Single topic debate #2

[thepushercg]

just some food for thought. around 67A.D. paul was in prison, while there he wrote letters. one of them was 2nd timothy. some call these pastoral letters, not that it matters.
these two scriptures are the food, you provide the thought.
2nd timothy chapter 4 verse 3 and 4
3:for the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers,having itching ears;
4:and they shall turn away their ears from the truth,and shall be turned unto fables.

no this is not proof of creation, or evolution, what it repesents is,
the bible is a history book of what was, is, and will be.
these two scriptures sum up what we are discussing here. what has been predicted around 2000 years ago.

 

[SAMBUSA]

just some food for thought. around 67A.D. paul was in prison, while there he wrote letters. one of them was 2nd timothy. some call these pastoral letters, not that it matters.
these two scriptures are the food, you provide the thought.
2nd timothy chapter 4 verse 3 and 4
3:for the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers,having itching ears;
4:and they shall turn away their ears from the truth,and shall be turned unto fables.

no this is not proof of creation, or evolution, what it repesents is,
the bible is a history book of what was, is, and will be.
these two scriptures sum up what we are discussing here. what has been predicted around 2000 years ago.

That's what I was getting at above. Just didn't qoute the scripture. Do you think that it matters what was predicted 2000 years ago? It does to me, but others are just gonna say "Cause the Bible says so"

It's interesting to me that if Christ is just imaginary, then why is anything older than A.D. called B.C. which is Before Christ. B.C. is used world wide.

 

[Relsek]

woohooO!  page 8!   How long did our last "discussion" go?  20 pages or so?  I know A6 expanding the size picking apart every line of text...  

 WHERE ARE YOU A6? ? ?   He had many interesting positions on all this too

Didn't "Hey Rev" last over 40 pages?

 

[FastCurrey]

Umm, Beacuse the Bible Says so...  Right...

The Bible came into existence through Revelation, Inspiration and Illumination.  And if 40 diffrent people could write various portions over a period of roughly 2200 years with the unity and consistency that exists in the Bible then that pretty amazing.

Words actually escape me right now.  Again the Book says it's true so it must be true.  

Men, With chalk, pen and ink blood of the unbelievers, pick one.  Wrote and re-wrote the bible to suite their needs.  WHY aren't there alternatives?  POWER AND MONEY....  Books were horribly expensive, people who could read rare.  those with alternative viewpoints have been burnt, put to the sword, and otherwise eliminated.  Hell the Books says to do so right?

Not to hard to write how this book is the one true word when your source of verification IS the BOOK.   Hell the Christians destroy or condemn knowledge which may threaten their choke hold on the minds of their flock...  Alexandria comes to mind destroying thousands of years of written history tablets and texts from the craddle of civilization.  GONE, Lit up!

Leonardo, and some of the greatest greatest minds of all time imprisoned, threatened, condemned...  Because their ideas were revolutionary and fresh.   Might lead the Sheeple from the flock... might loose tithing...  Better Lock em' up.  Tell me what chance an open mind had until recent history...  

Show me ANY evidence, ANY real solid proof that the Bible has NOT been revised, and edited as needed.  EVERY SOURCE you find will in fact GO INTO THE BOOK ITSELF and "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness" (2 Timothy 3:16)[/QUOTE] in an attempt to provide proof of the validity of the books.  

I don't buy it.  It's senseless.

I have an idea: start your own ideaology, you can choose to call it religion or whatever you want to make it up to be.  Write a book that is so compelling, life changing to the point where people are willing to die for it.  They will devote their entire lives to studying its every word, occasionally over the next millenium adding to it and maintaining perfect synchronization.  Get it to climb the charts of the best sellers list and keep it there for say about 1000 years actually just get it at the top for 10 years.  Distibute it world wide and get great personalities from different areas such as U.S. Presidents, world leaders, military generals, scientists, historians, physicians, lawyers and educators to publicly make great statements about it.  Then and only then you may with some actuall authority and insight question, degrade, defame or do whatever you like or say what ever you may say regarding the Bible.  This is just a little challenge for you, shouldn't be too tough, just throw a little science into it.[/QUOTE]

It's called Scientology, it's already been done...  Create a religion on a lark knowing it's a bunch of crap and you still get legions of folks listening.

