How about peace? Much cheaper, no?
Not good news for the country this morning!
- Thread starter Tufbusa
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How about peace? Much cheaper, no?
Mr Brown
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How many times do we need to kill the population of the world? We already have enough firepower to destroy all human life. Anything else is redundant. Give the military the supplies and manpower to defend us, let them do it and stop dumping money into a pi$$ing contest. Dead is dead, now matter how big the gun that killed you......
Point being there was no need for Bush to build the military up, he just wanted to look tough (You know like the flight suit on the carrier) and make his daddy proud......
Let try to make this simple; It comes down to the GIVERS vs. the TAKERS:
GIVERS: Pay into the system by working, staying out of trouble with the law, paying their taxes. Getting education. Serving their country. Teaching their children same. Don't look to big government to solve their ills. Positive benefit to society.
TAKERS: Drain the system continuously for their entire lifes. Know nothing more. Expect Government to TAKE from the GIVERS because they are too lazy to work for it.
Our founding fathers were GIVERS; they may have earned or inherited it, but when it came time to form a government and write a Constitution, they gave us one hell of a document that could stand the test of time, AS LONG AS, GIVERS outnumbered TAKERS.
In a system where everyone has the same vote, as long as GIVERS outnumber TAKERS, we stand a good chance of making it. GIVERS for some reason, besides taking care of themselves and their families, don't mind trying to help other people that are trying to help themselves. The problem what we have now is that the TAKERS now outnumber the GIVERS and are bleeding them dry. Once the GIVERS are gone, the system collapses.
This is what I'm afraid we are heading for.
GIVERS: Pay into the system by working, staying out of trouble with the law, paying their taxes. Getting education. Serving their country. Teaching their children same. Don't look to big government to solve their ills. Positive benefit to society.
TAKERS: Drain the system continuously for their entire lifes. Know nothing more. Expect Government to TAKE from the GIVERS because they are too lazy to work for it.
Our founding fathers were GIVERS; they may have earned or inherited it, but when it came time to form a government and write a Constitution, they gave us one hell of a document that could stand the test of time, AS LONG AS, GIVERS outnumbered TAKERS.
In a system where everyone has the same vote, as long as GIVERS outnumber TAKERS, we stand a good chance of making it. GIVERS for some reason, besides taking care of themselves and their families, don't mind trying to help other people that are trying to help themselves. The problem what we have now is that the TAKERS now outnumber the GIVERS and are bleeding them dry. Once the GIVERS are gone, the system collapses.
This is what I'm afraid we are heading for.
I would agree that, IN A PERFECT WORLD, there would be no guns; but guess what? There are people out there that want to DESTROY us. If it's them or me, I choose me. History is replete with civilizations that forgot that sometimes the best defense is a good offense and are now GONE.
By the way, He earned the right to wear a flight suit, he was a pilot in the TXANG...more than I can say for our current CINC.
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Mr Brown
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Agreed, but the largest TAKERS are the small minority at the very top, the ones that fatten themselves up on our taxes with little or no accountability. There is a significant number of TAKERS at the bottom also, and while the focus is on them, the damage they do is far outweighed by the few at the top....
Mr Brown
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Never did I suggest we don't need guns, far from it, but at what point do we say we have enough to defend ourselves and that it's time to focus on other things?
He was a pilot like I'm a piano player. Ya I took lessons when I was 5, and can still play a few scales, but I'm hardly a pianist.......
There was a time when the children of the elite segment of society were leading the battles their parents started, to do otherwise was to bring shame on your family name. In the last 40-50 years that tradition was completely reversed. Now parents use any and all influence at their disposal to prevent having their children in harms way. I believe things would be a little different if our leaders knew it would likely be their sons and daughters being shipped home in the first planeload of flag-draped coffins......
Takers at the top are known as CRIMINALS just like the Takers at the bottom. Both of them deserve my contempt. Either you are GIVING TO the system, or TAKING FROM IT.
I'm not defending those cheating the system on either end of the spectrum, but when the top 3% of wage earners are paying 97% of the taxes...something has gotta give.
