Chris Moore has the first gen 3 turbo.

[TonyM995]

You would have to test to verify. I havent down anything motorwise other than exhaust and tune. I am patiently waiting on stacks and filter will be very soon.

Same here! I’m just trying to learn as I go. Anytime I have a question the first place I look is the service manual. That’s what I did earlier. I’m pretty sure that’s where the map will be connected but I’ll find out when I get there. A large majority of questions can be answered by the service manual, more people should download a free copy.

We can all think through this puzzle even if we haven’t done a build yet. I’m certainly ready to continue sharing what I’ve learned from EFI University and will also share what I learn at Fueltech at the end of the month.

 

[sportbikeryder]

It looks like these vacuum lines terminate at the IAP sensor. I haven’t gotten far enough in my install to figure out where to plumb the MAP sensor to but I’m guessing it will be to that vacuum line. Is that correct?

Those ports are where you will want to plumb a MAP sensor. The OEM "IAP" sensor is essentially the same thing. It uses a baro pressure sensor in conjunction to give "realtime" MAP. Many standalone ECU's dont use a separate baro sensor and instead measure and store rge MAP sensor value as a baro reference at power on.

If you are street riding and have lots of elevation change, adding an actual baro sensor isnt a bad idea, but most do not use one.

John

 

[TonyM995]

Sure....it will still be spinning and making pressure above the throttle blade. My comment was regarding the statement that the pressure was measured after the theottle blade, making "boost" but no flow. That is the part that doesn't make sense.

The purpose of the theottle blade is to throttle the flow...by creating pressure drop across it. I don't see how you would possibly still measure the same pressure post throttle blade.

I want to say I do not like how TTS is tuning their bike. Sure it seems to work for him but why not put a larger pulley on for less boost?

Making boost but no flow makes sense to me because he said the throttle blade was limited to 30*, so it’s open and allowing some flow which will show up as boost on the map sensor.

With electricity and voltage they relate it to a pressurized water pipe. The pipe can be pressurized but if you only open the valve 30 percent it will only flow so much water.

 

[jellyrug]

Live stream 3 days ago stating 22 psi and 500 hp. Screenshot below.

A day later video posted with all caps “600 HP ON THE STREET”. Chill with the caps and now it’s automagically making 600??

Where did the extra 100 hp come from?

If TTS did that people would lose their mind.

I’ll ask Chris Moore or anyone else to their face where did the extra numbers come from.
View attachment 1662230

LIVE WITH CHRIS AND KOUNTRY!

Get your ECU Flashed by me.Call me at 864-608-0119 or https://www.mooremafia.com/ecu-flashing-serviceMoore Mafia Drag Racing School https://www.mooremafia.c...

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A 20% difference is a bit wild.

Just for information, I use to do this for a living with Mercedes Benz when I was still young and pretty.

If we compared hp during motor development, it was always at the crankshaft in a room with controlled temperature and humidity, so the results were accurate.

Rear wheel dyno's were used outside of the factory design testing department ONLY for tuning, never to rely on hp readings.

Rear wheel dyno's are not accurate, see link below, there are simply way too many variables.

If the strap holding the bike on the dyno is not tensioned precisely from one run to another, the amount of wheel spin and friction loss alone will give big reading variations. So will tire temperature, length of run, etc. When measuring 500hp from a tiny bike tire to two rotating drums, those readings are pretty much out of control from a statistical view point.

Here's Why You Shouldn't Trust Dyno Numbers

Dynamometers are good for tuning, but for power readings, it's hard to judge what's actually correct.

www.roadandtrack.com

 

[TonyM995]

HTP just released a video on their drive by wire throttle bodies and mentioned using it to control power. That’s what TTS is doing.

I’m also noticing they have a Protec fuel pump on that bike which costs $1,000.

So again I’m not an expert but do want to figure things out for myself because I’m not paying a shop to build or tune my bike. I’ll pay to have the motor built eventually.

 

[sixpack577]

HTP just released a video on their drive by wire throttle bodies and mentioned using it to control power. That’s what TTS is doing.

I’m also noticing they have a Protec fuel pump on that bike which costs $1,000.

So again I’m not an expert but do want to figure things out for myself because I’m not paying a shop to build or tune my bike. I’ll pay to have the motor built eventually.

Why would you do everything else, but not build the engine?
Once you know what parts you will be using, the rest is just assembly and measuring...that is the easy part.

 

[TonyM995]

Why would you do everything else, but not build the engine?
Once you know what parts you will be using, the rest is just assembly and measuring...that is the easy part.

I’m going to start with a base spacer, head gasket, and studs. Basically the same stuff TTS sells with their kits. That’s not really a built engine in my mind and it seems 320 whp would be safe with those mods.

I’ll get my get wet with that for a year before sending the motor to a machine shop like HTP or Carpenter. Then I can shoot for 400+ when the chassis is sorted out.

 

[sixpack577]

I’m going to start with a base spacer, head gasket, and studs. Basically the same stuff TTS sells with their kits. That’s not really a built engine in my mind and it seems 320 whp would be safe with those mods.

I’ll get my get wet with that for a year before sending the motor to a machine shop like HTP or Carpenter. Then I can shoot for 400+ when the chassis is sorted out.

Yeah, but the power is in their parts and the right combination.
You could just buy them, send whatever for machining, and save the labor cost of assembly.

 

[sportbikeryder]

I want to say I do not like how TTS is tuning their bike. Sure it seems to work for him but why not put a larger pulley on for less boost?