Sheeple are sheeple, they look for meaning, they yearn for something to make them feel safe and feel better whilst allowing them to heap scorn on those NOT like them...  Hell Wage wars.... The Bible is perfectly in tune with this.  Filling that very natural void.[/QUOTE]
Christians are people, who care what christians say.  People obscure the truth all the time but what does the BIBLE say?  We understand that the Chatholics have wrecked the image of the christian along with jehova witnesses, mormons and pretty much everyone of us that calls ourselves a "follower of Christ".  I am not perfect and I don't expect anyone else to be either.  

If I were put on trial for being a Christian would there be enough eveidence to convict me?  Doubtful bu I trust that the work He has begun in my life He will continue and finish.

People have really messed up the image of "the christian" since the beginning of time; case in point:  Adam.  Adam was told by God not to eat the apple to which Adam went to Eve and said not to eat or TOUCH the apple.  Adam added to the Word of God and in doing so enabled the original sin and downfall of man into his sinful nature.

What do I mean by the above statement?  I am sure that when Eve was talking with the serpent he was leaning against the tree asking Eve, "...and God said not to TOUCH the tree and it's fruit?" and yet the serpet lived...while touching the tree.  This act allowed for doubt in Eve's mind making it easier for her to rationalize eating the fruit.

how about the atom?  sub-atomic particle of like polarity repell each other but the nucleus of atoms is comprised of protons, positive, and neutron, neutral.  How are so many, even two, protons allowed to "bond" to create a nucleus when the should repell each other?  Don't give me this crap  because it's an imaginary variable scientists use to explain what they have no reasonable explanation for.  They do it all the time (i.e. the fact that quantum gravity and general relativity are incompatable?)  

Ok, so they havent learned everything to explain or fill in the gaps, give them time.  Fine, but have you read the Bible and searched for the truth or are you listening to what the world is telling you like the sheep you accuse me of being?  Based on existential philosophy you weren't at the "big bang" either so neither of us knows the truth.  

This is a moot debate enabling the unbeliveing and scared to beat on the Christians who stand for something other than internet pr0n.

/insert smilie giving the finger
/prepares for the flaming

love ya, mean it.  

And the bottom line of the new testament is to get rid of all the rules in the old testament. Jesus handed us two rules: love the Lord God with all your heart, sould and strength. Love your neighbor as yourself...thats it. Anyone who tells you more is adding to the "religion" and I can point out a verse to show you thats wrong.

hell is not a party it's complete seperation from God. That hole in your soul that you fill with "stuff" like addictions should be filled with a relationship with the living God.



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[rtvegas]

People have really messed up the image of "the christian" since the beginning of time; case in point:  Adam.  Adam was told by God not to eat the apple to which Adam went to Eve and said not to eat or TOUCH the apple.  Adam added to the Word of God and in doing so enabled the original sin and downfall of man into his sinful nature.

What do I mean by the above statement?  I am sure that when Eve was talking with the serpent he was leaning against the tree asking Eve, "...and God said not to TOUCH the tree and it's fruit?" and yet the serpet lived...while touching the tree.  This act allowed for doubt in Eve's mind making it easier for her to rationalize eating the fruit.

After all these years, the Bible is still the number one published reading material sold to date.. Without a doubt, it's the best Fiction out there..  I highly recommend it to all out there . Give it a read some time..

 

[FastCurrey]

Sonar surveys in the black sea have yielded the discovery of community mound-villages that are indicative of life having been flooded under the Black sea and hydraulically compressed over a few millenia to profound depths.
So, we are around the corner to explaining away your doubts of evolution..

    No, you are closer to discovering some unknown fact that will disprove what man believes about How "Man" Evolved today...
A few millenia = the time when the world was flooded by God and Noah went yachting.

 

[FastCurrey]

Food for thought God's word said

stop right there, your source for that statment is invalid. You are assuming the bible is fact, so if you plan to refreance it you must first establish it as fact so untill you do so please dont quote opinion and try to pass it off as fact.

