Red05
Donating Member
Well put. Taking guns away from honest people is not an option. Neither is shrugging and saying oh well.
School shootings
- Thread starter busabobh
- Start date
mark3evo
Registered
Watch this video senator - he cannot answer and even says America is the most safest 
Starts blaming the reporter
news.sky.com
Starts blaming the reporter
Texas school shooting: Sky News asks Senator Ted Cruz about gun control after Uvalde vigil
19 children and two teachers were killed in primary school shooting in Texas.
CBXRider
Donating Member
Your following response makes no sense. As the post stated that you replied to, it’s (cheaper) to educate than to imprison so it (isn’t) ”probably cheaper to build prisons and house prisoners.”
“Probably cheaper to build prisons and house prisoners.”
michael parris heuberger
Registered
Hi. To start train teachers parents and volunteers to stand guard in side and outside of schools. This would all have to be worked out with police and government. Fat chance that any common sense will come it. I just heard that the shooter was in the school for 45 min to 1hr. They could not get police in the school to stop him?????? If someone or more than 1 person could of had a better chance of stopping him.
Bumblebee
Donating Member
I just read yet another anti-gun lobby group here in Canada is seeking to ban all hand guns and any semi auto long gun...
The same article went on to talk about the flood of illegal weapons flowing across the border from the US...it's almost an oxymoron to ban legal weapons yet all the weapons which have been used in crimes are illegally obtained ones.
We already have a very robust gun control system in place and to own a handgun means it comes with many responsibilities that people are currently following.
It's starting to become a really crappy era to be alive in...
From what I heard some officer even went in and took out their own children. Something very weird was going on. Sad to see the lack of engagement to this hostile situation.
Y
Gun control in Canada is stupid. Never understood it. As if the handgun is the be all of weapons system. Most people can't hit the broad side of a barn with a handgun. I'm afraid of the guy with the rifle. Everyone fears the handgun. Culture of handgun fear and loathing.
Bumblebee
Donating Member
I think it's because the handgun is so concealable people are afraid of maybe not the actual platform but it's ready availability...
Here in Canada we already have a very, very controlled approach to weapons and especially hand guns, so much so I just don't get the approach these lobby groups take other than they are completely ignorant of facts and statistics.
JeffSyh
Registered
@WuzzaCBXRider it is cheaper to educate then it is for prisons and prisoners, I thought they were roughly the same if not education more. It's roughly $15,000 a year for a student and around $14,000-$70,000 for an inmate.
Bumblebee
Donating Member
While talking to a guy I know that was an ERT member with the police, he said probably the only way to avoid these situations is to approach schools like prisons where there are controlled access points to enter the facility, perimeter fences and everyone is subject to search and metal/explosive detectors are used.
I mentioned these would be extremely expensive whereas he said how expensive is a human life and what's the worth of the 21 innocent people killed in Texas?
Schools are large and there are lots of moving people everywhere, it would be awful difficult to patrol everywhere especially with a maverick active shooter on the loose.
I mentioned these would be extremely expensive whereas he said how expensive is a human life and what's the worth of the 21 innocent people killed in Texas?
Schools are large and there are lots of moving people everywhere, it would be awful difficult to patrol everywhere especially with a maverick active shooter on the loose.
TallTom
Registered
They are also actively discussing training and arming teachers. Which for good reason was rejected by the teachers union.
There is also some pretty good new technology that is a floor mounted barricade system. It's activated by any one person hitting a panic button and it deploys out of the floor against a fortified door and makes it pretty much impossible to enter that room at that point. Think those deployed car barriers that prevent a car from entering. Same idea, adapted to this application.
It pisses me off that we have to actually makes these types of decisions for kids at school.
Bumblebee
Donating Member
It's a sad thing to have to find ways to protect children at school which is supposed to be a safe haven.
It's even more sad that shooters will find ways to circumvent whatever is put in place....catch kids between class in the hallways or catching buses...
The solution will be a real challenge.
Arm the children. A room full of 8 year old with bullpups will dissuade any shooter
MonkeyButtRides
Registered
They will end up just shooting each other...."that's my juice pop"....."sponge bob isn't gay...."
Dnyce
Donating Member
In this last case, it appears simply a locked door would’ve helped. Video I saw, the guy just walked in. Gun in full view, walked right in.
For the Hs students shooting up their own schools, how many times would a metal detector have stopped them? There’s a metal detector in every school in the ghetto, been that way since the 90’s and no one cared. Federal buildings, metal detector. Decent neighborhood or higher, no metal detector, and all schools are gun free zones so anybody intending on shooting one up knows they will be met with little to no resistance.
Kids today are so fucked up between being raised on tiktok/youtube/instagram and having their parents also on the same poop, if guns were banned tomorrow and they all magically disappeared, the next school tragedy would be a pipe bomb built off internet plans instead of a shooting. Guns aren’t the problem. Imo.
For the Hs students shooting up their own schools, how many times would a metal detector have stopped them? There’s a metal detector in every school in the ghetto, been that way since the 90’s and no one cared. Federal buildings, metal detector. Decent neighborhood or higher, no metal detector, and all schools are gun free zones so anybody intending on shooting one up knows they will be met with little to no resistance.
