest on my tank, and sight see, so I would most likely be the one that gets nailed. BUT someone that is looking in their mirrors thinking "I wonder if that car is going to stop" probably wouldn't get hit.

Brother, I know and I apologize for me being a jerk on the previous post. People don't understand ....I was not waiting at a RED LIGHT than proceeding when it went green. It was a stale green and all 3 vehicles never had to stop and we all were proceeding at 35 MPH through the green light. I never though much about someone running the red light because it was red for them for so long. As well there was a car that was on my right....figuring if someone did something stupid they would hit car on the right as they did end up doing. Which in turn hit both my buddy that was ahead of me and I behind him. It was one of those weird crazy things that you would never think would happen.

 

[Tufbusa]

Good Thread Randy!

I agree that ALMOST all accidents could have been avoided by applying a little common sense. I have avoided a number of collisions with vehicles over the years by being well aware of my surroundings and paying attention.

We are 39 times more likely to die in a motorcycle crash vs an auto crash. I've never been involved in a crash that wasn't my fault.

 

[RACER_X]

ex:

new rider
VFR 800
1st bike
NO MSF

to continue the story

Swerved from far lef to far right (so two lanes) and not jumped off. Laid it down basically a low side due to extreme lean angle. All in one motion so no no time for brakes. I will learn from it, just one of the arguable accidents relevant to this thread. Skill? Again I have no claim to fame as far as skill but as stated in my first post my only move would have been to drastically cut my speed in anticipation that he would turn, when at that point he was not in the turn lane?? That leads back to the drastically slowing at a green light. Regardless of opinions, LUCKY is the best description for the outcome of this one. Cheers to a possible CBR1000RR from this roll of the dice

he "swerved" across 3 lanes from 40mph, but had no times for braking, and now wants a 1000RR............

 

[skydivr]

I've never been involved in a crash that wasn't my fault.

Methinks there's a story here confess you sinner!

 

[Mr Bogus]

Methinks there's a story here confess you sinner!

me thinks same... :all-ears:

 

[Busacure]

I assume most riders in this thread are riding using their "heighten senses". I do every time. Its in the numbers. Sooner or later there will be the unavoidable compounding cause and effect Murphy's law situation that will make you wonder what the he|| your doing risking your life on two wheels. Some of you have dependents that need you ALIVE. What sets us apart is the need to take, challenge, and survive the extreme. I consider driving on public roads extreme when I have the most to lose and the least protection. Watch the movie called Idiocracy and consider those driving around you have the same mental capacity as those fans of "electrolytes". Hind site can be seen in 20 20 and yes some accidents COULD HAVE been avoided. I think the original post offers more to the perspective of the inherent risk you place yourself in when your free will put you there. Risk is your problem, not the on who is at fault regardless, it your life and your choice to expose yourself to the flame when you play with fire. Godspeed