Making boost but no flow makes sense to me because he said the throttle blade was limited to 30*, so it’s open and allowing some flow which will show up as boost on the map sensor.

With electricity and voltage they relate it to a pressurized water pipe. The pipe can be pressurized but if you only open the valve 30 percent it will only flow so much water.

View attachment 1662975

Sure, the flow can be throttled with a valve....but measure the pressure after the valve and I assure you it won't be the same pressure. The pressure drop across the valve is what is limiting the flow.

 

[sportbikeryder]

HTP just released a video on their drive by wire throttle bodies and mentioned using it to control power. That’s what TTS is doing.

I’m also noticing they have a Protec fuel pump on that bike which costs $1,000.

So again I’m not an expert but do want to figure things out for myself because I’m not paying a shop to build or tune my bike. I’ll pay to have the motor built eventually.

If using gasoline, an AEM 380lph (or 400lph, whichever you want to call it) is plenty of pump for this application. If using alcohol, then probably not.

 

[Dnyce]

I’m going to start with a base spacer, head gasket, and studs. Basically the same stuff TTS sells with their kits. That’s not really a built engine in my mind and it seems 320 whp would be safe with those mods.

I’ll get my get wet with that for a year before sending the motor to a machine shop like HTP or Carpenter. Then I can shoot for 400+ when the chassis is sorted out.

You’re knee deep in it already, Just add +1mm ex valves and porting to your starting point. May never need to send it out after that.

 

[TonyM995]

Sure, the flow can be throttled with a valve....but measure the pressure after the valve and I assure you it won't be the same pressure. The pressure drop across the valve is what is limiting the flow.

Hey John! I don’t think he ever said the pressure would be the same before and after the throttle blade. He’s only measuring boost pressure from the stock location.

He stated “We have tested the intercooler with sensors at the air filter, supercharger inlet and at the head port and it runs surprisingly cool.”

I read those to be air temperature sensors to watch the change in air temperature from intake to cylinder.

Were you thinking he was measuring boost in those locations?

 

[sportbikeryder]

Hey John! I don’t think he ever said the pressure would be the same before and after the throttle blade. He’s only measuring boost pressure from the stock location.

He stated “We have tested the intercooler with sensors at the air filter, supercharger inlet and at the head port and it runs surprisingly cool.”

I read those to be air temperature sensors to watch the change in air temperature from intake to cylinder.

Were you thinking he was measuring boost in those locations?

Perhaps I read it incorrectly. I was under the impression that this was measured after the throttle plate.

By the way, an effective means of boost control.osnise of a throttle pate on the Inlet of a supercharger. The compressor worked on a pressure ratio principle and lowering the Inlet pressure also lowers the outlet. Eric Paquette used this very effectively to modulate power on his Supercharged Prostreet builds.

 

[TonyM995]

You’re knee deep in it already, Just add +1mm ex valves and porting to your starting point. May never need to send it out after that.

Balls deep and I will bust nuts. Hahaha. I’m not sure I want to start with this work though. It seems safer to do after a year of riding. So many seem to not tune good and damage valves. My goal is to not do that but anything could happen.

Would you trust a local race car shop to do it?

Moto garage builds Moto America bikes so he may be able to help. They are the only shop in the area I’d let touch my bike.

Services

Moto Garage is a national championship motorcycle building facility, having built bikes and engines for teams winning DMG/AMA and Moto America national championships. We currently offer: Professional Engine building Dyno Tuning Full electronic and data services suspension services Chassis set...

moto-garage.com

 

[smithabusa]

Balls deep and I will bust nuts. Hahaha. I’m not sure I want to start with this work though. It seems safer to do after a year of riding. So many seem to not tune good and damage valves. My goal is to not do that but anything could happen.

Would you trust a local race car shop to do it?

Moto garage builds Moto America bikes so he may be able to help. They are the only shop in the area I’d let touch my bike.

Services

Moto Garage is a national championship motorcycle building facility, having built bikes and engines for teams winning DMG/AMA and Moto America national championships. We currently offer: Professional Engine building Dyno Tuning Full electronic and data services suspension services Chassis set...

moto-garage.com

Me personally maybe consider replqce valves and go heavier spring ls but porting and oversize valves etc I dunno

My 2000 made 461 at the tire a million years ago with stock pistons, good rods, head studs, 65 lb valve springs, adjustable cam.sprocket on intake, and .080 spacer.

 

[Dnyce]

A head is a head, those valves and pistons don’t know they in a bike or a car engine. I’d trust a good race car shop to put +1 bigger valves

But if u just take the head off and send it out anywhere, it’s easier than sending the whole motor, and u only have to build it once, that was really my point.

 

[Bumblebee]

 

[greg3852]

This is how you sell stuff right here. They are going to have turbo Busas selling like hot cakes if the price is obtainable. God I can’t wait to ride mine. Now I need a 2 step. Lol

 

[SS4Luck]

This is how you sell stuff right here. They are going to have turbo Busas selling like hot cakes if the price is obtainable. God I can’t wait to ride mine. Now I need a 2 step. Lol

There’s no way the price will be obtainable. EJR/Boosted Catfish/Magic Mike were talking about it on the podcast last week and they figure $75k+ plus the cost of the motorcycle.

 

[greg3852]

There’s no way the price will be obtainable. EJR/Boosted Catfish/Magic Mike were talking about it on the podcast last week and they figure $75k+ plus the cost of the motorcycle.

I would imagine there would be different options and levels but maybe not. I think it could be done cheaper.