Kids today are so fucked up between being raised on tiktok/youtube/instagram and having their parents also on the same poop, if guns were banned tomorrow and they all magically disappeared, the next school tragedy would be a pipe bomb built off internet plans instead of a shooting. Guns aren’t the problem. Imo.
Mythos
Registered
Identifying and correcting students that potentially might present a risk are all we need in terms of education. That's already supposed to be happening. I don't know how seriously it's taken. It's very easy to identify the children who might go off someday. Fortunately, very few of them actually stage an attack on the school. In the tiny school I have been in for the past four years, I could point out at least two kids who might have carried out a mass attack. I did my best to have a close relationship with both and make sure they were a part of school. It depends a lot on if the child chooses you as a teacher any kid will glom onto some staff member. If that's what it takes build some kind of social connection at school for those students, then that's what should happen. Who can't see a socially disconnected individual in a highly social environment? It's easy to see but correcting it is a lot of work. I think it's the work that should be addressed first though.
Because a lot of people are afraid to become a police officer now.
I don't want depend on someone else with a gun to come and save me because they're probably thinking of their own life first just like I probably would. I need to be armed myself for my own protection but that also automatically protects those around me. If a person is not right there in the moment, they're not so likely to take the role of hero. In many cases, heroic acts are done because there is no other choice. ...thus you have most heroes telling you not to call them a hero. In a lot of cases, they were doing what they had to do. Still a hero in my book but the highest level of hero is the one who risks his or her life for others when they could have chosen not to. I don't know how many people actually have that in them regardless of the situation. I guess nobody knows until they're in that kind of a situation.
I was at a school in Milwaukee where they metal detected occasionally. It took two hours to do everyone who came into the school. That's why they only did it occasionally.
I think some teachers (including myself) would want to have the option to be armed in case of emergency. Many teachers do not want to be police officers. Given the trouble that police officers have gotten into for using deadly force recently, I can see why. ...but if it's a question of my own life v being defenseless, I guess I'll accept losing my career and facing legal charges instead of dying. It would save a lot of other lives too but I must admit, I really want that gun to keep myself alive.
As for barricade systems, Tom, that's not going to happen any time soon. We never even got the expandable barricade bars and those wouldn't work anyway if there is a hallway window into the classroom. We don't even have up to date computer technology for the students. Both parking lots were repaved though. Go figure.
Bumblebee
Donating Member
No, guns aren't the problem but they are a catalyst...
There have been lock-key kids, video games and poor parenting for many years but without guns, mass shootings by kids are a challenge to conduct.
Gun control would have done nothing in this case as the 18yr old who legally bought it had no history or any mental illness and nothing to stop his purchase.
Locked doors and a primary entrance/exit source is a good start but there is always a work around for someone who intends harm, they could attack during gym class when the kids are outside or when the kids are released for the day and awaiting bus pick up...
The school my grand kids go to has it's doors locked and the only way to get in is to buzz the receptionist...I would think a kid going to this school could very easily conceal a firearm in a back pack and buzz in pretty simply as the receptionist would recognize the student.
It's a scary time.
Bumblebee
Donating Member
One thing about an active shooter in a school or mall or any large building which is occupied by many people is finding, isolating and eliminating the target.
We trained police ERTs and had actors (conventional military members dressed in civilian clothing) in the building (an old high school) and we followed the ERTs to evaluate them....the actors acted like school children and each classroom was locked down but it took time to breach, search each room and locate the shooter.
There are so many variables in these situations: kids getting caught outside classrooms impeding the search, more than one shooter, is the shooter hiding inside one of the locked classrooms with hostages...etc, etc....
We put the teams through almost impossible scenarios and each time they struggled...and these were seasoned, well trained teams who were prepared to go into this situation unlike many responders to actual events.
The team in Texas was effective in finding and eliminating the threat but are now coming under intense scrutiny...these people who are judging them should be on a team in training so they see how difficult this scenario is.
We trained police ERTs and had actors (conventional military members dressed in civilian clothing) in the building (an old high school) and we followed the ERTs to evaluate them....the actors acted like school children and each classroom was locked down but it took time to breach, search each room and locate the shooter.
There are so many variables in these situations: kids getting caught outside classrooms impeding the search, more than one shooter, is the shooter hiding inside one of the locked classrooms with hostages...etc, etc....
We put the teams through almost impossible scenarios and each time they struggled...and these were seasoned, well trained teams who were prepared to go into this situation unlike many responders to actual events.
The team in Texas was effective in finding and eliminating the threat but are now coming under intense scrutiny...these people who are judging them should be on a team in training so they see how difficult this scenario is.
Mythos
Registered
We had an active shooter drill earlier this year. It was not even specified if the drill was for a person inside the school or out. I closed the locked door and instructed everyone to get against the wall where they would be least open to gunfire. The principal came in because he was able to see a number of students through the hallway window. If there would have been someone shooting inside the school, hiding with the lights out in a room that has no way in or out except for the door where the shooter would be shooting from is ludicrous. If the drill was a shooter in the building, we should been practicing getting the heck out of the building while we have a chance. Some classrooms are a trap. If it's a drill, it should be practicing what you really would do. We were all ALICE trained and that's pretty much "do what you need to do on the spot to deal with the situation, don't sit and wait." So you see the contradictions? The procedures we have in place are better than nothing but they aren't taken seriously enough.
busabobh
Registered
I don’t know about Canada, but in the US 97% of all gun related murders is by hand guns.
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