I assume that applies to you too.  Please point us to your references to establish these facts  

I never said fact, read the last line in my post, I clearly stated it to be how I see it.

But if you insist here is a start:

Baker, Sylvia, 1976. Evolution: Bone of Contention, New Jersey, Evangelical Press. 35 pp. ISBN 0-85234-226-8
Back to Helium , Magnetic decay , Moon dust , or Metals in oceans .

Brown, Robert H., 1992. "An Age-Old Question -- Review of The Age of the Earth by Brent Dalrymple" in Origins Volume 19, No. 2, pp. 87-90. ( http://www.grisda.org/origins/19087.htm - Editor)
Back to reference to this book review .

Brown, Walter T., Jr., 1989. In The Beginning..., Arizona, Center for Scientific Creation. 122 pp.
Back to Helium , Magnetic decay , Moon dust , or Metals in oceans .

Brush, Steven G., 1982, "Finding the age of the Earth by physics or by faith?" in Journal of Geological Education 30, pp. 34-58.
Back to reference to this work .

Dalrymple, G. Brent, 1991. The Age of the Earth, California, Stanford University Press. 474 pp. ISBN 0-8047-1569-6
Back to meteorites (oldest or multiple dating methods ) or further reading .

Dalrymple, G. Brent, 1986. Radiometric Dating, Geologic Time, And The Age Of The Earth: A Reply To "Scientific" Creationism, U.S. Geological Survey Open-File Report 86-110. 76 pp.
Back to model lead age , multiple dating methods , or further reading .

Dalrymple, G. Brent, 1984. "How Old Is the Earth? A Reply to ``Scientific Creationism''", in Proceedings of the 63rd Annual Meeting of the Pacific Division, AAAS 1, Part 3, California, AAAS. pp. 66-131. [Editor's note (January 12, 2006): This article is now online at ]http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/dalrymple/how_old_earth.html.]
Back to Helium , Magnetic decay , Moon dust , or further reading .

Emery, G. T., 1972. "Perturbation of nuclear decay rates" in Annual Reviews of Nuclear Science 22 , pp. 165-202.
Back to reference to this work .

Faure, Gunter, 1986. Principles of Isotope Geology 2nd edition, New York, John Wiley & Sons. 589 pp. ISBN 0-471-86412-9
Back to isochron dating , or further reading .

Humphreys, D. Russell, 1988. "Has the Earth's magnetic field ever flipped?" in Creation Research Society Quarterly 25, No. 3, pp. 130-137.
Back to reference to this work .

Jackson, Wayne, 1989. Creation, Evolution, and the Age of the Earth, California, Courier Publications. 57 pp.
Back to Magnetic decay or Moon dust .

Jansma, Sidney J., Jr., 1985. Six Days, Michigan, Jansma.
Back to Helium , Magnetic decay , or Moon dust .

Morris, Henry, and Gary Parker, 1987. What is Creation Science?, California, Master Books. 336 pp. ISBN 0-89051-081-4
Back to reference to this work .

Morris, Henry, 1974. Scientific Creationism, California, Creation- Life Publishers. 217 pp. ISBN 0-89051-001-6
Back to Helium , Magnetic decay , Moon dust , or Metals in oceans .

Murthy, V. R., and C. C. Patterson, 1962. "Primary isochron of zero age for meteorites and the Earth" in Journal of Geophysical Research 67, p. 1161.
Back to reference to this work .

Newman, Robert C., and Herman J. Eckelmann, Jr., 1977. Genesis One and the Origin of the Earth , Pennsylvania, IBRI. 154 pp. ISBN 0-944788-97-1
Back to reference to this work .

Sisterna, P., and H. Vucetich, 1990. "Time variation of fundamental constants: Bounds from geophysical and astronomical data" in Physical Review D (Particles and Fields) 41, no. 4, pp. 1034-1046.
Back to reference to this work .

Snelling, Andrew A., and David E. Rush, 1993. "Moon Dust and the Age of the Solar System" in Creation Ex Nihilo Technical Journal 7, No. 1, pp. 2-42. http://www.answersingenesis.org/tj/v7/i1/moondust.asp
Back to reference to this work .

