Graduated Licence systems: your thoughts?

[jetsetter]

All of the manufactures could follow Harley Davidson's lead and refuse to sell fast bikes to the public.

Think how much safer the world would be if every bike was a Harley. On the occasion that they make it out of the driveway, they never really get going fast enough to have a crash.

(but if they were to do that, I get to keep my Busa. I saw it first!)

 

[Mr Bogus]

All of the manufactures could follow Harley Davidson's lead and refuse to sell fast bikes to the public.

Think how much safer the world would be if every bike was a Harley. On the occasion that they make it out of the driveway, they never really get going fast enough to have a crash.

(but if they were to do that, I get to keep my Busa. I saw it first!)

oh ouch...

 

[roached]

Laws are branching like tree roots, they will consume themselves. I wonder what the first law was,,,, Hide when the Lion comes by? Don't steal food from the Big Dude?, Leave the Big Dude's GF alone..? What is the next one... nobody leaves home when it rains...

Perfect lol...

I would not want to government involved give them an inch they will take it a mile......if the governemnt gets involved it may be so difficult to get a 200mph bike license that none of us will have one. If the government doesnt want you to fly they just make it impossible for you to fly...the practical approach would be for insurance companies to develope standards (education or training) then give heavy discounts to those that meet the quals, incentive and reward gets you further than legislation every time....

 

[bazooki]

Perfect lol...

I would not want to government involved give them an inch they will take it a mile......if the governemnt gets involved it may be so difficult to get a 200mph bike license that none of us will have one. ..

There are no 200 mph bikes remember? The major manufacturers regulated themselves so govt didn't have to. Step around that issue with a TRE and everybody is happy. BTW, I don't buy the NRA argument about if you let them do this then........it is way overused by the fearmongers and is not a sign of intelligent debate.

 

[majestic12]

No. We don't need more regulation. That is a slippery slope. If they have to step in for your lack of common since what other burdens will they decide to liberate us from?

 

[likeapuma]

Was just randomly thinking...don't most military installations make you perform a check ride? I know here on Schofield they make you take a check-ride on your bike...if you switch the size of the bike you have to re do the check ride to prove you are capable of riding that specific bike.

Just an example..idk if it fits correctly with this discussion or not, just food for thought!

 

[afterhours]

sounds a lot like a despotic thought process to me.

regulated liscensing of vehicals (cars, trucks, sports cars, bikes, bicicles, ATVs, jet skis) is a great thought for saving lives, and a horrible thought for darwinism..
let nature take its course, I'd rather have stupid people die driving fast cars they cant handle, than drive regular cars and run me over.

just my 2c.

OH and BTW: im 20 years old, the busa is my SECOND bike, and I've only been riding street bikes for a little over a year.

first one was a 95', and the engine blew on it- not from excessive use / abuse.

(dirtbikes for about 10 years though )

the problem is we don't let darwin finish the job.....

we support the stupid, we support the lazy, and if an idiot gets into an accident riding a bike he cannot handle...we support him also, and his kids....etc.


atleast we could have real licensing standards. i went to the MSF course, there were three new riders in my class. we had 2 crashes in the practice course. yet, all of us passed.

all of us are now ble to legally drive a motorcycle, and can buy go out and buy the biggest fstest thing on two wheels....

even the two guys that crashed while driving a rebel 250 around a bunch of cones in a parking lot.

where is the logic?

PS: the "taking our rights/freedoms away" is a lame argument. since driving is a priviledge, and i my pursuit of happiness would be better if i did not have to pay for your medical bills after your crash...

 

[FanaticalKilla]

A graduated system might save some of the neanderthals. A mandatory training program is a awesome way to go, a Motorcycle Safety course. If I was a insurance company I would consider offer rewards to people who further educate yourself. Riding a motorcycle isn't like driving a car. You need more focus and better control of your inputs.

I would personally like to see the Motorcycle Training Course MANDATORY before you ever ride a motorcycle on the street. You have to go through driver training as a 15 year old wishing to get there license. The only problem is with a motorcycle it is a independent machine. You learn to ride alone. So the first thing that should happen is your guided by a instructor. I took my Rider Safety Course. I think they are the greatest thing going. You learn skills needed to survive. I started on a 600RR and only rode it one day before my training course. Had that for two years, sold it and bought my 1000. Never once has the machine kissed the pavement.