The reality is (as much as I hate to say it), we are going to HAVE to raise taxes to get us out of this hole we have dug our children into. But, there are also going to HAVE TO BE SOME THINGS WE DO WITHOUT as a Government, too. Not sure we can do without a strong defense, but know we can do without socialized health care, and the plethora of entitlement (isn't that such a 'nice' word) programs currently in place. Too many people won't work because the can make almost as much sitting on their azz - I've personally witnessed it. I can guarantee I could find a job if it had to. Why? Because i can at least read and write, speak the language (albiet redneck), and i don't do drugs and have some self-discipline.
I'm rambling and I need to stop i have some WORK to do.
I'm not defending those cheating the system on either end of the spectrum, but when the top 3% of wage earners are paying 97% of the taxes...something has gotta give.
The reality is (as much as I hate to say it), we are going to HAVE to raise taxes to get us out of this hole we have dug our children into. But, there are also going to HAVE TO BE SOME THINGS WE DO WITHOUT as a Government, too. Not sure we can do without a strong defense, but know we can do without socialized health care, and the plethora of entitlement (isn't that such a 'nice' word) programs currently in place. Too many people won't work because the can make almost as much sitting on their azz - I've personally witnessed it. I can guarantee I could find a job if it had to. Why? Because i can at least read and write, speak the language (albiet redneck), and i don't do drugs and have some self-discipline.
I'm rambling and I need to stop i have some WORK to do.
No, there were about 20 of us and two were carrying a banner that said, "Democratic Party for Veterans".
How do I know they were teabaggers? Probably because they had about 30 teabags stapled onto a poster that said, "remember Ft. Hood". I guess they identified some sort of a connection between me and my beliefs and the lunitic assassin of Ft. Hood.
Look, here's the deal with me....all my life I've had great friends (still do I think) that are Vets, non military, Dems, Repubs, even hippie pacifists. The one commonality was....allowing one another a level of respect that goes like this, "I don't agree with you on that but your life experiences have led you to that position so I respect you for who you are".
I'm kind of an unusual guy...combat Marine, Ghetto cop, but politically a "progressive", as I do to all of you on the org, I hope you allow me to be who I am, I promise my values are grounded in a lot of thought and experience. Doyle
afterhours
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10 months in...and the Obama administration has done what?
he has agreed to a "troop surge" in afghanistan.....even though he voted agaisnt a troop surge in iraq.
he bailed out the auto industry....corporate welfare.....and he hired the constructors of the wall street bailout to his new administration...
he stripped the wall street bailout of any provisions that would exclude the corporate execs. thier multi billion dollar bonus's....
and gave us cash for clunkers....
and still had time to accept a Nobel Prize for Peace....
and he is sitting quietly while Iran goes nuclear....
didn't he pledge bi-partisonship and total transparency? don't really see much of that.
he has agreed to a "troop surge" in afghanistan.....even though he voted agaisnt a troop surge in iraq.
he bailed out the auto industry....corporate welfare.....and he hired the constructors of the wall street bailout to his new administration...
he stripped the wall street bailout of any provisions that would exclude the corporate execs. thier multi billion dollar bonus's....
and gave us cash for clunkers....
and still had time to accept a Nobel Prize for Peace....
and he is sitting quietly while Iran goes nuclear....
didn't he pledge bi-partisonship and total transparency? don't really see much of that.
Mr Brown
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Ramble on brother.....
Agreed "entitlement" programs need to be discontinued, how about we start with bailing out failing banks and auto makers? Then worry about removing/reducing/revamping socialist programs like healthcare and welfare.
As far as top 3% earners paying 97% of taxes, I'm in favor of a flat tax across the board. Make more, pay more. Just as simple as it sounds. Abolish the IRS and the utterly incomprehensible tax laws, everyone pays like they weigh.
I think maybe we just found common ground
I assume you are saying we should not have bailed out the banks and automakers, and I 100% agree in principle but %60 agree in reality with that. I didn't want to bail out the BANKERS and AUTOEXECS, but I think we had to stablize the banking SYSTEM. And our last heavy industrial capacity - automakers. Not sure we went about it the right way, but if we can get TARP money PLUS INTEREST back, from them and the auto makers, and don't PIZZ IT AWAY ELSEWHERE, it will have been a good program. And if you don't pay any taxes, I don't see how you get a "cash refund" for taxes not paid....