Stoner, Don, 1992. A New Look at an Old Earth: What the Creation Institutes Are Not Telling You about Genesis, California, Schroeder Publishing. 192 pp. ISBN 1-881446-00-X.
Back to reference to this work .

Strahler, Arthur N., 1987. Science and Earth History: The Creation/Evolution Controversy , New York, Prometheus. 552 pp. ISBN 0-87975-414-1
Back to Magnetic decay , Moon dust , or further reading .

Whitcomb, John C., and Henry M. Morris, 1961. The Genesis Flood, New Jersey, Presbyterian and Reformed Publishing Company. 518 pp. ISBN 0-87552-338-2
Back to Helium or Moon dust .

Wonderly, Daniel E., 1987. Neglect of Geologic Data: Sedimentary Strata Compared with Young-Earth Creationist Writings, Pennsylvania, IBRI. 130 pp. ISBN 0-944788-00-9
Back to reference to this work .

Wonderly, Daniel E., 1981. Coral Reefs and Related Carbonate Structures as Indicators of Great Age, Pennsylvania, IBRI. 19 pp.
Back to reference to this work .

Wonderly, Daniel E., 1977. God's Time-Records in Ancient Sediments, Michigan, Crystal Press. 258 pp. ISBN 0-930402-01-4
Back to reference to this work .

Wysong, R. L., 1976. The Creation-Evolution Controversy, Michigan, Inquiry Press. 455 pp. ISBN 0-918112-01-X
Back to Helium , Magnetic decay , Moon dust , or Metals in oceans .

York, D., and R. M. Farquhar, 1972. The Earth's Age and Geochronology, Oxford: Pergamon Press, 178 pp.
Back to reference to this work .

Young, Davis A., 1982. Christianity and the Age of the Earth, California, Artisan. 188 pp. ISBN 0-934666-27-X
Back to reference to this work .

Now that's funny, i dont care who you are.

 

[Revlis]

woohooO! page 8! How long did our last "discussion" go? 20 pages or so? I know A6 expanding the size picking apart every line of text...

WHERE ARE YOU A6? ? ? He had many interesting positions on all this too

Didn't "Hey Rev" last over 40 pages?

You going to get in here? Or are ya just going to do a drive by?

And where the hell ya been?

 

[DrBoom]

For all of the people who are religious, more power to you. If the thought that something is out there guiding us along the way, and needing the help and strength to get you through the day, hey whatever it takes. Myself am very skeptical, to many versions, religions. Where is god today and if he is real and there are so many disbelievers why don't he/she/it whatever prove itself? Hey I may be wrong and when that day comes I guess we will all know. I just hope that if he is real that he will have the understanding of my thoughts and beliefs.


I think Megadeth said it best.

Kill one you are a murderer
kill many you are a conquerer
kill them all your a god.

 

[warwgn]

THE BIBLE IS A BOOK!!!!  A work written and RE-written by man.

That is all.  Eventually you have to deal with the fact that the book was written by humans, humans have their own agenda's.

Rev, this is a good point that I want to comment on because so many people feel this way. First, I agree with what you said. Men did "pen" the Bible, but God "wrote" it. From a Christian's view, the Bible was written by God, through the hands of men, to convey God's message about life. We believe that the Holy Spirit guided their compilation of the Bible, starting with the 1611 King James Bible.

Why did God do it this way? Why the 1611 Bible? I won't know the answers until I meet God.

P.

the actual old testament is belived to have been written before Jesus ever walked the earth.

number 1 link

number 2 link

just a small snipet:
"Around 1000 to 950 BC - The tribes are united under King David. Many of the stories are written down by the author J. These stories describe the creation of the universe, the birth and history of the tribes and their special relationship with God. The stories have an intense focus on morality, on examples of behavior, reward and punishment. Even the ancestral heroes are depicted as having human faults and weaknesses.