 

[chrisjp]

let me relate a story of my youth... *insert raspy old man voice* ... i remember when i was just 15 and besides the 70 atc we beat up and i wrecked numourous times in the yard my parents owned a 110 honda trail/street. i decided it was time for me to graduate to the street one day when they were not home..so down the hill i went holding that throttle wide open...now at the botom of the hill was a fair sharp turn (i navigate it without thinking or leaning much now on the busa at 70) but back then i was a young buck. i was barely doing 50 and drifted into the opposit lane where luck would have it a car gratiously appeared for me to "oh ****" and yank it back over centerline. very dissasterous for me if i had not corrected...but it left a lasting impression on me to know my limits and my bikes and the road conditions. some of us still learn by experience...sometimes the experience isnt what we asked for.

 

[UncleSteve]

All of the manufactures could follow Harley Davidson's lead and refuse to sell fast bikes to the public.

Think how much safer the world would be if every bike was a Harley. On the occasion that they make it out of the driveway, they never really get going fast enough to have a crash.

(but if they were to do that, I get to keep my Busa. I saw it first!)

funny, not true, but funny..

 

[Pearso]

Australia has a system like this for bikes and cars, to get a MC licence used to mean you had to ride a 250cc or less bike for 2 years but its changed now and you can ride up to 660cc as long as pwr to wght ratio is under 150kw per tonne, you do two practical tests and one knowlage test (the knowlage and first prac to get your learner licence(3mnths min) the second prac to get your provisonal (12mnths min)) if your over 30 you can prgress through the courses faster (as soon as you pass the first tests you can do the rest and within a month you can ride almost anything)

Its good and bad at the same time, Mr/Mrs 30+ who have never been on a bike before can have a busa in a few weeks whereas 30- over there who has been riding dirt bikes (or other bikes legally) since they were 5 are stuck on a pos, on the other hand 30+ still has to pass the prac corse/test ( and yes they're hard ) to get the licence

car licence in Aust means you can't drive any car with forced induction or more than 6 cyls for 4 years (and 3/4 different tests that are damn hard) and this is where its stupid! my car a 1982 holden commodore has a 253 cu/in v8 and isn't learner legal (in its day wow 150hp nowadays you need a long straight if your planning on passing and a tail wind doesn't hurt!) but you can put your kid in a modern 6cyl car and; aust has quite a few now that are 250hp rocket ships off the show room floor!

my thoughts are this some people are idiots and need saving from themselves (and inteligent people almost always suffer because of this) but alot of these idiots also work for the government so its not them that should be doing the saving! if a system is to be introduced it should be set out by the people with experience in the feild other wise it's not worth having

new laws are being introduced for getting a bike licence in my state that pretty much mean getting an unrestricted licence will take 5 years, the government seems to think that because people are still killing themselves it must be a lack of exp, i say its damn hard to teach common sense

 

[trekfuel]

glad i did not have to go through it.

 

[jetsetter]

PS: the "taking our rights/freedoms away" is a lame argument.

So, are you saying that we still have the right to make our own choices and pursue our own happiness, even if the government tells us how to do it?

We need something to help educate riders, I don't think anyone disagrees with that. It's not Uncle Sam's responsibility to do so. It's my responsibility, and your responsibility. If you aren't happy with the state of things, change them. Do something! Don't call your congressman to do it for you.

My sister rides on her boyfriends Harley. They would never wear a helmet, and that bothered me. Did I try to get a helmet law put on the books? No, I talked and reasoned, and shamelessly made her feel guilty, until she started wearing a helmet all the time. Her boyfriend still doesn't wear one, but she does. Later the point was driven home when our dad had a wreck and his helmet obviously saved his life. I converted one! If everybody takes it upon themselves to do the same, it will make a difference, and all without a new law.

 

[afterhours]

So, are you saying that we still have the right to make our own choices and pursue our own happiness, even if the government tells us how to do it?

We need something to help educate riders, I don't think anyone disagrees with that. It's not Uncle Sam's responsibility to do so. It's my responsibility, and your responsibility. If you aren't happy with the state of things, change them. Do something! Don't call your congressman to do it for you.