Mr Brown
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Common ground indeedI think maybe we just found common ground
I assume you are saying we should not have bailed out the banks and automakers, and I 100% agree in principle but %60 agree in reality with that. I didn't want to bail out the BANKERS and AUTOEXECS, but I think we had to stablize the banking SYSTEM. And our last heavy industrial capacity - automakers. Not sure we went about it the right way, but if we can get TARP money PLUS INTEREST back, from them and the auto makers, and don't PIZZ IT AWAY ELSEWHERE, it will have been a good program. And if you don't pay any taxes, I don't see how you get a "cash refund" for taxes not paid....
Your assumption would be correct. It's not capitalism, not a free market economy. It's socialism, plain and simple. Farmers have been taking advantage of it for years. My point is if we are going to have some socialist policies, (and evidently we are) they should not be solely for the benefit of large corporations who have been led into ruin by individuals who have made themselves rich in the process. That is not what "Of the people, by the people" means to me.
I'm not sure I'd compare a piano player with a fighter pilot. You hit the wrong note on the piano, you say "oh shait" and you walk away. You hit the wrong note with that aircraft, and you say "oh shait, put ur head between ur legs and kiss your azz goodbye...
Didn't say he was good at it, just said he DID IT.
Didn't say he was good at it, just said he DID IT.
I'm in favor of a flat tax but its really geared towards spend more pay more taxes. If a family of five supports their kids and make 100k then single joe makes 50k and blows it on thing because his budget allows he actually pays more taxes but because he chose to vs he was made to. No bs tax child credits and such. Your money to support your family remains untaxed when you buy parishable items and such. Vs a credit on what the gov sayd it should cost you.
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A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until a majority of voters discover that they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury. – Alexander Tytler
I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them. – Thomas Jefferson
The war for freedom will never really be won because the price of our freedom is constant vigilance over ourselves and over our Government. – Eleanor Roosevelt
Government never furthered any enterprise but by the alacrity with which it got out of its way. – Henry David Thoreau
Reader, suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself. – Mark Twain
There is no virtue in compulsory government charity, and there is no virtue in advocating it. A politician who portrays himself as “caring†and “sensitive†because he wants to expand the government’s charitable programs is merely saying that he’s willing to try to do good with other people’s money. Well, who isn’t? And a voter who takes pride in supporting such programs is telling us that he’ll do good with his own money – if a gun is held to his head. – P.J. O’Rourke
We contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle. – Winston Churchill (1903)
If you have been voting for politicians who promise to give you goodies at someone else’s expense, then you have no right to complain when they take your money and give it to someone else, including themselves. – Thomas Sowell (1992)
The national budget must be balanced. The public debt must be reduced; the arrogance of the authorities must be moderated and controlled. Payments to foreign governments must be reduced. If the nation doesn’t want to go bankrupt, people must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance. – Marcus Tullius Cicero, 55 BC
When you subsidize poverty and failure, you get more of both. – James Dale Davidson, National Taxpayers Union
Every man has a property in his own person. This nobody has any right to but himself. The labor of his body and the work of his hands are properly his. – John Locke, 1690
Taxation of earnings from labor is on a par with forced labor. Seizing the results of someone’s labor is equivalent to seizing hours from him and directing him to carry on various activities. – Robert Nozick, Harvard philosopher
The moral and constitutional obligations of our representatives in Washington are to protect our liberty, not coddle the world, precipitating no-win wars, while bringing bankruptcy and economic turmoil to our people. – Congressman Ron Paul, 1987
We are living in a sick society filled with people who would not directly steal from their neighbor but who are willing to demand that the government do it for them. – William L. Comer
Correct. Family Joe made a CHOICE to have 5 kids vs. the single Joe that made the choice NOT to...I'd have a problem with punishing single Joe for choosing not to have children...
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