920 BC to 722 BC - following the death of Solomon (around 920 BC), the kingdom splits in two, Judah in the south with the royal capital at Jerusalem, and Israel/Ephraim in the north with major shrines at Shechem and Bethel. The J-stories primarily reflect the Davidic (southern) point of view. In the north, some stories begin to accumulate twists reflecting the political situation there. The stories from the south stress the importance of Jerusalem, Aaron and the priesthood, and the centralization of sacrifice. Those from the north are about sacrifices conducted anywhere and de-emphasize Aaron in favor of Moses."


Now of course this means Jesus as a real man had time to read and study the bible before his rise to son of god"so to speak" that opens a whole new can of worms for me.

 

[Postal]

THE BIBLE IS A BOOK!!!!  A work written and RE-written by man.

That is all.  Eventually you have to deal with the fact that the book was written by humans, humans have their own agenda's.

Rev, this is a good point that I want to comment on because so many people feel this way. First, I agree with what you said. Men did "pen" the Bible, but God "wrote" it. From a Christian's view, the Bible was written by God, through the hands of men, to convey God's message about life. We believe that the Holy Spirit guided their compilation of the Bible, starting with the 1611 King James Bible.

Why did God do it this way? Why the 1611 Bible? I won't know the answers until I meet God.

P.

the actual old testament is belived to have been written before Jesus ever walked the earth.

number 1 link

number 2 link

just a small snipet:
"Around 1000 to 950 BC - The tribes are united under King David. Many of the stories are written down by the author J. These stories describe the creation of the universe, the birth and history of the tribes and their special relationship with God. The stories have an intense focus on morality, on examples of behavior, reward and punishment. Even the ancestral heroes are depicted as having human faults and weaknesses.

920 BC to 722 BC - following the death of Solomon (around 920 BC), the kingdom splits in two, Judah in the south with the royal capital at Jerusalem, and Israel/Ephraim in the north with major shrines at Shechem and Bethel. The J-stories primarily reflect the Davidic (southern) point of view. In the north, some stories begin to accumulate twists reflecting the political situation there. The stories from the south stress the importance of Jerusalem, Aaron and the priesthood, and the centralization of sacrifice. Those from the north are about sacrifices conducted anywhere and de-emphasize Aaron in favor of Moses."


Now of course this means Jesus as a real man had time to read and study the bible before his rise to son of god"so to speak" that opens a whole new can of worms for me.

You are close.... :-)

The Bible as we know it today did not exist until 1611. Jesus had the early books of the Old Testament, probably in scroll form. Those were the holy books of the Jews, the Tora. These scrolls were present in the temple and were moved with various kings, and some believe they were kept in the Arc of the Covenant. The Holy Bible of 1611, and our Holy Bible of today, was compiled from ancient manuscripts that were cannonized into today's Bible. We believe this compilation and cannonization was done under the divine guidance of God Himself through His Holy Spirit.

Now, here is something that will mess with your head; Jesus existed from the very beginning as part of the Holy Trinity, God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit, one God existing in three persons, according to the Bible. Yet he wasn't born on this earth until about 2000 years ago. But, his birth was foretold in Old Testament prophecy thousands of years before his time.

Some answers we won't get until Heaven.

P.



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[warwgn]

Now look where this has led me: trying to find jesus???

Jesus allegedly had crowds of thousands follow him around. Once he fed 5000 people with only a few loaves of bread and a couple of fish (Mark 6:39-44). Later he repeated the miracle again feeding a crowd of 4000 people (Mark 8:1-9). Jesus cured sick people miraculously and raised people from the dead. He changed water into wine at a wedding reception. He exorcised demons. He commanded 2000 pigs to rush into a lake and drown themselves, inciting the people of the nearby town and countryside, who asked him to leave. (No mention is made of what happened to the poor pig hearder whose livelihood must have been ruined. Mark 5:1-20).

Wherever Jesus went a crowd gathered and wondered in amazement who this person was. Jesus was a very controversial person. Finally he got himself into so much trouble that huge crowds of Jews demanded his execution. There was a controversial trial followed by his public execution. Three days later he is seen walking around alive again. And no one wrote any of this down when it allegedly happened?