My sister rides on her boyfriends Harley. They would never wear a helmet, and that bothered me. Did I try to get a helmet law put on the books? No, I talked and reasoned, and shamelessly made her feel guilty, until she started wearing a helmet all the time. Her boyfriend still doesn't wear one, but she does. Later the point was driven home when our dad had a wreck and his helmet obviously saved his life. I converted one! If everybody takes it upon themselves to do the same, it will make a difference, and all without a new law.

i am saying driving on the street is a priviledge, not a right.

i am saying that when you crash into me, it effects my right to pursue happiness.

i am saying that when you/anyone crashes and runs up medical bills they cannot pay. it effects me, all of us. my pursuit of happiness is severely hampered when i have to pay for your medical bills.

 

[StromBusa]

We have lots of laws already about not crashing into other people. I think that if someone were yo parato what we are paying for, the bulk of it is not excess bills generated by some dumba$$ that didn't sufficiently baby step his way up the motorcycle ranks, How about welfare droves, wall street bonuses, stimulus...... I had to have insurance to buy & register the bikes...

 

[afterhours]

when you crash into another....you are not breaking a law, you do not get a ticket for hitting someone.

your insurance rates are high....because sportbikes crash alot

your medical insurance goes up because they have to pay the costs of idiots crashing...

medical costs go up, which makes your medical insurace go up because hospitals need to recover the costs of treating those without insurance that crash thier bikes....

law enforcement costs, and emergency services costs go up because we need to pickup/treat/ all those that crash.....

are we talking welfare reform, obamas socialist stimulus plan or wall street? we can talk about any of them, but those have to do with tiered license or its benefits and money savings.

 

[StromBusa]

Sorry Afterhours, I just don't like the idea of more & more & more laws. I don't want anyone to get hurt on or by a bike. Busa was my 10'th motorcycle. I started @ 70 cc's. I tend to just go off on rants when other people try to make laws "for my good". So called "do gooders" had their way I'd have to have 4 wheels on my motorcycle, air bag & a seatbelt. I don't want to drive my sofa down the road. Prhaps there is some merit to the complexities of a graduated system, perhaps a simple compromise would be to have peeps thake a test on "their bike<s>" WTF are we doing buying bikes for peeps to take the exams on....

 

[jetsetter]

when you crash into another....you are not breaking a law, you do not get a ticket for hitting someone.

Are you sure? I have never been in an accident, but I am under the impression that the person at fault is issued a ticket.

your insurance rates are high....because sportbikes crash alot

Not really, insurance is expensive for my home, but I have never heard of anybody crashing their house into anything. Insurance is expensive because the companies like to make lots of money

your medical insurance goes up because they have to pay the costs of idiots crashing...

The insurance companies have all of that figured out, they charge young people with any vehicle, way more than someone who is a little older. Besides, your medical costs have little to do with the government doing anything.


medical costs go up, which makes your medical insurace go up because hospitals need to recover the costs of treating those without insurance that crash thier bikes....

The hospitals are in no danger of going out of business. I have never been sent a bill for someone else's hospital stay. If you don't want the government paying for it, tell your congressman.

law enforcement costs, and emergency services costs go up because we need to pickup/treat/ all those that crash.....

So lets bill the guy that causes the crash. (don't they do that anyway?)

are we talking welfare reform, obamas socialist stimulus plan or wall street? we can talk about any of them, but those have to do with tiered license or its benefits and money savings.

I'm not aware of anything the government ever did that saved anybody any money.

 

[afterhours]

1. if you have broken a traffic law you may get a ticket....running a red light, speeding, drunk driving gets you a ticket...the ticket does not say violation of vehicle code #123456- smashing a car into another car.

2. insurance rates high so that insurance companies can makee money,correct. everytime they pay a claim they lose money, when you slam into a family of 5, they lose lots of money. if your insurance loses $500K because you killed a mother of 3, they do not take the loss, they recoup it with higher rate for all of us.

3. less idiots on bikes they cannot handle means less accident...safer for me, i am happier.

4. we have to buy those trucks, pramedics and ambulances first....with our tax dollars.

5. your confusing national health care, with tiered licensing.....but then again why fix it, its not broken......

 

[kickinit]

The Japanese would tax air if they could.

Who said anything about "taxes"?

That would be "their" system, thats what the thread originator asked.