Even the earliest full account of Jesus in the Bible, the Gospel of Mark, is admitted by the Catholic Church to date to at least A.D. 70, a full 40 years after Jesus' alleged death and resurrection. (Mark makes reference to an event that happened around A.D. 70, so it could not have been written any earlier. Modern scholars now date the Gospels as being written near A.D. 170, a full 140 years after the alleged event, since no one makes any reference to a Gospel of Mark, or any other Gospel, prior to this time.)

It's inconceivable that no one at the time bothered to write down anything about the most important person in the whole of human history. Writing was common back then. People wrote letters. Historians wrote commentaries on current events. The Romans wrote and kept legal documents about trials. It's considered one of the best documented periods of history. Yet no one wrote anything about this Jesus; no one painted a portrait of this Jesus; no one drew a sketch of this Jesus; no one cast a coin depicting this Jesus; no one made a statue of this Jesus; no one makes any reference whatsoever to this Jesus. The historical evidence is overwhelming—the Jesus of the Bible never existed.

 

[dudewizr]

THE BIBLE IS A BOOK!!!!  A work written and RE-written by man.

That is all.  Eventually you have to deal with the fact that the book was written by humans, humans have their own agenda's.

Rev, this is a good point that I want to comment on because so many people feel this way. First, I agree with what you said. Men did "pen" the Bible, but God "wrote" it. From a Christian's view, the Bible was written by God, through the hands of men, to convey God's message about life. We believe that the Holy Spirit guided their compilation of the Bible, starting with the 1611 King James Bible.

Why did God do it this way? Why the 1611 Bible? I won't know the answers until I meet God.

P.

the actual old testament is belived to have been written before Jesus ever walked the earth.

number 1 link

number 2 link

just a small snipet:
"Around 1000 to 950 BC - The tribes are united under King David. Many of the stories are written down by the author J. These stories describe the creation of the universe, the birth and history of the tribes and their special relationship with God. The stories have an intense focus on morality, on examples of behavior, reward and punishment. Even the ancestral heroes are depicted as having human faults and weaknesses.

920 BC to 722 BC - following the death of Solomon (around 920 BC), the kingdom splits in two, Judah in the south with the royal capital at Jerusalem, and Israel/Ephraim in the north with major shrines at Shechem and Bethel. The J-stories primarily reflect the Davidic (southern) point of view. In the north, some stories begin to accumulate twists reflecting the political situation there. The stories from the south stress the importance of Jerusalem, Aaron and the priesthood, and the centralization of sacrifice. Those from the north are about sacrifices conducted anywhere and de-emphasize Aaron in favor of Moses."


Now of course this means Jesus as a real man had time to read and study the bible before his rise to son of god"so to speak" that opens a whole new can of worms for me.

So according to your thinking, Jesus took the Old Testament studied it verse for verse. Lived his life with the sole purpose of fullfilling the Old Testament prophecies to pull of his gimic. And as a finale he suffered one of the most painful tortures one could imagine (now keep in mind all he had to do was say to Pilot "hey guys I was just joking I'm not really the son of God" and he would have been spared) and gave up his life just to pull off the greatest scam ever recorded. So if that's your claim why did he do it? Where did he use the things that support your conspiracy theory? the money, power, etc..

You have to qualify Christ as lord, liar or lunatic. I'm sure many of you have studied this question. I attended a debate between alocal pastor and the president of the Ohio state atheist organization and after all the debates fo science, creation, evolution, intelligent design, blah blah blah. When confronted with the lord, liar or lunatic question by a 19 year old girl, the atheist said "no comment".

I am sure he had heard this case presented before and knew it to be one he could not prevail, so he quit. I guess better to keep your mouth shut and thought a fool than to open it and remove all uncertainty.

 

[warwgn]

Actually I dont think jesus was a real person at all see the above post.

 

[dudewizr]

Actually I dont think jesus was a real person at all see the above post.

That's too bad. So how do you explain our dating system being this is 2006 A.D. and the whole B.C. thing. That was one great scam pulled off by a bunch of sheepherding, tax collecting, power hungry money loving fools.


Now the dancing banana is starting to make sense.
<-------------------

 

[warwgn]

Actually I dont think jesus was a real person at all see the above post.

That's too bad.  So how do you explain our dating system being this is 2006 A.D.  and the whole B.C. thing.  That was one great scam pulled off by a bunch of sheepherding, tax collecting, power hungry money loving fools.

well duh the church made the calendar as we know it!!

Before today's Gegorian calendar was adopted, the older Julian calendar was used. It was admirably close to the actual length of the year, as it turns out, but the Julian calendar was not so perfect that it didn't slowly shift off track over the following centuries. But, hundreds of years later, monks were the only ones with any free time for scholarly pursuits -- and they were discouraged from thinking about the matter of "secular time" for any reason beyond figuring out when to observe Easter. In the Middle Ages, the study of the measure of time was first viewed as prying too deeply into God's own affairs -- and later thought of as a lowly, mechanical study, unworthy of serious contemplation.

As a result, it wasn't until 1582, by which time Caesar's calendar had drifted a full 10 days off course, that Pope Gregory finally reformed the Julian calendar. Ironically, by the time the Catholic church buckled under the weight of the scientific reasoning that pointed out the error, it had lost much of its power to implement the fix. Protestant tract writers responded to Gregory's calendar by calling him the "Roman Antichrist" and claiming that its real purpose was to keep true Christians from worshiping on the correct days. The "new" calendar, as we know it today, was not adopted uniformly across Europe until well into the 18th century.


Yeah that really proves jesus was real

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[WWJD]

I think Megadeth said it best.

yeah, someone named "MEGADEATH" probably has GREAT philosophys for living! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

 

[WWJD]

warwagn, why do you put so much mental time and energy into disproving something? what does that do for you? you seem to know an AWFUL LOT about something you don't believe in.

If I don't believe in something, [say like Megadeth], I don't bother with it at all or it would bring me down

Don't get me wrong you are doing a GREAT job of defending your opinion, but what is your background in all this?



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[warwgn]

I think Megadeth said it best.

yeah, someone named "MEGADEATH" probably has GREAT philosophys for living!  HAHAHAHAHAHAHA  

now thats funny

when your right your right

 

[dudewizr]

Actually I dont think jesus was a real person at all see the above post.

That's too bad.  So how do you explain our dating system being this is 2006 A.D.  and the whole B.C. thing.  That was one great scam pulled off by a bunch of sheepherding, tax collecting, power hungry money loving fools.

well duh the church made the calendar as we know it!!

Before today's Gegorian calendar was adopted, the older Julian calendar was used. It was admirably close to the actual length of the year, as it turns out, but the Julian calendar was not so perfect that it didn't slowly shift off track over the following centuries. But, hundreds of years later, monks were the only ones with any free time for scholarly pursuits -- and they were discouraged from thinking about the matter of "secular time" for any reason beyond figuring out when to observe Easter. In the Middle Ages, the study of the measure of time was first viewed as prying too deeply into God's own affairs -- and later thought of as a lowly, mechanical study, unworthy of serious contemplation.

As a result, it wasn't until 1582, by which time Caesar's calendar had drifted a full 10 days off course, that Pope Gregory finally reformed the Julian calendar. Ironically, by the time the Catholic church buckled under the weight of the scientific reasoning that pointed out the error, it had lost much of its power to implement the fix. Protestant tract writers responded to Gregory's calendar by calling him the "Roman Antichrist" and claiming that its real purpose was to keep true Christians from worshiping on the correct days. The "new" calendar, as we know it today, was not adopted uniformly across Europe until well into the 18th century.


Yeah that really proves jesus was real

You're agrguing the point of a few days here and there. I'm speaking of the seperation between BC and AD why the need or for that matter what caused time to be split in two? The life of Christ. So why would scholars and scientists put up with time being dated around a fictional character? Speaking of wether someone existed or not, how do we know that Columbus stepped foot on America and that Abe Lincoln actually gave the Gettysburg Address? I think it's called eyewitness accounts. 512 people saw Christ after the resurrection, but because CNN wasn't there to report on it I guess it didn't happen.